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Thread: Newbi Prot Pally Lf some tips

  1. #1
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    Newbi Prot Pally Lf some tips

    Okay so heres my situation. I played holy for around five years and finally decide to try out prot. I am currently at 528 iLVL prot. Im specced Speed of Light, Repentence, Sacred Shield, Unbreakable Spirit, Sanctafied Wrath, and Lights hammer. I use Glyph of Divine Protection, Alabaster shield and avenging wrath. I had been, until last night, been gemming for stam/expertise on most of my pieces as almost all of my slots were red and i was using Eternal Flame. Last night i was told to gem all haste, despite the color slot, and to use Sacred Shield instead. Doing this i lost around 50k health and around 3 percent master but obviously my haste sky rocketed. Im currently sitting at 22.55 Perenct haste and 15.76 percent mastery.

    Now to my questions:
    Was switching to haste the correct thing to do?
    Why does it seem like i could tank/survive better with the way i had it before but everyone tells me haste is the best way to go?
    Does anyone have any tips in general for a new tank?

    Thanks for all the help!

    Afreyj

  2. #2
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    Yes.

    Personal Bias. sub optimal playstyle. Without logs it's just guessing.

    get something like tidyplates: threat plates to help you track aggro on multiple mobs, try to keep the boss still, and be predictable in your movement.
    Last edited by Tengenstein; 04-27-2014 at 01:04 PM.
    Harsh Words and Steel: A Protection Warrior Guide
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    Hunters, Just get a Sporebat, most LFRs will be missing that buff.

  3. #3
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    The only thing that they told you really wrong was to go for Sacred Shield. pre 5.4 Sacred Shield was the way to go. Eternal Flame is now better most of the time (there are still some fights where SS can be better, but much fewer).

    The reason that the old way might seem better is your stats look heftier, but the thing is, when played correctly, haste/Eternal Flame style is actually better. It does require a level of skill to play correctly though. If you are consistently having trouble staying alive using haste/eternal flame, then you really only have a couple options:
    1. Practice and get better
    2. Revert back to your old way. You'll have to take the comments people make, but if you can't manage the haste style build skill level, then the old way will be better for you. This applies to Eternal Flame as well. If you don't have the skillset to manage eternal Flame properly, then move back to sacred shield unless you are able to put i the time to make it better.

  4. #4
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    Dying often is most often a symptom of misplay of the rotation. You need to be hitting CS on cooldown, Judgement on cooldown (except the third J which is delayed by one GCD). You can't be sitting on 5 holy power with holy power generators off cooldown. If you don't have at least 40% ShoR uptime on average (taking the first 40 seconds of a fight with Sanctified Wrath talented doesn't count) you need to work on that.

  5. #5
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    Depends on what kind of content you are trying to tank as well. Are you trying to do normal mode SoO? Or flex? Or ToT H maybe? It wouldn't surprise me to die a bunch in normal SoO at that ilvl despite playing awesome.

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    Just kinda echoing what a few have said with a bit more in depth explanation, but basically when you're putting stam into your gear you artificially smooth your damage intake. In other words big hits don't seem as big against your HP, so healers are less likely to freak out/you're less likely to go from 100% to dead in what seems like less than a GCD. But when you do this healers are more likely to go OoM because you're still taking the damage. So, basically outside of any situation where you actually need the stam to survive a singular hit, all it is is a safety blanket that only really absorbs Mana.

    So why is haste better? Assuming you are making correct use of your GCD's it can drastically increase the up-time on your Shield of the Righteous (though the shorter cd's on your Holy Power builders). Which as I'm sure you can imagine would smooth your damage intake out quite a bit. And it also decreases the amount of time between your Eternal Flame/Sacred Shield ticks, which is also good. But once again, all of that is completely dependent on you being proficient at your rotation.
    But TLDR of that part: Haste build done correctly = smooth damage, mega self heals, and higher DPS.

    Now if you really do find that you can't get a handle on the Haste rotation, you can stack Mastery instead. This makes your ShotR "more effective" but with a lower up-time. So basically it can make your damage intake slightly more "spikey" than if you were good at the Haste build. And as any tank knows, spikey damage gets you in trouble with your healers. Also with a mastery build it becomes a lot harder to keep a good up-time on Eternal Flame.

    As to Eternal Flame (EF) VS Sacred Shield (SS). EF has the potential to be a lot stronger IF you are able to keep a good up-time on it. What I would call "good" would vary from fight to fight, since there are a few fights where I let it fall off while not actively tanking. That is pretty situational though and usually somewhat dependent on whether or not my vengeance has taken a nose dive yet or not.
    Basically though, you always want to refresh EF at 5 stacks of Bastion of Glory, since that gives it its' greatest potential. If you are unable to reach a 100% uptime (or anything close to that, nobody is perfect) under those circumstances, you can decide to use Divine Protection solely for covering gaps in EF, or sometimes just make the swap to Sacred Shield. If you get the T16 4 set bonus though, you should be able to just stick to EF 99% of the time.
    So, when is Sacred Shield actually better? If for whatever reason you find that you are just incapable of reaching a decent up-time on EF, SS can potentially provide you with smoother damage intake simply because it is easier to manage. Also, any time there is a mechanic that can and/or will challenge your entire health pool, sometimes you can easily counter just by switching to SS, as the absorb will provide you with a bit of a safety blanket without you having to make a gearing swap to stam.
    Also, prior to getting the T16 4 set which essentially makes refreshing EF free, there are fights where using 3 GCD's worth of HPow to refresh EF instead of hitting ShotR can potentially cause a drastic damage spike leading to your demise. That was actually an issue I ran into on Normal Garrosh progression.

    Huge wall of txt.... oh my. Hope that has at least a few helpful tidbits.
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    I dont think my response posted my interents all messed up right now lol. Anyways i havent been able to practice much due to work but does anyone have the haste rotation that they can write up for me to practcie? any tips for when to pop certain cooldowns? Thanks for all the help!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Afreyj View Post
    I dont think my response posted my interents all messed up right now lol. Anyways i havent been able to practice much due to work but does anyone have the haste rotation that they can write up for me to practcie? any tips for when to pop certain cooldowns? Thanks for all the help!
    It is the same as the non-haste rotation, just faster:

    CS J X CS X J CS X X - and then it repeats - CS J X CS X J CS X X - repeats again - CS J X CS X J CS X X

    X = AS, HW, Cons, HoW

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fetzie View Post
    X = AS, HW, Cons, HoW
    Or Sacred Shield IF you happen to be spec'd into that for whatever reason.
    Really, I don't know a lot about hunters and the only good advice I can give is: TURN PET TAUNT OFF! ~Aggathon

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gregasaurous View Post
    Or Sacred Shield IF you happen to be spec'd into that for whatever reason.
    Or a level 90 talent, which I also forgot.

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    Okay thanks again for all the help guys!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fetzie View Post
    Or a level 90 talent, which I also forgot.
    We obviously never actually forget about things around here. We just like to give each-other hidden tests!
    Really, I don't know a lot about hunters and the only good advice I can give is: TURN PET TAUNT OFF! ~Aggathon

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    Were you gemming exp to get exp capped? As I recall, and I've been healing virtually this whole xpac on my H Pally (my Prot OS is at 571 ilvl, what a waste) hit and exp cap were impt. Misses cost you HP, so it was hit 7.5 and exp 15, then haste. As a healer, I much prefer my Pally tank going Haste over Mastery, eliminates a lot of "oh shit" moments when he pays attention to survival over dps (EF is OP for Prot Pallies). In other words, I can pay attention to the raid over the tank at certain times, also the tank spreading around EF is a big help on fights like 10 H Spoils, Mantid side; the DoT sucks.

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