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Thread: Tank setups for Garrosh?

  1. #21
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    Teng --

    I think everyone was fairly burned out at that point - 14th attempt after 2.5 hours on the same boss can make most folks sloppy, and my co-tank is still a work in progress, to put it diplomatically. Over the course of the whole night, she's averaging in at 49.7% uptime on SD to my own 53%, factoring in some downtime due to being dead, and dodging 38% of all incoming Melee to my 42% (factor in being hit from behind while collecting fresh adds), so she's not too far behind me on avoidance. Worlds better when she was averaging 12% SD uptime on Horridon.

    That being said? Yeah, we could probably be doing better.

    As for the DPS cloak/LMG, this is the first time that I've actually considered needing the tank cloak this entire expansion - most of the time the DPS enrage timer has been the issue on things we're fighting, including this fight where adds not going down fast enough is IMO the bigger issue (it's why we got hung up on Galakras and Spoils for awhile), so every ounce of DPS has been needed -- and up 'til this point, I haven't been dying until the healers are dead; the tank cloak has been an insurance proc that only has utility if you actually die first on a regular basis.

    And the add aggro is on whoever has Garrosh - normally I shred threat off of Elly in trash packs (she's also using a lower grade weapon from ToT still, has 12% less crit, and is behind me by about 12 ilvl) but she actually peels them off of me when Garrosh is pumping her Vengeance and I'm the add tank. It's really poorly tuned.

    I could probably use more Enrages, admittedly, though I'm definitely not going Rage starved at all. (70% base crit before raid buffs and flasks gives me more Rage than I know what to do with.) S'pose I could use more Maul to bring the damage down from Garrosh a bit more, since I see that I had 24 TaC procs and only used 7 of them.

    Our shammies are normally better than that with the Stormlash totems -- looks like they were saving it for a raid cooldown. I'll have to nudge them.

    Thanks for taking a look at those. I bounced the idea of 'pass the Garrosh' off of my co-tank last night and she likes the idea, so we'll be giving that a whirl. I'm thinking that if we face left - right when the adds come in that should minimize the back quarter hits from the adds (which can't be dodged, SD up or not, which is what was killing me while I was on add duty), and I'll pass along that she should be favoring FR if she's got mobs behind her perhaps as well.

    -T.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tielyn View Post
    Interesting thought on reversing the fight positioning so that we're on the throne side rather than the balcony side... can people run up the stairs to the throne so everything has to come to the tanks?

    Is this supposed to be a 2 heal fight?

    -Tielyn
    We started out doing this on the throne side and we've also two healed it from when we first downed it back in the first week of October. We moved to the other side so that the iron star from the right (as you face the throne) takes out the Farseers.

    Two healing really is a must since, you run the risk of getting sucked into the heart realm with the adds from empowered whirlwind still up. The worst parts of the fight are learning to deal with adds durring empowered Whirlwind - our Pally tank with Righteous fury on kept unintentionally drawing the adds; and dealing with MC'd players durring phase 3.

    Also, unlike LFR, the little adds hurt - a lot - if you attempt to aoe them down.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theotherone View Post
    Two healing really is a must since, you run the risk of getting sucked into the heart realm with the adds from empowered whirlwind still up.
    Don't forget, when you come out of that intermission you get an instance desecrate and an MC. Really tough to deal with.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  4. #24
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    Yeah, we did notice that the IS sometimes knocks down the wolf rider coming in from the left, but the first one comes out before the IS is up, and I'd gotten pretty good at nabbing him and then kicking him right back into the path of the star. On a good attempt, I'd have all the adds under control and positioned right behind Elly to kick everything into the path of the star at the right moment, plus Yutheran (our resto druid) also had specific watch duty to kick the shaman into the star regardless of what the tanks were doing.

    IMHO, maybe it's just that we're not geared enough as a raid team yet - we'd gotten our first Siegecrafter, Thok, and Paragons Normal kills in the past two weeks of raiding, so we ought not to expect to down the final boss of the expansion the first night we see him either.

    And yeah, we've done the fight (not finished it) on Flex a few times before, so we know what to expect with the empowered adds, but we're still trying to get out of Phase 1.

  5. #25
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    No offense, but if you're not getting out of Phase 1, it is 100% on tanks.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  6. #26
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    I've downed this on my hunter many times and gotten very close to a kill on my holy pally so I can tell you that phase 1 is all about tank survival and then it gets easier after that for the most part. So don't be afraid to blow everything to survive and get through it. In both cases, we've been two healing it and yeah, the add tank gets beat on when he does his warsong. Thats just the time to use Hands of Sac, big tank CDs, Pain Suppression, etc, etc. And the more dps you can pour into GARROSH, the better off you are. As someone said earlier in the thread, don't forget to have the adds get smashed by the Ironstar.

    To avoid healer/dps aggro problems, just tell dps to lightly cleave down the adds while focusing Garrosh. If you can escape this phase with only 2 sets of adds, you are doing perfect. 3 sets is fine if you can push Garrosh before he empowers them with a song. Getting Garrosh to 10% is the priority. Everyone's going to want to number pad but, seriously, you need Garrosh to push on. 2 healing it will be a key and then tank survival and good focused dps will help.

  7. #27
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    *chuckles* None taken, and it's possible it is largely on the tanks, but I would say that from my perspective the bigger problem with us not getting out of Phase 1 is that our adds aren't going down fast enough even with the Iron Star kicks in play -- we'll have a second wave of Warbringer adds show up before the first set are down, and the add tank is dying while trying to hold twelve adds -- so they're not dying in the 30 second window before he buffs them with Warsong. He's getting at least one off on them on every fight, sometimes 2. On our best (longest) attempt, I kicked them into the star for 32 hits worth of damage. Tanks are #1 and #2 on damage done to the adds consistently (behind Iron Star damage), now that I'm looking at that bit. I dunno if that's right for this fight or not.

    General consensus seems to be: drop to two heals, tanks need to suck it up and not die despite only having 2 heals, trade Garrosh for vengeance buff, profit. Also, run previous bosses a few more times to gear better (mutters something about having to DE 1 or 2 drops per new kill), and bring Niuzao cloak for that fight.


    Think I have enough to go on for now.
    Thanks for all your thoughts, and wish us luck when we get back from the holidays.
    -Tielyn

  8. #28
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    General rule of thumb: if the tanks can DPS whore, you can drop a healer or a tank. AN extra DPS should be 200k dps more a tank going full defence shouldn't be a 200k dps loss.


    EDIT: not geared enough? well yeah i suppose, not geared right definetly.
    Last edited by Tengenstein; 12-17-2013 at 04:28 PM.
    Harsh Words and Steel: A Protection Warrior Guide
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    Hunters, Just get a Sporebat, most LFRs will be missing that buff.

  9. #29
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    We run 10s with a Pally and myself a Warrior tank. It took us awhile to figure it out as well.

    We ended up with me grabbing the first group of adds...bringing them to Garrosh in the middle and the Pally's AoE would take them off me. Then I would taunt Garrosh right before the Warsong and go easy on my AoE and focus Garrosh. Right before the Iron Star came out, I'd lay into my AoE and any that survived would be glued to me in the middle with Garrosh so our melee could finish cleaving them down while the Pally would peel off and grab the new set of adds.

    It worked well for us in the learning/beginning phases of the fight.

    Good luck!

    (As a warrior...I toyed with switching from my parry/dodge build to mastery to help with him...but in the end I switched back cause I liked my 350k dps )

  10. #30
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    I thought of a couple of other things that took us awhile to figure out...maybe they might help you too.

    1) Whichever tank is picking up adds, they need to go to the side that the next desecrated axe will NOT be thrown too ... this gives them extra time to pick them up as the adds from the side the axe will be on. Those adds will aggro on the healers and have to run through the desecration to get to them.

    2) When the tank that is tanking Garrosh begins to AoE right before the Iron Star...they need to use and rotate their major CDs with the healers tank saves at that point...depending on the number of adds and their health ... they can hurt for awhile

    3) When the add tank brings the second pack back...they can taunt Garrosh for Vengeance...but the Garrosh tank will need to taunt back immediately. At which point the Garrosh tank needs to stop their AoE.

    4) While we were learning, we used Bloodlust as soon as the first set of adds were grouped on Garrosh...it'll be up again during the burn in phase 4...and getting that 1st set dead before the next pack came really helped.

    5) Phase 1 is all about the tanks figuring it out. It's REALLY frustrating for the rest of the raid because it really does hinge on you two...the better AoE classes you have, the easier it will be...but ultimately you guys just gotta figure out what works for you. Don't let that discourage you...the rest of the fight as a tank is cake...and then you get to be annoyed with the rest of the raid while they figure out MCs/the dance/and adds

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by chubtohd View Post
    ...I toyed with switching from my parry/dodge build to mastery to help with him...but in the end I switched back cause I liked my 350k dps )
    And what was your dps in mastery build?

  12. #32
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    Just a tip, if you do continue to 3 heal it, you should send a healer to kill the engineer, not a dps. From what I understand they only have about 1m health? Probably easiest done by the Holy Priest.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gregasaurous View Post
    Just a tip, if you do continue to 3 heal it, you should send a healer to kill the engineer, not a dps. From what I understand they only have about 1m health? Probably easiest done by the Holy Priest.
    wat? We had a hunter not able to kill it in normal, I find it hard to believe that a holy priest of all healing classes could do it.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  14. #34
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    Really? I personally haven't ran over there to kill one, but my understanding is that it's a pretty faceroll chore as long as you're there as it spawns, not ariving late. I could be entirely wrong though.

  15. #35
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    not quit 1.8 mill health on 25. 15 seconds to activate. 120k dps should be enough unless you forget about it.
    Harsh Words and Steel: A Protection Warrior Guide
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    Hunters, Just get a Sporebat, most LFRs will be missing that buff.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    Don't forget, when you come out of that intermission you get an instance desecrate and an MC. Really tough to deal with.
    Yeah forgot about that; as we out gear we're ignoring that desecrate, poping hero and pushing him. He's starting to burn quickly these days.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    wat? We had a hunter not able to kill it in normal, I find it hard to believe that a holy priest of all healing classes could do it.
    When we did a few three heal attempts we sent our Disc priest to kill the engineer, and the engineer went right down, but Holy? I have to agree that might be pushing it.

  18. #38
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    Holy can put out some pretty good damage, only reason they rarely ever do it is because it doesn't produce healing liek Disc does (except for Halo)

  19. #39
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    Brief update: It's definitely a DPS problem. We stacked the raid team with the guild's #1, #3, and #4 DPS plus borrowed a DPS from the server's top Alliance raiding guild with 560 gear, and a heavy DPS from a guild we have an alliance with, and got out of Phase 1 several times and got the boss down to Phase 3. The next day we lost two of them and only got out of Phase 1 three times. Difference between the groups was that the on the day with the better DPS, adds were going down sometimes before the Iron Star even rolled by, versus not going down at all before the next group came out.

    On the other paw, I swapped to the tank meta and tank cloak and can single tank Phase 1 without triggering the cloak proc. :3

    We'll get there.

    -Tielyn

  20. #40
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    Have you gone down to two healers yet?
    Harsh Words and Steel: A Protection Warrior Guide
    MoP RPS Calculator

    Hunters, Just get a Sporebat, most LFRs will be missing that buff.

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