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Thread: No New 5 Mans - Will They be Missed?

  1. #61
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    Its hard to see through my rhetoric about LFx (which I sincerely believe, while being a boon for some people with limited time, has been utterly devastating to the "social" experience of wow). I don't see LFx going anywhere, the genie is out of the bottle, and I dont see the "social" experience ever coming back so if we're going to be bedfellows then fine, let's do it right. The current raid paradigm kind of works. Why not apply it to all content? So you can spend 4 hours doing a true heroic 5 man and get a shot at what ... 4 pieces of 522 gear? If you're doing a normal 25 man you're getting more gear off the first boss. That said the 5 man WILL appeal to some people (I would be doing it right now and I have all 522 or better gear now ... and would ABSOLUTELY be in there on alts). They didn't think challenge modes would appeal to a lot of people either but they've even said the response has been heartening. People like challenging content, and they like challenging non-raid content. People LOVED the legendary rogue quest, the legendary staff quest in Firelands, this warlock quest, brawler's guild, etc. It's really fun to HAVE to use your class to the fullest. Even heroic raiders still leave 33% of their abilities at home, there's just very little call for CC or stuns or whatever that has a massive utility in a 5 man or smaller content.

    Honestly those early weeks of Cataclysm when me and my fellow heroic raiders were struggling through 5 mans was awesome. Reminded us of BC. I am well aware that it was utterly terrible for anyone in the LFx queue and agree it shouldn't have been like that ... but at this point in the technology there's no reason we can't have our cake and eat it too. Honestly heroic scenarios and the fact that they are not in LFx is leading me to believe blizzard may be thinking the same thing.
    RIP Stormrage Horde ('05 - '11). Turaylon Horde since 11/11 where there's actually people
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  2. #62
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    Personally, I'd be happy to go with a group of friends into heroic 5 mans if the rewards e.g 522 gear was worth the effort for increased difficulty - I just would avoid it like the plague if was lfg enabled. In fact, it would be a nice diversion on an off night when you don't have enough on to do an alt run in a 10 man.

  3. #63
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    And if you could do the "normal" mode of it, again with friends, for 502 LFR gear ... would be awesome. Would also be nice for the alternate itemization, the entire itemization "game" is still very fun in WoW the issue has been we just haven't had any options beyond "go to this raid and pray" for a long time. If they took the current 5 man gear and just made it 502/522 (or whatever is relevant to the tier), things get interesting fast.
    RIP Stormrage Horde ('05 - '11). Turaylon Horde since 11/11 where there's actually people
    GM of Neolutum (always recruiting, PM me)

  4. #64
    Even heroic raiders still leave 33% of their abilities at home, there's just very little call for CC or stuns or whatever that has a massive utility in a 5 man or smaller content.
    This is why I quit mage in TBC. It was fun in 5-mans to have all this control over the fights. Would be a tremendous boon to the group, then you get into raiding and it was just "Fireball. Fireball. Fireball" all day long. =(

  5. #65
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    I heard the heroic scenarios are not LFG enabled; you need a premade group for them.

  6. #66
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    Re: No New 5 Mans - Will They be Missed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity View Post
    This is why I quit mage in TBC. It was fun in 5-mans to have all this control over the fights. Would be a tremendous boon to the group, then you get into raiding and it was just "Fireball. Fireball. Fireball" all day long. =(
    Gruuls lair was not like that at all. Mage tank FTMFW!

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by feralminded View Post
    Would also be nice for the alternate itemization, the entire itemization "game" is still very fun in WoW the issue has been we just haven't had any options beyond "go to this raid and pray" for a long time.
    Personally, I think the loot tables have sucked since ICC, we've discussed this before on these forums. Maybe it was the 10/25 man gear that made the tables more interesting, but things in FL or T14 like one shield or one gun just pray for RNG to be ultra cruel. While I liked the three raids at the start of MoP, I thought they were very well done, I didn't like that you were stuck with certain gear from MSV to ToT.

    That said, I find that ToT's gear choices are much more interesting and at least as hunter I have a shot at a bow or a crossbow. Ghost crawler also in a Tweet made a point to say that they've made the stats on non-tier pieces good enough so that there's a some choice between do I get my 4 piece or do I stick with the non-tier. I kind of see this in the VP stuff. The Pally healing gear really has no spirit to speak of, but ToT drops a nice Spirit trinket and a nice Intell trinket with a pure restore mana proc - along with the VP trinket that has a mana on use. Gives you a chance to mix and match gear.

  8. #68
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    Re: No New 5 Mans - Will They be Missed?

    IMHO, while it doesn't mean much, is that I believe they should go back to TBC style heroics. I enjoyed the challenge (wasn't a top raider at all...did kara/Gruuls/tk.) That they provided. The fact that you needed to CC trash because it was legitimately hard was fun. I don't see them doing that though, but it would be nice to see them make a non-lfr/lfg type heroic that dropped comparable raid loot that requires skill. I believe others have stated that as well.

  9. #69
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    I wouldn't mind a few new 5mans as I usually do a few daily heroics a week to cap vp. Some new stuff would keep it fresh but I don't really mind if they keep making great raids

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by feralminded View Post
    Yes you don't have to, but we do. He's been on these forums for a long time with a long trail of "evidence" backing up his claims, you're just a petulant child who has a hard-on for arguing (~10 posts in one day, all of 3 sentences or less? All I heard is "I know you are but what am I?")
    Whoa, I am sorry that I offended you that much, and yes, I do enjoy a nice little discussion. Not to worry though, I have learned my lesson.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by feralminded View Post
    Honestly those early weeks of Cataclysm when me and my fellow heroic raiders were struggling through 5 mans was awesome. Reminded us of BC. I am well aware that it was utterly terrible for anyone in the LFx queue and agree it shouldn't have been like that ... but at this point in the technology there's no reason we can't have our cake and eat it too. Honestly heroic scenarios and the fact that they are not in LFx is leading me to believe blizzard may be thinking the same thing.
    I would agree with this whole paragraph. As I've stated before, I loved Cata heroics at the beginning, including Stonecore and Grim Batol, *but only with friends*. So, making the heroic scenarios non-LFG may be a test of sorts, and if they do well, we might start seeing a second kind of challenge mode for 5-mans that mirrors the heroic scenarios.

    Yeah, LFx isn't going away. Regardless of what we here at Tankspot think of it, I think there's definitely a large number of people who like it, including the ease of it, and Blizzard will continue to make easier content for those people. Taking that away to appease people who want *all* content to be more difficult would be a bad idea. Blanket changing all current heroic 5-mans to BC difficulty would not turn out well, either. However, adding harder content outside LFx, as you say, would be a good idea, I think. Heroic scenarios will tell the tale. The key will be if there is enough use of them to pay for the additional development involved.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ltranger View Post
    IMHO, while it doesn't mean much, is that I believe they should go back to TBC style heroics. I enjoyed the challenge (wasn't a top raider at all...did kara/Gruuls/tk.) That they provided. The fact that you needed to CC trash because it was legitimately hard was fun. I don't see them doing that though, but it would be nice to see them make a non-lfr/lfg type heroic that dropped comparable raid loot that requires skill. I believe others have stated that as well.
    If the heroic scenarios go well, we could very well see BC-style heroics offered outside LFD.

    The easy content is *not* going away, no matter how much you wish it. Too many casuals who don't even know Tankspot exists like it. Blizzard would be stupid to remove it now to appease a smaller percentage. Adding something specifically for those wanting something harder would be much more likely.
    Last edited by mavfin; 04-07-2013 at 02:16 PM.

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