Without knowing much about the content, I'd suggest including wowhead links for the Glyphs and Talents in addition to the gems. Maybe the racials too.
In MoP Holy Paladins have a lot of changes to our abilities and playing style, as such I will start off with our stat weights.
A quick breakdown of this:
In MoP we no longer benefit from intellect going to spirit and need to have as much as possible. (I am currently with 13k mp5 unbuffed and that is still not enough in some heroic fights). Intellect will still provide more throughput then mastery in raw numbers however mastery will be higher then haste as the % bubble that is placed from single target healing will allow us to be more efficient healers over being faster healers. Certain fights you will need to reforge for the fight as mana regen is not an issue (Tsulong and Gara'jal are two that come to mind).
[Revitalizing Primal Diamond] – Our only realistic choice for a meta at this time prior to 5.2 as we are always needing mana.
[Sparkling River’s Heart] – This is going to be your main selection for a gem unless the socket bonus outweights straight spirit.
[Purified Imperial Amethyst] – Only going to be used when the red socket bonus outweights straight spirit.
[Zen Wild Jade] – Only use if the socket bonus is 100 spirit or higher as mastery falls 3rd in stat priority.
Single-target Healing Abilities
Beacon of Light – This is one of our main healing abilities in which our rotation will revolve around, it no longer costs mana and has a 3 second cooldown and a 1 second GCD (if glyphed it is instant on both cd's). The beaconed target will receive 100% of the healing from Holy Light, 15% healing from any aoe heals and 50% healing from all other abilities. It will also come into our strat regarding generating holy power which I will go into later.
Holy Shock – This spell is instant and very mana efficient and generates a holy power every time it is used, when used after a Holy Radiance it becomes an aoe instant cast as well by distributing to everyone in 10 yards equal to the original amount healed from holy shock on the single target. This spell should never be off cd if possible
Holy Light – This is a slow but very mana efficient spell, it doesn't heal for much however when combined with Beacon of light it doubles its efficiency.
Divine Light – This is your strong single target heal as well as being very expensive. If used on your beaconed target you will generate a holy power. This spell will be used often if you are tank healing.
Word of Glory/Eternal Flame – A very large heal if used at 3 Holy Power, instant cast and definitely should be ready for if any emergency arises.
Flash of Light – A quick, expensive heal that is not advised using unless the person will die from a slower heal in that time. Note that it will generate a Holy Power if used on the beaconed target.
Multi-target Healing Abilities
Light of Dawn – This is our large aoe spell that is instant cast and cost holy power, strongly advise using it whenever you have 3 holy power and massive raid damage is going out
Holy Radiance – Our other AoE heal but costs as much as Divine Light, it will generate a holy power on whoever it is cast on (doesn't need to be the beaconed target). Use only if you are not capped on holy power as Light of Dawn will be a more mana efficient heal.
Holy Shock - As I specified earlier, if used after Holy Radiance it becomes an AoE spell.
In MoP the talent tree has been completely redone again allowing for an interchangeable system to adapt to any situation on the fly. With this change I will go into detail each level and the advised talent to pick most of the time.
Tier 1 (Level 15) - Movement
Speed of Light: Increases your movement speed by 70% for 8 seconds on a 45 second cooldown. This spell is useful when you need to cover long distance in a short period of time (Blade Lord Ta'Yak Phase 2) among others, however will be overall slower then the other spells.
Long Arm of the Law: Your successful Judgements increase your movement speed by 45% for 3 seconds. Not useful to us at all as we no longer use Judgement as it doesn't have any benefit.
Pursuit of Justice: Gives you a constant 15% movement speed, and an extra 5% movement speed for each current charge of Holy Power up to 3. The static 15% speed increase is enough in most situations but isn't as useful in certain raid fights.
Advised talent: Speed of Light - Most situations may not call for the boost but you will be thankful when you do have it.
Tier 2 (Level 30) - Crowd Control
Fist of Justice: Replaces your Hammer of Justice, giving you a 6 second stun with a 30 second cooldown and a 20 yard range. This is useful as you don`t have to be in melee range to stun the target.
Repentance: Castable crowd control ability with a 15 second cooldown that incapacitates a target for up to 1 minute, with the effect breaking upon damage. As we are healing we shouldn`t be responsible for any CC, and as such this talent is not really utilized for us.
Burden of Guilt: Your Judgement places a debuff on the target, reducing movement speed by 50%. Again we do not use Judgement so this talent is useless to us.
Advised Talent: Fist of Justice - The only spell that is actually useful to us in PVE.
Tier 3 (Level 45) - Healing
Selfless Healer: Your successful Judgements reduce the cast time and mana cast of your next Flash of Light by 35%, stacking up to 3 times. Each stack also increases the effectiveness of your next Flash of Light if used on other targets. This spell is not useful to us at all, Judgement isn't used anymore, Flash of Light is not a strong heal, overall just a waste for a Holy Paladin.
Eternal Flame: Your Word of Glory is replaced by Eternal Flame, which is basically just Word of Glory with about a 30 second HoT. The HoT does a decent amount of healing, and each tick places an Illuminated Healing buff on the target. This is very strong when a lot of continuous damage is being dealt out, and works really well in combination of our Tier 4 talent choice.
Sacred Shield: Places a 30 second buff on the target where every 6 seconds they will gain a buff that will absorb damage. Haste effects lower the 6 second internal cooldown on the absorb effect of this ability. This talent has its uses in certain areas, if only one person is taking damage it is great however when damage is dispersed or in a strong burst this talent is not as useful.
Advised Talent: Eternal Flame - Overall this spell will come out on top more often then Sacred Shield, keep in mind certain fights you will want to swap for Sacred Shield. (Never choose Selfless Healer).
Tier 4 (Level 60) - Toolbox
Hand of Purity: Places a Hand on the friendly target, reducing the damage of harmful periodic effects by 70% for 6 sec. Now in 5.2 this talent also reduces all damage taken by 10% This talent has its place in certain fights where a debuff places damage over time on you.
Unbreakable Spirit: Spent Holy Power will reduce the cooldown of your Divine Shield, Divine Protection, or Lay on Hands, up to a maximum of 50% reduction. This talent isn`t going to be utilized that often as its functionality is limited to long duration fights and using Lay on Hands at the beginning of the fight.
Clemency: You can use your Hand Spells (Hand of Protection, Sacrifice, Freedom, and Salvation) twice before incurring their cooldown. Having 2 Hand of Protections is amazing, I can`t count the number of times this has saved the raid. NOTE: There is currently a bug that Blizzard still has not fixed where the CD`s of Hand of Protection do not reset after you die, forcing you to wait up to 10 minutes if you need to use them back to back.
Advised Talent: Clemency - Having the ability to pop 2 HoP`s or 2 Hand of Sacrifices is beautiful, I love it!
REVISED FOR 5.2 Hand of Purity Having a 10% damage reduction on a 30 second cd (potentially up 33% of the time) is massive! A lot of the fights in Throne of Thunder have periodical damage (of the fights we have completed so far: Jin'rok the Breaker, Horridon, Council, Maegara all have periodical damage from debuffs)
Tier 5 (Level 75) - Holy Power
Holy Avenger - Abilities that generate Holy Power will deal 30% additional damage and healing, and generate 3 charges of Holy Power for the next 18 sec. This ability is a useful cooldown when high burst damage is being dealt however the cooldown on it is a tad to long in comparison for raw throughput.
Sanctified Wrath- Holy Avenger is now 30 seconds long and reduces the CD of Holy Shock by 50%, even with our T14 4 set this will only give us 7 more holy power in comparison to without in the 30 seconds, I strongly suggest against this ability.
Divine Purpose- Any time you use an ability that consumes Holy Power you have a 25% chance to not spend it, this ability is very strong however it comes with the major factor of RNG, I find this talent extremely useful for overall throughput and mana conservation, however you cannot rely on this to proc in a time of need.
Advised talent: Divine Purpose or Holy Avenger - this really comes down to your playstyle, while Divine Purpose does come out on top with throughput you cannot rely on it to be there in your time of need, while Holy Avenger is the opposite.
Tier 6 (Level 90) - Healing Spell
Holy Prism:It heals one person for x ammount and the 5 closest enemies are damaged around your target (15 Yards) or damages one enemy and heals the 5 closest allies around it with the lowest health, it is a very smart heal and on a short cd, however find that it is rarely useful for massive aoe healing or single target, it is an in-the-middle spell. Overall I wouldn`t suggest picking up for 25mans or 10mans as peoples movement and location are hardly reliable.
Light's Hammer: AoE placement spell, 10 Yard radius from placement that heals everyone within the area every 2 seconds, this spell is amazing in 25 man raids as people are usually grouped together, however comes second to Holy Prism in 10 man raids.
Execution Sentence: A HoT overtime that becomes larger over the course of the HoT, this spell is only useful for one fight as a Holy Paladin at this time: Tsulong, any other time it isn`t as it takes time to effectively heal someone with this, as a Holy Paladin we are often relied on to burst heal and react quickly, this spell does neither effectively.
Advised talent REVISED: I strongly suggest staying with Light's Hammer in both 10m and 25 due to people not always being near the bosses and furthermore allows you to place a grouped up healing spell for when many situations in the Throne of Thunder raid encounter calls for it!
Please note that any glyph I do not mention is cause I do not feel that they are comparable to these 4 talents.
Glyph of Beacon of Light- This removes the GCD and CD from Beacon of Light, this is extremely useful for generating holy power and making quick swaps to people who are taking damage.
Glyph of Divine Plea- Changes Divine Plea from being a 9 second overtime mana regen with the 50% debuff to healing to a 5 second cast that gives you your 12% mana instantly, note that your haste % affects the cast time as well.
Glyph of Divine Protection- This is useful for fights where the damage is mainly physical
Glyph of Divinity- While we are always trying to manage our mana pool this allows us to regen 30k mana everytime we use Lay on Hands.
Note that other professions are not advised as they don't help as much as these professions.
Blacksmithing - 2 additional sockets to gem however you need (640 spirit or 320 Int if it comes to a point where we don't need as much spirit)
Tailoring - Back enchant to increase spirit on average by 750 (note that this is based on a proc)
Alchemy - Increase spirit by 640 or Int by 320 (depending on what flask you consume)
Jewelcrafting - 3 Special gams (640 Spirit or 320 Int)
Enchanting - 320 Int on rings
Leatherworking - Bracer enchant by an additional 320 Int
Inscription - Shoulder enchant by an additional 320 Int
Please note that I am only advising the best racial for each faction.
Human -The Human Spirit - The 3% extra spirit from their racial is definitely one of the best
Blood Elf - Arcane Torrent gives us 2% of our total mana pool back
Please note that the items I am specifying are Heroic Thunderforged if possible, the next BiS is the Normal-Mode Thunderforged if you are not at heroic yet.
Helm - Lightning Emperor's Headguard
Neck - Soul Prism of Lei Shen
Shoulders - Lightning Emperor's Mantle
Back - Constantly Accelerating Cloak OR Drape of Booming Nights
Chest - Lei Shen's Grounded Carapace
Bracers - Bonemender Bracers
Hands - Iceshatter Gauntlets
Waist - Refreshing Abalone Girdle
Legs - Matter-Swapped Legplates
Feet - Ice-Scored Treads
Ring 1 - Durumu's Captive Eyeball
Ring 2 - Petrified Eye of the Basilisk
Trinket 1 - Horridon's Last Gasp
Trinket 2 - Lightning-Imbued Chalice
Main-Hand - Torall, Rod of the Shattered Throne (Will most likely use Soulblade of the Breaking Storm as Jin'rokh is the first Heroic Boss you will kill).
Off-Hand - Shield of Twinned Despair OR Tortos' Discarded Shell if you are going for the haste soft cap at 3506.
Regarding rotation you want to use Holy Shock (HS) whenever it is off CD, our healing is based off our Holy Power (HP) and mana conservation to do this I use Beacon of Light (BoL) on the main tank and Holy Light as much as possible (spamming it to no end) the reason is the beacon target receives 100% of the heal on top of your target, your heal just doubled in its efficiency on top of being a mana conservation. Divine Light should only ever be used on your beaconed target, this will generate 1 HP.
With the talent tree in the 5th row in Divine Purpose, 25% of the time you will have a free heal with your HP, and yes it can proc from itself over and over again (I have personally hit 7 procs in a row resulting in using 24 HP for only the cost of 3).
The biggest thing people who play Holy Pally's seem to forget is the use of Divine Plea (DP), it should be used at 80% mana. People ask "but why would I use it when I have tons of mana already?" Divine plea gives you 12% of your mana back, on a 2 minute cd you can use it 3-6 times a fight depending on the fight (haven't seen been in a raid fight where the boss is less then 6 minutes long). Rather then only using DP when you have to cause you are out of mana use it at 80% (this accounts for the 12% and the additional you wait while it is being used that is mp5 regen/the casting time from the glyph of DP) at that point you should use it every time it is up from that point.
I wanted to continue this thread with a bit more about the nitty gritty on Holy Pally healing, when you look at healing it isn't as simple as just using an add-on to heal people and end of story. Every class has a strong point and a weak spot knowing how to utilize your class to the best possible in every situation will make you wanted by every guild out there. People can fix a lack of gear but a lack of skill is another thing. I will lay it out so everyone can benefit as much as possible. Holy Pally's real strength lies in being a reactionary healer, we see something happen and fix it, we are provided with such strong single target heals that we are often relied on as tank healers. With the change in MoP with HP we are much more versatile once we adapt to the changes, if you have noticed that resto shamans are coming out on top over your heals it is because you are missing the key point: HP is more then a instant burst of healing with EF, use your holy power when there is massive AoE damage going out with LoD, we have enough normal healing spells that are high single target as is to not worry about burst damage too much with HP.
Holy Pally's biggest downfalls are mana conservation and raid positioning, I have touched on why mana is such a huge issue with the cost of spells, but I want to talk about how to counteract this, HP, our abilities are based around HP and should be utilized as much as possible, Holy Shock (HS) should be used every time it is up (even if there isn't anyone to heal), Holy Radiance (HR) generates a HP also but is expensive, Divine Light (DL) and Flash of Light (FoL) both generate a HP when used on a beaconed target, Crusader Strike if you are in melee and need HP for LoD you can rack it up quickly with multiple abilities. FUN FACT: Holy Shock is not just a burst single target heal, it is also an AoE heal if used after a HR.
The second thing I want to touch on here is our second greatest weakness: Positioning. We are not instant casters (with the exception of EF/WoG and LoD which is our little trick to turn it around which I'll explain in a bit). When it comes to raid positioning you want to position yourself so that if possible you never have to move your character to heal someone as you are always in range of every character, you plant your feet there as long as possible without ignoring raid mechanics FIRE!!! with the most of our abilities being casting we cannot move and heal. HR, DL, FoL, HL are all caster heals and as such we need to have the best positioning as possible so we are not continuously moving and not healing. The only thing I can advise is that we save HP for if we have to move often (Megaera) and use it accordingly, if I know I am going to be moving a bit in the fight I generate 5 HP and then move, I now have 3 heals on the move which are all quite strong (3HP LoD or EF) which ever is taking more damage, then a HS on a single target (this generates 1 HP and is an instant cast so you can cast on the move with it) and another 3HP heal. At this point stringing combos is going to come more naturally as you start to realize what we have in our toolbox to string heals off back to back without worrying about mana.
Last edited by Kromus_; 05-08-2013 at 05:08 PM.
Without knowing much about the content, I'd suggest including wowhead links for the Glyphs and Talents in addition to the gems. Maybe the racials too.
Originally Posted by Gravy
I notice the allocation of intel vs spirit in certain settings is different.
For instance in gems you could get 160 intel or 320 spirit. So you get twice as much spirit as intel in that situation.
But for food buffs or flasks the number is the same, 300 intel or 300 spirit.
I estimate it's best to gem full spirit gems regardless of socket bonuses and actually use intel flasks and food buffs if your gear has enough spirit on it itself.
There have been a couple tweets by GhostCrawler over the last week, calling out healers for stacking Spirit saying that it wasn't necessary. He implied a kind of a lemming mentality, some of the top guilds' healers did it so everyone follows.
The more I've been healing on my Pally, the more I think he's right, gain in MP5 just doesn't seem worth the loss in throughput for a Pally.
Updated the guide to reflect the changes in 5.2
Hey nice guide...Thanks for the 5.2 updates
Tier 6 (Level 90) - Healing Spell
Holy Prism: The long and short of this spell is it acts a lot like Circle of Healing for Priests; it heals one person for x ammount and the 5 closest people around your target (15 Yards) with the lowest health, it is a very smart heal and on a short cd, however find that it is rarely useful for massive aoe healing or single target, it is an in-the-middle spell. Overall I wouldn`t suggest picking up for 25mans, 10mans however I can see it`s usefulness.
Not exactly right there...The AOE heal only occurs when your target is an enemy. If you target an ally(or self) then you recieve a heal and there is an AOE damage. I wish it was a Heal-Heal spell like Circle of Healing. We should suggest that to the DevTeam.
I like the spell links in the guide too...gj
Honestly heroic raiding is a completely different ball game, if you are looking at doing anything beyond your standard raids you will need about 14-15k spirit unbuffed.
At that heroic iLVL do you find the Spirit on the gear will get you to that 14-15k?
...or are you having to gem/enchant to get there?
...guess the trinket stat would decide that for you maybe.
I look at combat regen (MP5), on my character I am sitting with 13811 mp5 (Combat regen every 5 seconds), note that I am in pretty much full 517 iLVL gear with a few 522 pieces (including one of our BiS Thunderforged normal mode trinkets from Throne of Thunder). I am gemming and enchanting for spirit where possible.
I feel I am getting close to the point where mana is comfortable however I am going to be pushing T15 Heroics with my T14 4-set bonus as there are other people that have higher priority at the moment (our t15 4set is not as desired as some other classes that come to mind).
Note that I still use spirit food and flask when a fight goes for a long duration (Horridon, Council of the Elders, Maegara, Lei Shein are a few that come to mind).
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...briar/advanced...My work in-progress.
As I move into doing MSV heroics I still feel like my heals should be "hitting harder"...Heroic Elegon 25man is kicking my butt.
Did you find Light's Hammer the better talent on that fight?
You should post parses from your fights as I cannot tell what you considder "hitting harder" when there is no comparison, 25m anything Light's Hammer will come out on top, there are a few fights in 10m I believe Holy Prism comes out on top but I need to run some more parses to test that.
Looking at your character you are completely off with your gemming (Spirit>Intellect>Mastery>Haste>Crit)
Chest should be 200 Spirit
Int on your Shield (currently no enchant)
Bracers should be Int on them (being that you bought the bracers from the BMAH they are going to stick with you for a while).
Just a few basics, what I would advise is go through my guide on stat weights and gemming and go from there, after you fix your bonuses and do a run let me know what is going on then including a parse.
EDIT: You didn't look at my guide at all did you? Your talents are completely off as well (Glyph of the battle healer only applies to ret or prot paladins). Please read the guide before asking what is not working.
Last edited by Kromus_; 03-30-2013 at 12:47 AM. Reason: Second glance at your character.
My question is do you find a point where mastery seems to not be as beneficial Im currently at 27% and when buffed in 25man im at 35% i've had my mastery as high as 38%. I really didnt notice much of an increase with the extra 3% mastery. because of this I have started keeping a bit more haste and keeping myself at 35% mastery. Just curious on your thoughts with this.
Right now for Heroic Tortos I am going for as much haste as possible as our mastery on Heroic is useless with the mechanic that has been placed into the fight. Tonight I ended up with 32.16% haste after normal buffs however that fight is strictly about throughput to keep bubbles up.
To conclude you should be pointing all your reforging into mastery unless you are doing one of 2 things; progression Heroic Tortos, or going for your 3506 haste breakpoint at which everything is still going into mastery after the breakpoint in haste.
Also I will be doing a revision with my guide to go over BiS items and why they are considdered BiS for us based on progression. (Note that some normal mode thunderforged is better then heroic thunderforged as the chest from Jin'rokh and the chest from Lei Shen come to mind.
Question. I use lights hammer (as suggested), but when I do, MSBT says its only doing damage. Sometimes it'll say its healing, but I'm not 100% sure if it is. I haven't tried it with the stock combat text as of yet.