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Thread: PST - Episode 107

  1. #1

    PST - Episode 107



    This week:
    0:19 - Will we see another final-tier nerf in MoP?
    8:36 - Should Blizzard add a "Random LFR" feature?
    13:16 - How can I make my guild stand out when recruiting?
    21:22 - Would having a dedicated observer in a spectator mode really be a bad thing?
    26:54 - What's the difference between DPS and Damage Done on the meters?
    34:07 - How do you feel about items unique to the BMAH, like the Sun Lute?
    37:05 - What would the game be like if there were no gems, enchants, or reforging?
    42:48 - How can I decide who to give our Blood Spirits to?
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  2. #2
    yes, there's still heroic BiS items on the BMAH

    also, how can you think that the corrupted ashbringer should not be on the BMAH and you dont mind the t3 is there...? i'm pretty sure people who allready had the old t3 set is feeling very butthurt that it is now available, even though people is having to drop 25k a piece of the set for a total of 200000 gold. i would imagine your ashbringer would be brought to at least 400k on most servers.

  3. #3
    as for the agility leather comment he means that whenever agi leather drops, no one wants it and therefore it will be disenchanted into blood spirits

  4. #4
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    8:36 - Blizzard definitely need something to get more players into the older tiers as the expansion progresses.

    I still maintain that using RF as a catch up mechanism will fail due to excess queue lengths as a result of smaller pools of players queueing for all but the most recent tier.

    I originally made that prediction before MOP launched.....and I believe it even more now that I know how unfriendly to alts this expansion has been. There won't be as many active alts as there were in Cataclysm.

    So even if we tempt players into random older RF's on their main I still worry that the available pool of players will be spread too thinly to make alt queue times acceptable.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toypop View Post
    8:36 - Blizzard definitely need something to get more players into the older tiers as the expansion progresses.

    I still maintain that using RF as a catch up mechanism will fail due to excess queue lengths as a result of smaller pools of players queueing for all but the most recent tier.
    Completely agree with this. People are already spread far too thin by the separation imposed by servers. Even if that were not the case though there isn't any good reason to placate the tiny minority who want exclusive content at the cost of the much wider majority. One of the strongest features of WoW is that people can move in/out of the game with ease - catering to a few who continuously play the game and want entrenched advantages is a terrible change.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by jacobwx77 View Post
    yes, there's still heroic BiS items on the BMAH

    also, how can you think that the corrupted ashbringer should not be on the BMAH and you dont mind the t3 is there...? i'm pretty sure people who allready had the old t3 set is feeling very butthurt that it is now available, even though people is having to drop 25k a piece of the set for a total of 200000 gold. i would imagine your ashbringer would be brought to at least 400k on most servers.
    Because there isn't a reskinned Corrupted Ashbringer easily available from a level 80 instance.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by tawnos View Post
    Completely agree with this. People are already spread far too thin by the separation imposed by servers. Even if that were not the case though there isn't any good reason to placate the tiny minority who want exclusive content at the cost of the much wider majority. One of the strongest features of WoW is that people can move in/out of the game with ease - catering to a few who continuously play the game and want entrenched advantages is a terrible change.
    I have no idea what you're even talking about here. Servers have nothing to do with LFR. And are you really arguing that Blizzard should not create content focused on the people that play their game?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lore View Post
    I have no idea what you're even talking about here. Servers have nothing to do with LFR. And are you really arguing that Blizzard should not create content focused on the people that play their game?
    If I understood his point correctly, I believe he is saying that there needs to be catch-up mechanisms in place for anyone who takes a break and then needs to come back and try to be raid-ready again. He is saying that LFR is an important step in that process now and if anyone who didn't take time off will never participate, then the mechanism fails.

    In the past, that wasn't so much an issue because a, LFR didn't exist and b, alts were much easier to level and maintain in previous expansions.

    I do agree that alt maintenance is much harder now, but I'm not sure the value in making people do content they have already done extensively and might be burned out on so I'm not sure I 100% agree. As long as new heroics come out for each content patch, we should be able to play catch-up the same way we always did before LFR.
    "he doens't need healing, he doesn't need healing, he doesn't nee-WHAOSHIT!wtf was that man!". Please stop leaning on TDR. -Teng

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lore View Post
    I have no idea what you're even talking about here. Servers have nothing to do with LFR. And are you really arguing that Blizzard should not create content focused on the people that play their game?
    It took me a while but I think I figured it out.

    Presumably he means that not having a workable catch up system favours players that play continuously or have guilds to boost them or their alts up through the Normal modes as opposed to being dependent on RF. Generally speaking it is only a minority of progression guilds that would take time out to boost a members alt through all the old raids to rapidly gear them up to present day content.

    His comment about those demanding exclusive content refers to those we see on many WoW related forums who frequently request the removal of catch up mechanisms to make the current tier more "exclusive".

    Not sure what the server thing was about but I guess if you are on a low pop server and the catching up process via RF doesn't work properly then it is even more difficult to drag yourself back up under what would then be something similar to the TBC system - trying to find Normal mode guilds/pugs that are running the old tiers. Without access to the wider population that won't be easy.

    Edit: Looks like sifuedition beat me to it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sifuedition View Post
    I do agree that alt maintenance is much harder now, but I'm not sure the value in making people do content they have already done extensively and might be burned out on so I'm not sure I 100% agree. As long as new heroics come out for each content patch, we should be able to play catch-up the same way we always did before LFR.
    I feel that with smaller pools and longer queues in older RF tiers, Blizzard may be forced to develop new 5 mans and go back to the Wrath model just as you say.

    On the one hand that is no great shame as 5 mans are incredibly popular. The downside is that it would be the death of the older raid tiers. With the 5 man option available even more people would abandon RF with its long odds and weekly lockout which in turn would make the queues even worse.

    It would be nice if RF could work alongside 5 mans. I feel that would require changes to the win chance in RF but even then I could only see players wanting to run them for a week or two as by then the 5 mans would have geared them up and jumped them into the latest tier.

    The more I think about it the more I believe that the RF catch up system is totally unworkable.

    Presumably the death of the older tiers wouldn't be that big a deal because as you say most players would have already burned themselves out on them thanks to RF. As opposed to say T11 which even after the huge nerfs was largely abandoned and many players never saw it at all.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by sifuedition View Post
    If I understood his point correctly, I believe he is saying that there needs to be catch-up mechanisms in place for anyone who takes a break and then needs to come back and try to be raid-ready again. He is saying that LFR is an important step in that process now and if anyone who didn't take time off will never participate, then the mechanism fails.

    In the past, that wasn't so much an issue because a, LFR didn't exist and b, alts were much easier to level and maintain in previous expansions.

    I do agree that alt maintenance is much harder now, but I'm not sure the value in making people do content they have already done extensively and might be burned out on so I'm not sure I 100% agree. As long as new heroics come out for each content patch, we should be able to play catch-up the same way we always did before LFR.
    From the latter, I may have missed something but wasn't that a big point about MOP? I thought the idea was that there wouldn't be anything like this in the future, and that one would have to progress through previous tiers of raid content to get to the next. LFR can help to bridge the gap but once we get to tier16 if someone has to do something like tier15 LFR's, throw in some tier14 normals, move up through tier16 LFRs, then some tier15 normals, then finally start thinking about tier16 normals thats going to be do what I worry about - dilute players farther. In the past, because there were such catchup mechanisms you had effectively the entire population concentrated in either (new) heroics or a single tier worth of raids. If that gets spread out into 3 different raid tiers, 3 different LFR tiers, and heroics that will make an already difficult situation (finding a group) even more difficult as it will add another layer of separation. Trying to find a group filters through a number of layers of separation already (server, faction, and most importantly schedule) already and adding another one (being at the proper tier of content) would just make it that much more difficult. Even large servers (I'm on one of the ones that was just offered free transfers a couple months ago) have a very small pool of players from which to construct groups and anything that dilutes that pool further is a bad thing.

    Exlusive content (e.g get to see tier14-16 and other people only get to see tier14) makes some people happy, but its at the expense of what I figure is a large portion of the population.

  12. #12
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    Yeah, I think you're kinda biased. Corrupted Ashbringer is totally transmog gear and should be appropriate fodder for the BMAH like any number of items with unique models that are no longer available.

  13. #13
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    How can I make my guild stand out when recruiting?
    Don't raid on Tuesdays. Don't raid on Wednesdays. Don't raid on Thursdays. This is probably one of the simplest things you can do in order to not only fill your raid, but fill it with good players.

    Most guilds raid Tues-Thur. Some of these guilds have players who are really good who play their alts just as good as they play their mains. The only difference is that their main raids and their alt doesn't. They probably even valor cap both each week.

    If you raid Friday through Monday, you'll not only get the alts available to you, but you'll also get backup raiders that didn't get to raid with their guild. More people will be willing to join your raids knowing that your raid will be their last chance for the week.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Lore View Post
    Because there isn't a reskinned Corrupted Ashbringer easily available from a level 80 instance.
    Reskins are by no means the same as reintroducing, also there's some slight model changes from tier 3 to tier 7 (the warrior set comes to mind). i just have a hard time seeing how you can justify the reintroducing of tier 3 and not the ashbringer by bringing up reskins.

  15. #15
    I even said in the episode that I am probably just biased because I have one
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  16. #16
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    I'm a bit confused on the response to the first question. Now that we have LFRs, why is there any need to nerf the final tier? Doesn't the LFR basically take the place of that nerf already?
    Besides that, if they nerf the tier, would that mean nerfing the LFR version as well?

  17. #17
    There are more than three types of raiders.
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  18. #18
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    The last question: I got the impression the guy was saying he had nobody who uses agi leather, so they were having a lot of extra stuff to disenchant, therefore an abundance of blood spirits.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tawnos View Post
    From the latter, I may have missed something but wasn't that a big point about MOP?
    I don't personally recall any comments that made me think they were going to enforce progressing though tiers after T15/16 are released. Maybe I missed it or misread something. If you can remember any links or specifics, I'd be glad to read anything you have on that.

    If they did try to do that, then I would assume there would be no new heroics with the content patches. That's about the only way I can envision forcing a raid progression. If that's the case, then this topic would be even more relevant. However, it does seem that you would at least be able to skip from LFR T14 to LFR T15 rather than needing to go LFR-Normal-LFR-Normal.

    Also, I've always viewed alts as a very necessary piece to the PuG picture and to keeping older content relevant. This expansion so far has been very alt unfriendly, which seems like it would make keeping multiple tiers alive almost impossible. I hope that isn't the Blizzard plan.
    "he doens't need healing, he doesn't need healing, he doesn't nee-WHAOSHIT!wtf was that man!". Please stop leaning on TDR. -Teng

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Impeesa View Post
    The last question: I got the impression the guy was saying he had nobody who uses agi leather, so they were having a lot of extra stuff to disenchant, therefore an abundance of blood spirits.
    Aha, that makes sense
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