New Toons! Good thing, especially if they are going to follow the type of format/style show in the MOP video......
The auction houses should stay realm based, let the players have their AH PVP arenas...... The Black Market auction house should be cross faction and cross server, rather than the welfare epix vendor........
The zones being cross realm is pretty cool, and solves practically the only reason to merge servers. Merging servers would only serve to create massive lag in the popular/ expansion pack/ capitol city areas. There is the issue of resources getting scant for farming because of more farmers in some zones, but that is a tweakable sort of adjustment rather than a real issue. PVP realms will start having real woeld PVP going on, PVE players will have more factional fighting/ griefing going down. Just a tool to get the factional war and real world PVP going......
Cross-realm AH would destroy an entire facet of the game. Playing the AH relies on market inefficiencies and those would be virtually nonexistent in a true cross-realm AH. I can make gold by buying e.g. enchanting mats at the right time, pricing scrolls with a built-in profit, and waiting for someone to buy them out of impatience only because nobody else is selling the scroll for less at exactly the same time. WIth an effectively unlimited market someone will always be buying/selling at all times and those deltas between mat/product costs will never occur.
Totally agree but that is possibly a point in favour of cross-realm AH.Originally Posted by tawnos
I speak as someone that made millions exploiting the flaws but I couldn't really cry for sympathy if it happened as I have abused (and even deliberately engineered via aggressive tactics) the lack of competition in order to gain a monopoly position.
As populations shrink it is becoming too easy on some realms and factions for an individual to control the market to the detriment of the majority on that realm or faction.
Many markets are broken and need to be freed up. A bit of competition would be good for everyone.
Yeah granted it is easy for me to say having already taken my profits and run but we all know deep down that it isn't fair as things stand.
I can see that viewpoint but its definitely removing one of the attractions at the theme park to do so. Just as with any other competitive facet of the game being 'fair' isn't a requirement - its a competitive aspect of the game exactly because it allows those with skill or innate advantages to prosper in a tangible manner over those with less skill or advantages exactly like pvp, heroic raiding, etc. If Blizzard deems the continuation of the AH game to be too detrimental to aspects of the game it considers to be the core components I can buy the cross-realm AH as a potential solution but it shouldn't be thought of as something that comes with no loss. At some point it would also call into question why one would even continue to have an economic system if it is just going to be homogenized to the point where its not something that players can use to differentiate themselves and just becomes busy work prior to doing dungeons or raids.
I might come across a little harsh here, but if every AH player had their fun spoiled by small realms AHs getting merged with larger ones and the markets therein being made too big to manipulate, then thats your hard cheese my friend - play the game instead. Huge markets would be hard to monitor i guess, but I would rather see players on low pop realms being able to compete to the fullest of THEIR individual abilities, rather than be limited by their virtual bank balances or lack of consumables. The gains of cross realm AH far far out weigh the losses for everyone except AH players.
So the point of being undercut very quickly is true but you will also have sells increase a great deal as well so if the undercut rate is < sale rate you stuff will sell.
I haven't noticed a real difference in amount of gathering nodes on my server, but I have sympathy for those low-pop players getting their landscape denuded by players from other servers who *then go sell it on the other servers' AH.* (not the native pop's AH!) That last clause is what I never see addessed, and I think GC is being deliberately obtuse. He has to be. He can't be that dumb. He's just ignoring that part. Someone on the forums made a comparison to African diamond mines which is apt. The people who live near the diamond mines can't ever afford to buy them; it all goes to another country which jacks the price way up. It really gives me high blood pressure to see his quotes around which are, "Oh you wusses quit whining 'mommy someone stole my herbs and mines waaah.'"
The other hilarious thing is: apparently the only major advantage ever mentioned (at least for pve) is that "We'll see people out in the world. The world is empty. We feel all alone while leveling blah blah blah." Well guess what? It never used to be that way but now everybody is PHASED depending where they are on whatever quest chain they are doing. So they brought that problem on themselves (or rather brought it on the players). Anyway I can't count how many times I've seen another person running into a cave or just over a couple yards and suddenly they disappear into another server. So really I might see someone for a few seconds in a place like Icecrown and then poof! Kinda breaks the immersion right there.
Who actually complained that "the world is empty" anyway?
Oh let me guess.....that vocal minority on the forums again.
I don't know a single player that cares. They like having other people in the capitals to group up with for dungeons but don't particularly care to suffer the consequences of those players being out in the world when they want to do some questing.
This isn't GW2; other players in the world in WoW actually detract from the game experience rather than improving it as far as the average Joe out questing is concerned.
GC is digging himself a big hole when he starts making statements to the effect that players need to remember that "WoW isn't a single player game".
For most players WoW does not work well as a multiplayer game - it compares badly with its rivals. Even in a PVE environment it frequently pits players of the same faction against each other and causes a lot of friction between players. Whether it be questing or farming, GW2 has shown us that we don't need to force "friendly" players to fight against each other like rats in a barrel.
Perhaps GC could look at fixing that before "forcing" players together - wouldn't it be good if we actually had a reason to want to see and join up with other players. We all know that when levelling up in MOP the hostile NPC's will present little or no threat to us (you won't die even once) and that the main antagonists will be the other players using every trick in the book to steal quest mobs/items from us instead of assisting. I believe that most players find that stressful and irritating rather than fun.
I take the opposite point of view. Yes other humans CAN annoy and distress you ... this is AWESOME and why I play an MMO. As a player who's been here since the game was released I lament the loss of this over the years as this is exactly how the game began and it was indeed quite fun. Yes there were infuriating, frustrating, and downright awful moments ... but there were just as many if not more exceptional ones as well. In the end I'll take higher highs and lower lows over the even-keel we've seen since Wrath ... in the end that's far less entertaining. I for one firmly believe if you don't like playing video games with other humans, play single player games. There's some pretty amazing ones out there.
RIP Stormrage Horde ('05 - '11). Turaylon Horde since 11/11 where there's actually people
GM of Neolutum (always recruiting, PM me)
I'd argue if you want to play a griefing MMORPG go play EVE.
You could counter argue that I should be playing GW2.
My personal opinion with WoW being middle of the road in terms of the impact of other players, is that CRZ's should be restricted to PVP servers only.
The average WoW PVE player chose to play on a PVE server to lessen the impact of other players on their game experience when doing content that is primarily designed for solo play. It is a red herring to suggest that they should be playing a single play game - WoW has content that is designed for multiplayer and solo play and it is strictly that solo element that I am interested in. Sometimes we want to play in groups, sometimes we want to play peacefully on our own without other players ruining the experience. Solo content has a perfectly valid place within an MMORPG.
If Blizzard brought back large numbers of group quests in quest zones then you might have an argument that the questing content is not tailored for those moments when you wish to play to solo. So far everything Blizzard have done suggests that it is currently intended for those moments when you wish to play alone.
Anyway suppose Blizzard did bring back lots of group quests, why do you assume that the price to pay for having this would be the chance that other players damage your game experience? GW2 proves that you can have it both ways.
So far the only reason I can see for other players including those on the same faction hindering your progress is that by slowing you down they keep you playing...and paying for longer.
I am also slightly baffled as to what exceptional multiplayer moments you have had playing on a PVE server in the post-group quest "two-shot everything" era. I had them in RIFT, I can imagine how you might get them EVE too. But in 2011/12 WoW?! No way!
See I believe there is simply intrinsic value in having other players around, even if you are not cooperating with them. The human element simply adds a chaotic, random factor the game that I consider an important part of any MMO. As with real life human interaction I must concede that it can swing too steeply negative (griefing, abuse, exploits, etc ...) but I do believe the experience of interacting with other humans to be worth the potential negatives. Levelling up in Vanilla wow after release was quite the experience ... to be honest not that dissimilar to what we experience with each expansion only less frenzied and crowded.
Having other humans around, discussing the content that is new to all of you or asking for help with newly uncovered trials and sharing individual experiences, or doing completely unexpected things ... it is worth it and something I consider an important part of MMO content. It is the difference between listening to some amazing, soul-enlightening piece of music on your own versus listening to it at a concert full of similarly affected people. Yes you can be moved in a deep and spiritual way but it's more impactful when you literally feel the same spiritual elation pouring in from all around you.
Yes you can remain insular if you choose and worst case an annoying human may come along and kill your quest bunny just as you were about to collect 10/10 or whatever ... but that's a very minor annoyance and a small price to pay as far as I'm concerned. I believe the positives of a more socialized game, no matter how esoteric, far outweigh and outnumber the negatives. That's just my belief, however. Fortunately for me the devs seem to concur.
Last edited by feralminded; 09-18-2012 at 11:11 AM.
RIP Stormrage Horde ('05 - '11). Turaylon Horde since 11/11 where there's actually people
GM of Neolutum (always recruiting, PM me)
With the Cata launch, I remember being in Hyjal just minding my own business trying to get to 85...while having an 85 kill me about 3-6 times before moving on EVERY 20-30 minutes. You see, those who were able to take time off work or lived in Mom's basement all rushed to 85 while we were at work and they had less competition for mobs/quest items etc. The griefing was literally non-stop for nearly a month.
Once that griefing had faded for a while, here came the Molten Front dailies where you were nearly assured to be camped for ~30 minutes at a time, sometimes multiple times just in the course of completing one set of dailies.
You see, almost no pvp heavy servers are actually faction balanced. This obviously implies that MOST people are on the dominant side. I've played the other and I can honestly say F them and their idea of fun.
Edit
As to having other people around, I must say I do prefer it. My issue is with pvp and now (~$150 later which still pisses me off) I am on a pve server where that's not an issue. If I am leveling in, say Duskwoood, I would prefer to see some other people around gathering bear asses too.
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