Yes you should have to back off after a tuant swap. Very yes if the other tank is not expertise capped. IF this guide is aimed at newish tanks then definetly expertise cap; It may not be best of survivability or initial threat, but what it does it make you consistent, and it a lot easier for a inexpierenced tank to tank if he doesn't suddenly have to deal with be rage starved or suddenly have to deal with losing multiple mobs becuase they got parried.
I been afk for about 2 weeks only to come back to a whole page od texts
I wanne add a couple of points myself on the whole last page of posts
- CW v renewal -> i have since droppped CW and started using renewal for 2 reasons, higher ilvl is increasing my hp to the point where renewal is good enough healing wise. And secondly (imho most importantly) it is off GCD, meaning u can use it whenever without losing a GCD for a mangle or something else.
- meta gem choice: if you do not have acces to the legendairy meta -> agi/3% crit dmg, yes i know i myself said there is no advantage for gemming agi over the double value secondairy stats gems, but for metas this is different. That 3% crit dmg in a crit build is immense. If you however, have completed the collect 20 secrets part of the legendairy chain, the crit dps gem is simply OP and will imo get nerfed eventually, but untill then, get it. It increased my dps by approx 15-20% depending on RNG. Wich brings me to my last point.
- considering yourself a dps: most druids run with a crit build. meaning the dmg output, if played properly should be decent. I think, why shouldnt we focus on pushing as much dmg as possible? Killing a boss faster, even if enrage timers arent an issue, is still beneficial overall. Beeing able to clear more content in the same time is always better than the oposite ^^ I will take Jin rokh as an example. Sure u can tank him outside the pool and no have to worry about the static busrt damaging ppl in the water. Sure you could use incar on tank swap to make sure you hold aggro. What i do is different however. Play like a dps with the ability for a boss to smack u in the face and not fall over and die Meaning, I pre pot -> beserk. Tank it in the pool, use incar when in the pool AND with a decent vengeance stack + re pot. On our last heroic JR kill i was top dps, granted, i have the legendairy meta, but our dps are far from bad, I produced a whooping 200k dps. Tank dps is, imho, an important part of the overall dps.
anyway, thats my input. I hope the points were helpfull to some1 out there ^^
* a link to the JR kill WoL http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/pc9z6e4rfpomcl6a/sum/damageDone/?s=1104&e=1351
Minor status update:
The two set bonus for T15 (each dodge while SD is active adds 10% to the next FR you use, stacking up to 10 times, 10s buff duration) is better than it looks on some fights. Where it shines is when you're dealing with multiple adds meleeing on you all at once, because each attack that you dodge counts as 1 towards the stack and refreshes the stack each time. If you're the bat tank on Horridon, it really shows off its worth, as you will be at 10 stacks (2xFR with a Vengeance stack up makes even an under-Raged FR still do something useful) but on something like Garalon, who doesn't swing very fast, not so much. Remember it has to be a melee swing, though, since that's the only thing that you can dodge. I'd recommend going with a hybrid 2T14 (lowers the cooldown of Might of Ursoc by a minute)/2T15 combo rather than the 4 set of either one, at least until you can fill out 502 or better in your remaining slots. Also, going with that makes Renewal a little more attractive, since now you have alternating 30% health restores every other minute (2 minute cooldown on each, use one every minute as needed).
And Tjomek: I got my legendary DPS meta last week, and it is as good as advertised. It clocked in nicely at 14.5% of my DPS for the entire night, which was instrumental in our group's one shot of Horridon last night (second kill ever) as I put up 30K DPS more week over week. I'll be testing out the stam legendary meta next, as soon as I get another hat I can put it in -- I have a backup T14-based stam set I can use if stam is an issue.
so they're buffing mastery an awful lot now....any thoughts on that being a viable gem/reforge option over crit? do just to the active mitigation from more mastery instead of the proc'd mastery from SD?
Me personally, i love the buff but i will still remain to ignore mastery as it only protects from physicle, a full on rage build protects you from melee (throu high SD uptime) and spelldmg (throu lots of FR)
@ Tielyn: Looks like they stealth fixed the proc rate for the dps meta when used by a guardian. Its still a higher dps increase compared to other tanks that use the meta but less of a gap
Last edited by Tjomek; 05-20-2013 at 10:23 PM.
Budlyght -- I'll check into it this evening, but even with a buff, I don't see Mastery as a viable mainline gear respec/reforge; as Tjomek says, you're still better off working with Rage generation any way you see best and taking your survival into your own hands.
I see it more as a 'since we know folks are not spec'ing into Mastery, we're making it more attractive/useful no matter what level you have it at.' At the moment, I'm carrying a set of high mastery gear (since I'm feral offspec normally), and switching to the cat set added 10% Mastery and got me a whopping 1% extra damage reduction, roughly. Remember we already got a buff back in 5.2, so they're adjusting the numbers so we're less squishy baseline.
Tjomek -- I was wondering about that. It seemed like week over week the damage contribution went down a chunk, from 19% to 12%. Knew it was too good to last. Do you have confirmation of this somewhere, or is it just the sense of it, like I have?
Also: Does anyone else use Weakauras? I've been playing with Theck's paladin setups (I had a long weekend) and have started putting together some experimental bear buttons; any interests or requests?
Just to clarify a 1% increase in damage reduction isn't going to be a 1% decrease in damage taken (all other things being equal). Say for example with out the buff you have a 75% damage reduction from armour. so when you get hit for 100K you take 25K, if you got buffed and now have a 76% DR from armour you would only get hit for 24K thats actually a 4% decrease in damage taken.
Last edited by Tengenstein; 05-21-2013 at 04:46 PM.
I agree with you guy, and so do the majority of bears, that using geming/reforging for crit is better due to the better rage generation (plus damage done) but when is it enough crit. Im currently at 52.5% crit in bear form without any raid buffs and 120k armor. Dont know if there is a sweet spot that you guys are going for as far as how much crit you want or if its just a "no such thing as too much" train of thought. Thanks for the help yall
No matter what your mastery is, every little bit will help, yes. But it takes a lot of mastery to go a little ways further -- some numbers post-patch now that I'm sitting in front of my character sheet:
My normal 'tanking' set: 46% crit, 28.01% Mastery, 100,443 Armor (68.47% damage reduction)
Switching to my Mastery-heavy cat set: 37% crit, 43.18% Mastery, 109,935 armor, (70.38% damage reduction).
That's trading off 9% crit for the extra damage reduction, and I'm not sure I really want to give that much crit up for so little damage reduction, even if it's more than the 2% on the sheet less damage taken.
As far as 'is there a sweet spot' -- if you hit 100% crit, let me know. Seems like 522 gear can get you up to 50% now if you gem heavy crit, but because I've been nominated as the bat tank on Tortos and my Stam is a little low-ish, I've been having to trade off pure crit for crit/stam so the bats don't eat me. Mostly because right after a Quake Stomp, that was taking me under the 350K mark, and there's a timing flux point where the whole flock of bats are there at the same time and it's an instant death without some sort of defensive cooldown running. So as Sejta said, 'go in as DPS, regem for more survival as needed.'
Also, random find about Haste -- unlike other DoT-based classes, it does not improve your ticks on Lacerate. All it really does is reduce your melee white damage timer, which is probably why they put in Tooth and Claw to make using Haste and Maul a little more attractive.
Haste only improves caster DoT/Hot tick speeds, Hunters, Rogues, Warrior, Deathknights and Druids arent' casters and such haste doesn't affect our dots
and thats 9% crit for 6% less physical damage taken.
So noted. I've been noodling about with my resto druid spec for the past few weeks and working on my Demonology 'lock, and researching the haste vs. ticks on those classes, and I'd never uncovered that the haste only was useful for caster classes. Learned something new!
And I was thinking about the damage reduction versus crit tradeoff while driving to work this morning. 6% less physical damage might be pretty damned useful on some fights -- but is it better if you're mitigating down from one giant hit (Horridon) or bunches of smaller ones (Tortos as the bat tank)? If so, it might be worth setting up a stam/mastery set (as much as the thought makes me grit my teeth) just for heavy damage progression attempts...
The Weakauras thing I'm playing with is a timing meter for Lacerate and Thrash that has a Venegance counter on top of it, shamelessly modified off of Theck's Paladin one -- it shows your current damage values applied to the boss versus roughly what you'll put on if you refresh them. This isn't terribly useful for damage mitigation, mind, but what it's really good for is keeping high ambient DoTs (and the resulting threat) on your main target (it's the difference between having a DoT that does 23Kx5 versus 8Kx5 in live testing so far, but finding that Haste doesn't give it more ticks means that it's somewhat less. I'm slowly adding things to it as I figure out what I want in there before I download what he did and discover I've reinvented the wheel.