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Thread: Survival Instincts: A (Somewhat) Official Guide to Druid Guardian Tanking

  1. #101
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Zafira pointed out last night that Soul of the Forest also includes a 15% bonus to Mangle damage, so that it has a benefit other than the rage buff. That wasn't in the patch notes. I'm not sure I'm convinced that it beats out Incarnation's burst damage versus overall over time yet -- my guild doesn't raid until Thursday, so I haven't had a chance to try it on anything other than Niuzao and Chi-Ji.

    Gift of Ysera, meanwhile, is horribly overpowered right now at high health -- there's something very wrong when the tank is higher on the healing meters than the healers, even if it was the gimmick fight Niuzao (...seeing myself with over 2 million health was kinda fun...), but even at my base self-buffed health of 737K that's still a 37K heal reliably every 5 seconds.

    The new DoC Healing Touch is healing for about 135-180K at light Vengeance levels, which is somewhat less than what I was getting when it was based off of Agility with the old double stacked NS/HT+DoC combo pre-5.4. However, it's interesting to think about maybe using glyphed FR now, since I found myself constantly rage-capped (while using SotF with a 70% base crit on Mangle) well before my Savage Defense fell off, and I wound up resorting to using Maul just to burn off the excess rage.

    Will comment more after I've got some raid-ready numbers.

  2. #102
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    I agree with you... although I am hearing from other Druids that Heart of the Wild is better than DoC. But I just don't see how. The constant stam nice, but I only see an increase from 830kish to 875k raid buffed. Using it on cooldown uses GCDs to cast Rejuv on yourself when you could be using other mitigations and it uses spell power vs DoC heals using attack power

    But I am also in the firm belief that the tanking role is to survive the fight, whether that is through mitigation or healing, and make the healers life easier.

    At the moment, I see more benefit to not glyphing Frenzied Regen only if you have the 2 pc bonus from T15 which increases your Frenzied heals when you dodge with Savage Defense up because I see 200 to 300k heals from a fully buffed Frenzied from that 2 pc... which if timed right can easily even out spikes in damage

  3. #103
    Never glyph FR.

    DoC is better when you don't need/want HotW for something specific. Sure it's a DPS loss but it's much more substantial raid utility.

  4. #104
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Am being a little slow on updating the Guide for this patch since I'm working on experimenting with the new talents, and updating the Gear list for new 90s while I'm at it, and conferring with the other bears I know for their experiences.

    SotF seems to be their choice, though I'm not sure I agree; the Talent gives a lot of smoothed out Rage generation in trade for a lack of burst from Incarnation. In a high crit build, Surania says that he can pretty much ride Maul whenever he's not having to hit FR, which ought to reduce damage on high melee bosses that much further.

    DoC synergizes with SotF, since the 10% bonus crit goes with the extra rage gen on crits rather nicely, and so far I've had to use the Nature's Swiftness battlerez at least once or twice a week ever since the patch hit. On the other paw, Elebez and Telamir still prefer Heart of the Wild for the empowered Tranquility. Haven't tried switching back to Nature's Vigil since the patch, I admit....

    Hope to have everything updated by the end of this weekend.

  5. #105
    SotF will give less DPS than Incarnation, but slightly more Rage over the same 3 minute duration. So really you take Incarnation for encounters with burst/burn phases, and SotF otherwise.

    HotW Tranq......eh. There's like 2 normal encounters where it's useful: Malkorok (assuming raid soaking) and Thok. Everywhere else a normal Tranq does just fine for whatever you need (Garrosh, Nazgrim, Jugg, Galakras, Pride), or you can't use it at all.

  6. #106
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Have you guys looked much at the Druid module on simcraft, seems to be fairly up to date.
    Harsh Words and Steel: A Protection Warrior Guide
    MoP RPS Calculator

    Hunters, Just get a Sporebat, most LFRs will be missing that buff.

  7. #107
    Not since I posted a whole host of bugs with it 6 months ago or so.

    I know Pawkets recently found and fixed some more bugs which were causing massively wrong TMI values. I haven't tested it yet though, as I have other things that need doing.

  8. #108
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Preliminary Beta Survival Guide for Bears:
    Patch Notes for 6.0.2 for Bears: Little Bears, Now With More Fuzzy

    Greetings, Guardians. Welcome to the new bears. Not the same as the old bears, by far; hope you enjoyed your year and change as the monsterbear tank of Critical Mass, because it’s gone.

    Survival Guide, the Quick Version
    The bad news
    - Less armor multiplier from gear (350% -> 250%), and it absorbs less damage from Magical (25%->12%) and Physical (12%->0)
    - Less Savage Defense uptime; 2 charges instead of 3, 12 second recharge instead of 9. Managed Frenzied Regen is the way to go.
    - Less health, and that’s after the stat squish.
    - Less Rage generation buttons and capabilities. (Primal Fury now only gives 8 Rage on a crit, down from 15)
    - Agility no longer increases your crit. It still increases your Dodge, but the conversion rate got nerfed. It also only gives 1 AP per point of Agi instead of 2, which would almost make Str and Agi the same, except Str increases your Parry, not Dodge.
    - Vengeance is gone - it’s been replaced by Resolve, which increases your self-healing / absorption casts based on your Stamina pool and the amount of damage you’ve been taking.
    - Barkskin is now back to a 1 minute cooldown (up from 30 seconds)
    - Ysera’s Gift got nerfed down to 2% of your health every 5 seconds (it used to be 5%).
    - Nurturing Instinct is gone - no bonus Agi->Spell Healing buff.

    The ‘good’ news:
    - Survival Instincts now has 2 charges.
    - Tooth and Claw now has 2 charges.
    - Primal Fury now generates Rage when you hit (not DoT tick) with _any_ Bear ability instead of just Mangle and Autoattack.
    - Lacerate and Thrash no longer have cooldowns. Lacerate now generates 2 Rage per hit, and Thrash now generates 1 Rage per tick.
    - Mastery is no longer a straight Armor buff; instead it’s an absorb shield against Physical attacks based on 12% base+Mastery percentage of the attack. Also increases your Attack Power.
    - Mangle, Maul, (and Frenzied Regeneration, not that you'll have enough Rage to cast FR twice in 1.35 seconds) cooldowns are now affected by Haste.
    - No more reforges, but no more Hit or Expertise requirements either. (On your gear and gems: Hit is now Crit. Expertise is now Haste. Any hybrid gems you have have been converted accordingly, though check your Piercing Wild Jades - they were bugged last time I checked and only gives 10 Crit. -- unverified though.) Zafira notes that it means that Blue Hit gems are now Blue Crit gems, which will do nice things for sockets.

    Your new rotation until level 100 (when you get to use Pulverize):
    - Mangle > Lacerate
    - Keep the Thrash DoT up for Mangle procs, or to generate Rage on large groups.
    - Maul if you think you have the Rage for it, but see above: 'lower rage generation.'
    - Skip Faerie Fire except for ranged pulls, or if you glyphed it for silence. It no longer can reset Mangle and no longer applies Weakened Armor.

    Your Stat Priority (Tentative):
    Mastery > Versatility > Agility > (Multistrike) > Crit ~ Haste > Stamina
    The 50% Crit and Haste bear buffs are gone, but Crit and Haste are still useful for Rage generation.
    Agi is still worth Dodge and AP, and with the loss of the Vengeance buff, you might need it for threatgen, potentially.

    Versatility and Multistrike might not be available on any gear until the new expansion hits (but Mark of the Wild gives people 3% Versatility). Ditto for Bonus Armor, Leech, and Avoidance.
    - Versatility is an overall damage reducer/damage producer.
    - Multistrike gives you temporary Stamina buffs when it triggers, but it takes a lot of it to be of much use.

    Buttons Removed:
    - Enrage.
    - Might of Ursoc
    - Bear Hug
    - Innervate (for bears)
    - Nature’s Grasp
    - Symbiosis
    - Swipe
    - Leader of the Pack (for bears)

    Things You’ll Want to Change:
    Level 75 Talent: Incarnation is a lot less useful now that Thrash and Lacerate are Instants. You might want to go with Soul of the Forest even though it’s been nerfed (Mangle hits give 5 rage instead of 10)
    Level 90 Talent: If you had Heart of the Wild, it no longer increases your stats. So the ONLY thing it does is give you bonus healing powers or cat damage when you use it on its once-per-fight cooldown. Go with Dream of Cenarius instead.

    I'll be writing a more formal post later, but I wanted to get something out there for folks.
    Last edited by Tielyn; 10-14-2014 at 01:37 AM.

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    For the stat priority, this is mostly from playing around on the beta, and some general feels. I know it doesn't agree with the Simcraft results, but I'm not convinced that the Simcraft was set up right last I checked.

    Definitely feel free to add things I missed if you see something. I won't be offended.


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