When I asked if the removal of parry and dodge stats from equipment is an idea worth lobbying for, I kind of meant it the other way around - is it an idea you think without merit and would shoot down?
I do not think it is a surprise to Blizzard that dodge and parry are the lowest priorities of any tanking class that can get them, and I do think that some people at Blizzard are suggesting the removal of dodge and parry from gear and tweaking the tanking mechanics so a benefit is gained, in some way, from haste and crit on all tanking classes.
I do think it is a discussion worth having.
In terms of competing for "dps plate" that is a perspective that deserves a fuller picture.
Cloth/int - with spirit: Used by 3 priest specs
Cloth/int - without spirit: User by 6 mage and lock specs and potentially used by 1 priest spec a lot and a little by 2 other priest specs.
Leather/int - with or without spirit: Used by 2 druid specs and 1 monk spec
Leather/agi: Used by 3 rogue specs, 2 druid specs, 2 monk specs
Mail/int - with or without spirit: Used by 2 shaman specs
Mail/agi: Used by 1 shaman spec and 3 hunter specs
Plate/int - with or without spirit: Used by 1 paladin spec
Plate/str - without dodge + parry: Used by 2 dk specs, 2 warrior specs, 1 paladin spec
Plate/str - with dodge / parry: Used by 1 dk spec, 1 warrior spec, 1 paladin spec
Neck+cloak+ring+trinket/int - with spirit: Used by 3 priest, 1 monk, 2 druid, 2 shaman, 1 paladin spec
Neck+cloak+ring+trinket/int - without spirit: Used by 1 priest, 3 mage, 3 lock, 1 druid, 1 shaman spec
Neck+cloak+ring+trinket/agi: Used by 3 rogue, 2 druid, 2 monk, 3 hunter, 1 shaman spec
Neck+cloak+ring+trinket/str - without dodge + parry: Used by 2 dk, 2 warrior, 1 paladin spec
Neck+cloak+ring+trinket/str - with dodge/parry (or other tanking setup on trinkets): 1 dk, 1 warrior, 1 paladin spec
My point is there already is a vast disparity in the amount of competition for specific types of items. While this proposed change would mean plate/str would become an 8 spec affair, this is not a huge departure from the 7 spec mess of leather/agi.
In a sense, this big picture highlights that in many ways it would be bad for plate tanks if this change was implemented. Right now we have a low number of tanks in a raid who end up with no competition for tank loot. If tank loot drops, you get it. No other class enjoys the same level of preferential loot allocation, with the exception of holy paladins. And yet, I would rather have it the other way.
Getting rid of parry and dodge on gear would mean that no single piece of equipment should be 100% tank focused (aside from trinkets) - this would mean losing all stamina socket bonuses on items - but this is something the leather users don't enjoy anyway, so it's something we know that Blizzard knows how to address in tanking mechanics.
The basic idea is that I want you to be able to wear your tanking gear, go dps (change away from shield) and do reasonably well in the same gear. I do not want stats on your tanking gear give ZERO dmg when you are dps specced.
Similarly, I want you to be able to wear your dps gear, spec tank (put on a shield) and do reasonably well in the same gear. I do not want stats on your dps gear to have ZERO tanking benefit when you are tank specced.
I'm not suggesting that the same gem/reforge job should be optimal for both roles, but rather that the all the stats on your gear should at least do something.
Of course, this highlights the problem with stamina gemming. If your tank set is including a lot of stamina gems/enchants those are stats that will do nothing when you change to dps. Already (at least at lower content levels) monks and druid gem/enchant for something other than stamina, in their tanking gear. This highlights that it is possible for tank specs to scale a secondary stat (or agi/str) to be more effective for tanking than stamina - and to make the right decision easier they should maybe just remove gems and enchants that focus on stamina. And scale fights accordingly. Maybe give tanks 25-35% stamina bonus instead of 15-25%.
While strictly speaking unrelated, what also brings me to the idea that all stats on your gear should do something was Teng's post earlier in this thread about experimenting with putting lots of crit on his gear (earlier PTR patch, not the current) and assessing his output in solo situations and 5 mans. This was immediately offensive to me, and I had to think a little to figure out why. The logic is still a bit muddled, but I think the picture is at least explainable, if not clear.
If it is viable, and indeed attractive, for solo and small group action to take your prot gear into a crit direction it means that if I invest high end raiding properties in my prot gear, I'm losing out - on something that could be fun. While this is not a cross spec delineation as the one above, it is highlighting that if you take your equipment in the direction of tanking you make it crippled and useless for any other purpose. This is not a problem experienced by druid and monk tanks to the same degree.
In our raids we have a feral druid, who may have a tanking trinket or two, but who is predominantly geared for feral. And when we need to spot fill a tank he just changes spec and tanks - in his dps gear - heroic 25 man content.
If the story had been the other way around and he was one of our main tanks and on a fight we needed only one tank, he could change spec and dps - in his tank gear - heroic 25 man content - and not suck monkey balls. Plate tanks with huge investments in dodge and parry (and stamina) do not get to do this.
If, in our raid, I was required to dps, it would be more beneficial to the raid if I change to my undergeared hunter than try to dps on the warrior. Yes, I do get fifth/sixth pick on dps plate, and I do have a dps set, but it's actually behind the ilvl of my hunter.
To get things slightly back on track - something in my mind is screaming active mitigation. Dk is the classic example of this. In Cataclysm I remember a lot of talk about dodge and parry being useless but that you should stack mastery because it improved both the healing and the absorb of death strike immensely.
Point being, we do not really need dodge and parry as stats that we can improve in the game. We can have a 0% dodge and parry chance, or a 5% dodge and parry chance. But it doesn't matter - now that we have active mitigation we do not need a mechanic in the game that allows us to improve dodge and parry.
In fact, if I was really forward looking, and looking to remove dodge and parry from the game, introducing active mitigation might be the first thing I'd do. This would underline that dodging and parrying are unreliable "old fashioned" tanking mechanics and deserve to be put out to pasture.
Or if they are not that forward looking they might examine the state of tanking now and determine that active mitigation obviates the need for erratic, random tanking mechanics like parry and dodge.
Yeah, I said obviate. Nice word, no?
I'm not a cliff's notes person, but I do want to highlight a couple of things I do feel would logically follow a removal of parry and dodge from items:
1) Stamina socket bonuses, stamina gems and stamina dominant enchants need to be removed from the game
2) Passive tank stamina bonuses need to improve from their current 15-25% range. Maybe to a 25-35% range.