Harsh Words and Steel: A Protection Warrior Guide

[Gregasaurous]

Yes.

a) DR does not matter on the pull
b) DPS does
c) ST are SA are not self exclusive
d) TC in on GCD and you can only fit so many into recklessness uptime

Not mattering =/= redundant. I think that word choice is what threw me off entirely, but I think I understand what you were saying now. It could serve you well to be a little less brief in your counter arguments. Back on topic, I would still highly disagree with sunders being your "first" priority. But yes, if you're looking for big numbers on the pull, TC can wait.

[Dreador]

9 or 24 other people in the raid that can debuff.

[Tengenstein]

Right, what buffs you need to provide will total depends on the raid group and how they glyph.Druids and rogues can both Fully stack the weakened armour debuff in a single GCD, so for maximum raid dps, they are who should be doing it on the pull. If its important enough for the prot warrior to screw over his on the pull rotation, making him take more damage and increasing the risk of DPS over aggroing those classes can spare the one GCD. In fact Combat rogues, Arms warriors and Balance druids should be the sunder bitches as there simming below prot on DPS.

What i would do to maximise pull potential;
Shout
Shattering Throw
Charge+ZR+HL+DS
SHield slam>Rev>Dev

and weave TC in place of the first Dev. hopefully before DS runs off,

[Gregasaurous]

What i would do to maximise pull potential;
Shout
Shattering Throw
Charge+ZR+HL+DS
SHield slam>Rev>Dev

ST costs 25 rage, shout generates 20, so you need to pop ZR beforehand.

[Tengenstein]

good point.

[kopcap]

Regardless of who puts what, getting sunders up should be a higher raid priority than TC.

[Takethecake]

Rogues should never be applying weaken armor debuff. It requires 75 energy or 25 energy and a major glyph to do so which is a blatant waste of dps. Now that faerie fire always applies 3 stacks they should be using it on the pull to ensure maximum dps. However in 10 man situations without a druid I would agree with Kopcap, I would say sunder armor should be a priority.

Thunderclap on or near the pull for solo tank fights shouldn't be a huge priority. Given all the hots / absorbs / earthshield and other affects on you when you pull, waiting 4-5 GCD should not be a huge deal. Plus given that more than likely people will be using DS on the pull anyways. I haven't had a boss almost kill me on the pull for years... closest thing in cata would be HM hagara.

In the end it all comes down to personal preference or even raid preference. Just like no two guilds use exactly the same boss strats, no two tanks need to use exactly the same pull rotation.

[Tengenstein]

Only if said rogue is able to out DPS the prot warrior, if the prot warrior is the player pulling the lowest DPS, yes they should be the sunder bitch, unfortunaltly quite a few specs are currently simming below protection @90 and have the options to put up 3 stacks in a single GCD. so the question becomes do you have the person pulling x dps spend 3 GCDs to put it up or the person pulling 0.9x dps put it up in one

[Bodasafa]

What i would do to maximise pull potential;
Shout
Shattering Throw
Charge+ZR+HL+DS
SHield slam>Rev>Dev

and weave TC in place of the first Dev. hopefully before DS runs off,

Couldn't I just Shout + ZR in a macro and call that done?

Also how do I charge and heroic leap at the same time, or did you mean one or the other?

[Dreador]

Couldn't I just Shout + ZR in a macro and call that done?

Also how do I charge and heroic leap at the same time, or did you mean one or the other?

I macro shout/ZR/arcane torrent (hated blood elf, lolfreerage) and it works great. The only time you wouldn't want it would be on a fight with a 30 second convenience fear.

Charge/HL

#showtooltip
/cast charge
/cast heroic leap

They changed it so if you leap, then charge the leap does no damage. But if you charge first and leap mid air it will still hit. One keypress should do it, also.

[Gregasaurous]

On a unrelated note, does anybody know of a add-on that displays your current vengeance more conveniently than hovering your mouse over your buffs (or just total attack power works too). I was thinking it would be nice to have in cases where you want to time Sbars so you know how much absorb you're about to get and whether or not you're going to need a minor CD to go with it.

[Quietsch]

protwarbar

[Dreador]

protwarbar

x100000000

I only use the rage bar and vengeance bar, it has other features as well. The vengeance bar will display how much veng you have, as well as a rough estimate of how big your shield barrier will be given your current rage (20/40/60). Pretty cool.

[Gregasaurous]

Sweet. I knew there would be something good, just a matter of finding the right key words. Thanks guys!

[Mixie]

Upon which Strucker created following macro

you should replace the number I've highlighted in blue with whatever your naked parry chance is. it will return you a number if this is higher than the ideal parry dodge ratio you should lower your parry for more dodge.

maybe I'm blind, but I'm not seeing the blue highlights of what numbers to change in said macro

[Tengenstein]

ah thats a relic form an earlier macro

[Selendis]

For generating rage, I'm seeing alot of expertise = hit all over the place. Why is that?
with the (extremely simple) calculation I did based on whatever I had equipped I ended up seeing the same %-gain from expertise and hit, and with hit only reducing miss chance, while expertise reduces both dodge and parry... I know some of our abilities cannot be dodged/parried, but still.. shield slam and revenge can.

I have this feeling I'm missing something obvious...

the extremely simple "calculation" was:
660 expertise rating = 1,94%
1,94/660 = 0,00293939 %/rating

254 hit rating = 0.75%
0.75/254 = 0,00295276 %/rating

[Takethecake]

They changed expertise so it only affects dodge until dodge is removed from the table, then it affects parry. So the first 7.5% of expertise removes dodge and the second 7.5% removes parry. Effectively the only difference between hit and expertise is that some abilities can't be dodged/parried and some can't be missed, so for those specific abilities one may be better than the other. Overall they are almost equal in overall output for warriors. I think I remember reading that for paladins hit is slightly better.

[shuuhei]

maybe I'm blind, but I'm not seeing the blue highlights of what numbers to change in said macro

I found using Strucker's original macro it worked fine copying / pasting in the chat window without having to punch in any additional numbers specific to my character with no errors. It was back on post 162 as I have it quoted below.

/run local d,p,s= GetCombatRating(3), GetCombatRating(4), UnitStat('player',1); print(format("Parry/Dodge Ratio\nIdeal: %.2f\nYours: %.2f",(3.603456*d-.928*s)/d,p/d))

Im not sure if the formula used in the macro is still relevant, but it helped me get to the correct ratio using the reforge option.

[Selendis]

They changed expertise so it only affects dodge until dodge is removed from the table, then it affects parry. So the first 7.5% of expertise removes dodge and the second 7.5% removes parry. Effectively the only difference between hit and expertise is that some abilities can't be dodged/parried and some can't be missed, so for those specific abilities one may be better than the other. Overall they are almost equal in overall output for warriors. I think I remember reading that for paladins hit is slightly better.

ah, so I did miss something everyone else knew thanks!