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Thread: [Prot] 4pc T12 w/Bale helm or 2pc T12 w/Rag shoulders, Bale helm, Beth chest? Or..?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2011

    [Prot] 4pc T12 w/Bale helm or 2pc T12 w/Rag shoulders, Bale helm, Beth chest? Or..?

    I've been doing some research lately as to what final upgrades I should be looking at from our weekly FL clears as we dabble in HMs (Shannox HM killed, working on Majordomo). I have seen several main schools of thought and I'm wondering which, if any, is mathematically better (I am terrible at math so I cannot do the math myself)

    1) 4pc T12: Chest/legs/hands/shoulders, Baleroc Helm. This is what I'm currently aiming for and waiting for Mr. I-wish-I-was-the-Balrog (aka Baleroc) to drop the helmet.

    2) 4pc T12: Chest/legs/hands/head, Ragnaros shoulders. Ask Mr. Robot seems to suggest this when I ask for "Best in Slot" with my current gear.

    3) 4pc T12: Legs/hands/shoulders/head, Beth'tilac chest. AMR has also suggested this in the past.

    4) 2pc T12: Legs/hands, Baleroc Helm, Beth'tilac chest, Ragnaros shoulders. This seems to be the "cutting edge" setup used by (or was used by) most of the high-end raiding tanks, but that seems to be because they passed on tier pieces to DPS/healers first and so may no longer be a valid thing to do.

    Out of those four choices, does it all boil down to personal preference and gear mixing to reach 102.4%, or is one of the above a clear-cut winner? The Bale helm seems worlds away better than the T12 helm, but the Ragnaros shoulders seem largely inferior to the T12 ones due to less Mastery (although possibly better if one is already at the cap due to no wasted threat stat).

    I'm specifically trying to decide if the Rag shoulders drop if I'm going to roll on them or pass them to somebody's O/S.
    Last edited by Arothand; 10-24-2011 at 04:51 PM.

  2. #2
    I believe it is a little bit tougher for warrior's to get to block cap, but for my pally im trying to get rid of mastery with: Rag shoulders, baleroc helm, parry/mastery baleroc gloves, tier chest/legs. Every piece is heroic so that might have something to do with it.

    I am pretty sure there would be a best setup but I think it has changed many times throughout firelands because of the Rag shoulders change, from hit dodge to mastery dodge.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    4Piece with baleroc head if only for the fact that 391 shoulders are within reach and the 397 ones from rag aren't.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2010
    My guilds warrior is doing the same bigbad recommended (im a pally so i cant speak for myself), hes going 4pc-set bonus with offset helm. I think he knows what he is doing.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Quote Originally Posted by Arothand View Post
    does it all boil down to personal preference
    I would say yes, it does. I went with option 4, except with tier shoulders because the Ragnaros ones refused to drop and because Domo heroic is easy. Depending on the loot RNG, you might find yourself in this position too. I just don't find the 4pc to be compelling. I know some people do like it, and if you were one of those then you should take one of the other options.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    I actually did crunch the numbers, and basically any way you go, getting you 4 piece is going to be a loss of avoidance or mastery. So the question is, what would you rather sacrifice? If you're below 102.4 passive CTC, you want option 1. The fact that it's tier put aside, I would almost grab those shoulders regardless just because they have a LOT of mastery. I'm not the only one who makes this decision.
    People usually go with Firebound Gorget over the Valor piece (it has heroic upgrade and a LOT of mastery)
    Most people grab Uncrushable Belt of Fury (drops off shannox I believe) and I do believe there's another option though I can't remember off the top of my head.
    Anyway, go with Tier shoulders if you want the 4 piece, they're upgradeable (Less than 600 guilds have downed HM Rag, there's about 7000 6/7, let's be honest with each other, HM rag shoulders are not a viable upgrade.) And they will push you towards passive CTC. And personally I'm a very big fan of our 4 set. On most fights you should pretty much just have you SB maccroed to something to give it roughly a 33% up-time. +6% parry another 33% of the time is pretty good in my book.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    I try to keep SB going up all the time; I'm at the point right now with Mastery Elixir, Food, and Battle Shout up I'm at the cap without Shield Block going. I don't think I can hit it without elixir though no matter what, so the question is I guess if I want to push CTC and see if I can hit 102.4% without using the mastery elixir (it gets expensive having to buy like 20 or more each week, they sell for quite a bit on my realm so it costs a lot) by using some non-tier pieces, but the 4pc seems like it's more avoidance overall whether I'm at the cap or not.

    I have yet to see the Rag shoulders; normal obv as I'm not deluding myself into thinking I'll ever see HM Rag, let alone kill him but I know some of the plate in my group would love to roll OS on them if I decide not to take them. Looks-wise it'd be cool to have it just to "show" that I've killed Rag while I'm standing around Trade, but I'm not about to take an inferior item if it's going to hurt my overall CTC.

    I pretty much have everything except for the Bale helm and maybe Domo bracers or Beth'tilac sword. I have Heroic Uncrushable Belt, Firebound Gorget (I pass on the firestones when they drop though in favor of DPS/Heals), crafted boots, 4pc (Chest/hands/legs/shoulders)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2010

    [Prot] 4pc T12 w/Bale helm or 2pc T12 w/Rag shoulders, Bale helm, Beth chest? Or..?

    It BLOWS having to wait for OS to roll for tier...but the Bale helm and Alys or Rag shoulder just seem better. Also holding out for the Beth chest. I like the look of pally tier. Wish the stats made it desireable.
    "he doens't need healing, he doesn't need healing, he doesn't nee-WHAOSHIT!wtf was that man!". Please stop leaning on TDR. -Teng

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    I did the math : http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?77469-T12-Tanking-Pieces-Comparision-Spreadsheet

    Your best setup is the best setup that is available to you.

    In short, T12H, pre H Rag (6/7H):
    Offset Head (391 Baleroc) 10159.6
    Offset Chest (391 Beth) 9988.4
    Full set (378 Helm) 9913.9
    Offset Chest (391 Domo) 9864.6
    Offset Shoulders (391 Alys) 9830.4
    Offset Shoulders (384 Rag) 9824.1

    T12 H :
    Offset (H Rag) Shoulders 10432.2
    Offset (H Baleroc) Head 10159.6
    Offset (H Beth) Chest 10138.9
    Full set 10064.3

    Mess with the sheet mix&match if you want. You'll have to save a copy to do so.

    Full CTC coverage is not that big of a deal. At 1% off unhittable, you have 0.01% chances to get 2 full melee swing in a row. Include 4p at 6% parry with ~33% uptime (or even higher if you include tank swaps etc).
    Last edited by veksen; 11-08-2011 at 08:44 AM.

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