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Thread: Warrior tank on Beth'tilac

  1. #1
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    Warrior tank on Beth'tilac

    Hey guys,
    sorry to bother you with a run of the mill post asking about why I am taking too much damage. However, tonight, during my guild runs on Beth'tilac, I found myself taking a lot more damage than I thought I should have been. I was the assigned tank to go up onto the web, with a skilled disc priest healing me, and I found that on numerous occasions I was dropping to sub 40k health.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ut6k4e766wlhvx29/ These are the logs for the entire night.

    As I am sure you can guess, I am Wrathofdark. Any advice that can be offered would be greatly appreciated.

    (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...hofdark/simple)

  2. #2
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    You only blocked/dodges/parried/miss like 65% of her melee attacks on some attempts, that could of put your healer behind on your heals im not sure how to play warrior but on my paladin i only get hit by a full attack like 7-8% of the time , also the raid was taking all kinds of damage from spinners you should check out how to handle them better, way i have done it is leave a melee down and have 1 go up.. the melee and tank thats on lower floor as well as the hunter taunt every cd (as soon as spinners spawn to avoid all the damage you guys were taking (1 or 2ranged) could get off drone to help out with spinners that are shooting at the raid)
    other than that is to practice the fight untill every thing goes smoothly

  3. #3
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    Yeah the excessive amount of unmitigated melee attacks is what is troubling me. Given that i am above the avoidance soft cap, and was,popping shield block each time I went up there, my number of unmitigated attacks should have been a lot lower. At most i would have been hit in the back once, due to poor positioning on my part, but 13%+ is too much.@Frank.. cheers for the advice. At the moment we are doing:Warrior tank, disc priest and frost dk up tophunter and boomkin on spiderlingsfrost dk and mage (if needed) on spinnersDruid tank and floating dps on the drone.but I agree, spinners were the main problem.also, won't a pally always mitigate more attacks because their mastery adds block at a greater rate than a warriors will add critical block? My understanding was that warriors will take less damage from blocks, but pallies will block more.cheers again for the advice

  4. #4
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    Sorry for the poor formatting, type that on my phone

  5. #5
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    I just armoried you (assuming you are Wrathofdark on Dreadmaul). Your gear is ok, although you should really get the Tol Barad trinket. Its tons of mastery and you can use it every minute for a crap ton of resistance (he has some fire based attacks that this will help with as well).

    Also, based on your armory, you have 51.19% dodge, 16.41% parry and 12% dodge. Counting the 5% miss, you should be able to be fully unhittable (meaning without dodging, parry or at least blocking) 82% of the time (roughly). When shield block is up, it should be 100% unhittable. That means that you are likely doing a no-no such as turning your back to the boss while engaged with him.

    Make sure that when you are kiting him you dont turn your back. Also keep SB on CD when you are up there and you may want to get yourself the 4 piece T11 since its an 18 second shield wall (VERY sexy).

    The damage up there is pretty significant. You may even want to use mastery/armor pots instead of a flask. Anything to get your blocked attacks up. Full hits are a healers worst enemy.

    Good luck
    Deeps for show..... tank for dough.....

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrath555 View Post
    won't a pally always mitigate more attacks because their mastery adds block at a greater rate than a warriors will add critical block? My understanding was that warriors will take less damage from blocks, but pallies will block more
    Not strictly true. while pally Block chance does scale better from mastery they don't have an eqiuvalent to the sentinel ability; withoutany mastery a prot pally has a 5% block chance, a prot warrior has a 20%. on the other hand 33% of the time the paladin can increase the amount they block form 30% to 50% of the blow damage, the warrior equivalent increases chance to block by 25% for 33%. however warriors also have the hold the line talent which increase their Crit block chance by 10% some of the time. somewhat complicated yeah?

    So if the warrior is making good use of Shield block he should always be blocking more often thana pally. he gets 28.3% blockchance by the grace of class, the poor pally only gets 5%,he needs 10.35 more Mastery just to get the same chance to block as the warrior gets at 0 mastery. the upside is that at this point the warrior has no critical block chance, the pally still has Holy shield so his blocks will be bigger.

    However at 85 you get 8 mastery skill passive lets give both our guys the enernal meta gem becuase they both read that tha thread on tankspot like good little tanks. The warrior has say 50% up time on hold the line, and both are making maximum use of their active block abilites. And we'll totally ignore Shieldblock overflows and parry and dodge and miss.

    With 0 Mastery rating (8 skill) , The warrior has an average Block chance of 40.3% and his blocks will stop 35.1% of the damage. The paladin on the other other hand has 23% chance to block and his will stop 37.67% of the damage. thanks to mastery

    With 3000 Mastery rating (24.73 skill) , The warrior has an average Block chance of 65.43% and his blocks will stop 42.63% of the damage. The paladin on the other other hand has 60.65% chance to block and his will stop 37.67% of the damage. thanks to mastery

    With good use of Shield Block the warrior will on average block more often and for more than the paladin will, the warrior will on average have also much bigger variance, and its that variance that hurts warriors. On average sure thier block mechanic is better in terms of raw damage reduction, but that varaince makes them slightly spikier than paladins, and as we know it's damage spikes that kill tanks, not raw damage.

  7. #7
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    are you sure you diden make a typo? I have about 24,27 mastery (2916 rating) and thats 56,4% block.
    as a warrior.

  8. #8
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    24.73 mastery @ 1.5% per point is 37.1%
    for equipping a shield we get 5%
    for choosing Prot we get sentinel which is 15%
    Having shield Block up a third of the time averages to 8.33%

    37.1+5+15+8.33=65.43

  9. #9
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    I diden see it at first. you was talking about average Block, with shield Block up.
    Last edited by Mazzy; 08-04-2011 at 04:06 AM.

  10. #10
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    Average Block, with maximum shield block up time. 1/3 of the time it's up, 2/3s of the time it's down.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by wrath555 View Post
    Hey guys,
    sorry to bother you with a run of the mill post asking about why I am taking too much damage. However, tonight, during my guild runs on Beth'tilac, I found myself taking a lot more damage than I thought I should have been. I was the assigned tank to go up onto the web, with a skilled disc priest healing me, and I found that on numerous occasions I was dropping to sub 40k health.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-ut6k4e766wlhvx29/ These are the logs for the entire night.

    As I am sure you can guess, I am Wrathofdark. Any advice that can be offered would be greatly appreciated.

    (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...hofdark/simple)
    You have way to much parry compaired to dodge, id advise changing your reforging to favor dodge over parry and balance this out. Thanks to DR you will gain a good bit fo avoidance there.

    Your shoulder gem should be Mastery/Stam rather then Dodge/Stam.

    A Mastery trinket, such as the TB one would help alot.

    Unless your having serious threat issues, I would recommend moving talent points from Deep Wounds to Blood Craze. Every bit of survivablilty helps.

    Looking though your logs it seems Demo Shout and Thunder clap were not being kept on the boss. Both reduce the damage you take by a considerable amount.



    Thats all I see right off, hope it helps.

  12. #12
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    Blood craze is not a particularily great talent due to unreliability, in the previous tier it was better for healer mana to take deep wounds and end the fight just that little bit quicker. I would recommend against taking Bloodcraze on Beth given the nature of her soft enrage.

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