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Thread: Heroic Chimaeron Parry Gibs?! Wtf?!

  1. #1
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    Heroic Chimaeron Parry Gibs?! Wtf?!

    Hey guys. So my guild has grinded on Heroic Chimaeron for 3-4 days now and we've only pushed him into phase 2 once. We've had no real issues with Heroic Atramedes or Halfus but Chim is being a jerk. We usually get him in range of pushing him into phase 2 by the 3rd-4th stack (depending on bile-o-tron) but then the tank (our pally) who's tanking Chim during feud will just get murdered. We've tried cycling all available CDs in different ways, heck, the pally is even unhittable through some careful speccing, reforging, gemming, but he still dies like a pansy! We've read the strats and watched the videos but nowhere have we come across our unique problem...Chim is parry gibbing our tank?! Wtf?!

    I was positive Blizz removed that from the game but every fight when we all check recount for when the tank dies he'll get attacked 2-3 times in less than a second or two and always after a parry, and it's definitely not the double strike or the fact that his break stacks are too high (he never gets above 2), or getting hit by spit. Has anyone else come across this issue and if so how do you deal with it? He'll go from full to dead in less than a single gcd almost EVERY stinking time, even with guardian spirit, etc! Also, what do you guys find works best for the tank who tanks Chim during feud in regards to CDs, heal attention, etc by the 3rd-4th stack? Our dps avg is 18-22k, our healers are doing great, i'm the double strike tank and I never die, our only problem lies in keeping Mr. Squishadin alive. Any thoughts?


    Notes on comp (here is our typical core 10, but sometimes we have to fill in if people can't raid):

    Tanks - Paladin, Warrior, Frost DK in Blood Spec (tanks while bile-o-tron online)
    Heals - Druid, Holy Priest, Disc Priest
    DPS - Fury Warrior, Arcane/Fire Mage, 2 Hunters (not sure on specs)

  2. #2
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    Have you got a combatlog to prove this, because blizzard have confirmed that parry-haste as a boss mechanic is no longer in the game.

  3. #3
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    I'll check and see if anyone saved it and if not will try to set up a World of Logs. We're not 100% certain he's actually being parry gibbed but when we look at recount and the combat log he'll get hit multiple times in less than a single gcd and we have no idea what it is our how to counter it. It's ALWAYS the 3rd or 4th feud too.

  4. #4
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    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  5. #5
    Chimeron's normal attack speed with a speed debuff on is something like 4-5 seconds as far as I know. With his speed, I'm pretty sure that even a parry-haste wouldn't allow him to hit that fast in succession. Double Attack is pretty much the only mechanic on the fight that does that, there's pretty much no other reasonable explanation.

  6. #6
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    Believe me, he isn't being parry-gibbed because this is not possible due to the mechanic not being used by enemy non-player-characters. And the feud tank should never (ever) have 4 stacks of break (a melee swing on a player with 4 stacks of break will one-shot regardless of cooldowns if the robot is not active).

    Parry haste allowed for up to 40% lower swing time. Chimaeron's swing time when debuffed is 5 seconds (give or take a tenth). so a parry hasted swing would land 2 seconds early (or about 3 seconds after the previous swing)

  7. #7
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    Right, he double attacks, but that's not what kills the Paladin. In the same logs/recount where he dies i'll check mine and i'm eating the double attack still. Also, no tank ever gets above 2 stacks. If we're in danger of that happening we swap. That's why we're so confused.

  8. #8
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    It's 99.99999999% not parry gibbing. Combatlogs will help.
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  9. #9
    Then at some point in the fight the taunt for the Double Attacks or something similar is going wrong.

    It's not like it's some other boss doing it where it'd be reasonable to think a bug was happening, Chimeron has a specific mechanic for this. If it's hitting the wrong guy, then it's a mistake somewhere in the execution.

  10. #10
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    Haha ok, it's good to hear that from other people. I was sure Blizz removed parry gibbing but we couldn't think of any other reason. I'll try and grab a log next time we do chim.

  11. #11
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    It sounds like your tanks need to learn when they need to taunt, and who is taking which feud phase. The only time a tank should have more than 2 stacks of break is when tanking the normal swings with the robot alive (which means the tank can't die anyway). If a tank has any stacks of break going into feud, you are doing it wrong.

  12. #12
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    Ok, as far as I understand you need 2 tanks and a plate dps tanking for the fight. Our DK is Frost and tanks in blood spec while bile-o-tron is online. I'm the warrior tank that takes the double strikes. When DBM announces he's double striking I usually count to about 3 in my head then taunt and unload on Chim until DK taunts him back. When we hit feud the pally stands outside the group, taunts, and holds aggro for feud while I continue taking the double strikes. If the bile-o-tron goes off twice in a row the paladin and I swap roles because his break stacks will not have worn out yet. We don't let any tank go above 2 stacks (except maybe the DK but I don't pay attention to him :P ). Is this correct or are we doing something wrong?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by leviticusx82 View Post
    It's ALWAYS the 3rd or 4th feud too.
    Paladin on the 3rd or 4th feud? Sounds like an issue with cooldown rotation. I'm betting your warrior tank is ok (because shield wall is a 2min cd) but any other tanking class will probably need external cooldown coverage for the 2nd time they are going thru feud as their major CD won't be up and minor CDs alone are probably not enough. When your paladin is tanking his second feud, wait a few seconds after it begins and then dump pain sup on him (timed so that pain sup lasts until the massacre).

  14. #14
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    We have our dps DK go blood presence and take the melee swings.
    I (prot paladin) taunt for double strikes
    when Chimaeron casts feud I taunt him and after 6 seconds hit Guardian (50% cooldown) which lasts for the duration of the robot downtime.
    after the massacre the DK taunts the boss back and takes the break stacks
    our warrior taunts for double strikes and tanks the next feud phase.

    rinse and repeat until 20%. Lay on Hands tops the feud tank off.

  15. #15
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    Ooh, interesting. So you cycle your tanks for each feud. We'll have to try that. Thanks for the idea! One question though, after the first and second feuds does the tank taking the double strikes ever have stacks of break on him still or are they always worn out by then?

  16. #16
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    the tank taking double strike in the regular phase of the fight never has any stacks of Break. Double strike with break and no major cooldown kills you.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by leviticusx82 View Post
    Also, what do you guys find works best for the tank who tanks Chim during feud in regards to CDs, heal attention, etc by the 3rd-4th stack?)
    Looks to me like the real problem is a wrong tanking strategy rather then some strange parry gibs.

    DK starts "tanking" him while the bot is online, his stacks doesn't matter at all
    double attack 1 - warrior takes it with a shield block
    double attack 2 - either warrior takes it or paladin (because the paladin should still be topped at this time and your healers can assist on dps'ing here)
    *massacre cast*
    double attack 3 - warrior takes it with a shield block
    double attack 4 -> removed via another *massacre cast*

    Feud is going to happen anytime after this in the same pattern as DA 3 + DA 4, but there'll always be at least 60s between two feud casts!

    Warrior tanks first feud (his shield wall has a shorter cooldown and will be ready for the next feud phase he has to take and if you happen to be fast enough you can use ardent defender for the execute phase) and the third feud while your paladin tanks second feud and the fourth.

    Cooldown wise you can use loh/bop/guardian angel/last stand/bubble to survive the initial hit without to much hassle and pop a "real" cooldown (shieldwall esque) for more important hits (after the first break stack and while your healer stabilise the raid from the incoming slimes).

    0.0 masscare + cast feud
    5.0 feud fades + normal attack
    *4 piece? pop shieldwall here*
    9.8 normal attack
    10.0 afflicted by break (1)
    *no 4 piece? count to three and use it right before the DA*
    14.6 double attack
    19.4 normal attack
    24.2 normal attack
    25.0 afflicted by break (2)
    30 massacre

    Under no circumstance any of your "real" tanks should tank anything outside of the feud phase + taunt for the DA, your DK should take all the regular break stacks so your other tanks can reset them in time.

    Also: unless you need the third tank due to running out of external cooldowns (or survival issues in phase 2) i'd have your frost dk playing in blood presence rather than blood specc. If you want to stick to a three tanking strategy, you can totally rotate the tanks. Tank A eating all break stacks while tank B eats DA + tanking first feud and tanking him afterwards (soaking breaks). Tank C takes tank B's job of eating DA + tanking the next feud and continue tanking afterwards, while Tank A starts eating the DA... etc
    Last edited by klausi; 06-14-2011 at 05:15 PM.

  18. #18
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    Thanks for laying out the feud sequence Klausi and for the suggestions. It definitely makes things more clear. One question, are you suggesting that the tank who's tanking Chim during feud also take the double attacks?

  19. #19
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    You can swap tanks after the application of break of just having your offtank taunt the DA but that means you'll have to top two raidmember while your raid gets smashed from slimes. We prefer having both not-actually-tanking-tanks stacking with the raid to even out the damage of the slimes and reducing the healthpoints required for both the initial hit and the final hit before the massacre cast.

  20. #20
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    IIRC Parry-hasting was only a 40% increase in melee atk speed until the next attack, and Chimmy, has a 5 second swing speed. So even if he was bugged and flagged for parry-haste we would get a melee stikes at 3 or 5 swing speeds.

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