Warrior Tank need advice

[Vladislaus]

ok i am not a new, prot was my MS from vanilla through to ulduar,, after that my MS became fury, well i am back tanking alot again...

my MS is still fury-dps, which i do when able in my guilds main raid team,, though i am tanking mostly for the guilds secondary raid team due to lack of tanks in the guild,,

if it is a boss, or a mob i can pull like trash mobs i do fine on aggro and threat control, only lose it if someone starts to dps the same time i headbutt the target with my charge.. well i ran into trouble last night. the group i am in is more than a fair bit behind the raiding curve on progression, a lot of it is due to raid make up and every week our lineup is different so we are forever breaking someone in. we hit Maloriak for the first time and i was on add duty. i was having problems aggroing the adds i taunt them they take two steps toward me then they trun around and run to a guildee. i know that a lot of my threat comes from vengence and with the delays on releasing the aberrations and the aoe fields being out where the aberations spawned, it was making it hard for me to them, though after a few secs of a release i got the adds under control and normally after i had 4-5 adds on me and my vengence was up high i did fine,, till i had to many adds.. group was interrupting to much so was having to let out 11-14 adds between 1st and 2nd green flask

so i guess what i am asking is how do i get a good hold on aggro without vengence?

i willlink my armory info, with me in tank gear and spec,, so if i have anything screwed up please let me know,, for i know my knowledge of the class i love the most, does not compare to the master of Warriorcraft that are on here..

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...afslaus/simple

[Machoen]

When tanking the adds on maloriak encounter, make sure you have vigilanced your main tank and you will refresh your taunt cooldown so fast, you can spam taunt everything, what I do is that I have a hunter put freezing trap right infront of the stairs, and I stay on one side, when new adds land I put thunderclap, demo shout, shockwave and start running to the otherside by running through the freezed area and immediatly pick up the adds on the other side. Hope this helped.

[Giliandrix]

Are you using everything in your warrior toolbox? Vigilance taunt alone is enough but sometimes i find if I mess up on that fight, there's charge/intercept/heroic throw/heroic leap all to help you close gaps and get aggro, generally a charge + shield slam should be enough to stick a mob to you, if you really want to run with an AoE spec and keep rend rolled on all the mobs too!

[Vladislaus]

yes i am using all the abilities i can in my toolbox, and i am using the aoe spec which is why i was coming here to ask,, was not sure if there was another nuance i was missing

[swelt]

Sounds like there's some 'team effort' missing here, might not all be on your head:
- You should never have more than 9 adds up. 'Group messed up interrupts' means 'Group doesn't get to kill boss' unless you get creative.
- As mentioned, a hunter frost trap or shaman earthbind can be strategically placed to help the pickup. If needs be, priest AOE fear can be used to buy breathing space, although personally I'm not a fan of introducing RNG.
- Fresh spawns will almost always go towards your healers. Be precise about where your healers will stand (e.g. central and well away from the spawn spots) to help make their movements more predictable.
- Be aware of alternative strategies. For hard mode in 10 man, we started releasing 3 and killing them, interrupting the next cast (to give time to finish killing those first 3) then allowing 2 more release casts (leaving the tank with 6). That made the whole process a lot safer. Whether you can do this depends on your dps (whether you can beat the timers with this method or not). It shouldn't really be necessary in normal mode, the adds don't hit as hard, but it will certainly teach your interrupters some discipline!

[Reev]

My raid group routinely ends up with 12 adds during the first green phase. I let the last three beat on healers, since when they aren't grouped up, they do almost no damage, then when they get all greenish, I challenging shout them all, pop a cooldown, and we AoE them fast. It makes the next phase super easy with only 6 adds to deal with. Plus, it gets you the achievement if you don't already have it.

[Giliandrix]

If you're using everything, then perhaps you are not skilled enough/fast enough then, or perhaps you are pressing the wrong buttons. A Heroic Leap + Shield Slam, Charge + Revenge/Dev, Intercept + Concussive is all good enough to gather 3 scattered add.

[kopcap]

Its not your fault if people are pulling aggro on adds in between green phases or letting more than 9 adds out. If your having problems gathering the adds while they are coming out, there is a lot a raid can do to help - MDs, tricks, frost traps, righteous fury, lifegrips.

[Vladislaus]

hey got a querry for you all,, i know my mit stats are pretty far up there,, think around 79.38% not including armor with 152k health all unbuffed,, do i need to start trying to go for more health now or for higher expertise and hit

[Tengenstein]

you should be fine, a little more health my help your healers once you start doing hardmodes, if you find you're just a smidgen short of the enrage timer you can probably get some more expertise, But really you should be fine as is just trying to get as much mastery as possible.

[Vladislaus]

ok here is a question what is better

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/item/59332 Symbiotic Worm or

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/item/56280 Porcelian Crab (with the Dodge reforged into Mastery)

i am curious i have both for a secondary trinket, and if i swapped out the Crab for the Worm i would lose around 2% in mit stats but health would break 160k

and looking at stats with raid buffs, with the worm i would have an average Mitigation of 81.5% and 186K health, but with the Crab i would have mit around 91.4% and 178K health,, i am saying an average cause i an factoring in the proc abilities and their respective upkeep,,

of course none of that is also including my CD's with i normally use in a rotation depending on the attack coming or boss

[klausi]

I really love the worm procc, upping my block/critblock chance by almost 10% and when i really need it (sub 35% hitpoints) and bringing me pretty close to unhittable. The uptime is fairly good thanks to only 30s internal cooldown.

Crab is a neat trinket to with passive avoidance and mastery (after reforging) and an awesome 1700 mastery procc. Downside: you need to hit to procc it and 80s internal cooldown.

For normal mode i'd go with crab.

[kopcap]

Worm is amazing and quite underrated. It dramatically decreases your chances of catching two unmitigated hits in a row.

ps also your math for crab "worthiness" is wrong, mitigation form it is a lot less than that.

[klausi]

Worm math is easy, on hard hitters it's 321 mastery rating (+2.67% block/critblock) averaged, on everything else it's less.

Crab math: passiv 171 dodge rating (~ 0.95% dodge pre DR) + 114 mastery rating (+0.96% block/critblock), procc chance is only 10% and 80s ICD. Maximum uptime is 25%, uptime in reality is roughly 20% due to the low procc chance. Adds another 342 mastery rating (+2.87% block/critblock) averaged. Disadvantage: even while not tanking (eg: tank switch fights like Chimaeron/Cho'gall or just waiting for you adds to spawn on Magmaw/Omnotron/Maloriak) it can still procc from assisting on dps.