nef adds phase 3

[Thad]

okay so my guild has been getting really close to killing nefarian but we've been having an issue with the adds. now we've been able to kite them around the room getting them to reset at least once however by the time we reach the other side of the room (we start at the right side side of nefs head and kite around the room till reach the left side of his head) fire is being put down fast and nef is reaching 20%. so since there's no where to go and adds are getting stronger we decided to just cc these guys while we finish nef.

my question is whats the best way to go about cc'ing the adds.

on another note how many electrocutes should be done before phase 3. (we've been doing 2 in phase 1(uncertain if we can do 3 since ony is nearing 90 electricity at that point), 1 in phase 2 then 1 right at the start of phase 3 (like as he lands).

[sudz]

You should shoot for 3 electrocutes transitioning to phase 2. During phase 2, focus on getting the adds down asap so you can move to phase 3. Now as for the adds, you really can't CC them...your tank just needs to get better at kiting them. As long as he has a boss mod, he should be able to drop them every time; even when the fire ball comes in 10 second increments. When that starts to happen he/she will have to kite until 5 seconds - stop (so the adds can catch up), and start moving again at .5/.7 seconds, and repeat that until nef is dead. Oh and make sure he isn't back peddling, but strafing. Before we had him on farm i was under the impression that they can get behind you and gib you....i was wrong, that never happens (I suppose it can but its so rare...) As for making sure you have enough room, that will take practice on the tanks part. He can't run too far because it will always end with him running in to fire that hasn't disappeared yet.

[Thad]

we've been debating weather or not to kite the adds past nefs head to make a full circle but some say it would be too dangerous to get fire behind the tank. the strat we use says to turn around when you reach nefs head but i don't see any way to turn around without ending up in fire.

[sudz]

we've been debating weather or not to kite the adds past nefs head to make a full circle but some say it would be too dangerous to get fire behind the tank. the strat we use says to turn around when you reach nefs head but i don't see any way to turn around without ending up in fire.

We tank him in the middle. The add tank kites the adds around the outside and our nef tanks tries to line nefs head with the most recent fire ball/flame patch...if that makes sense (For example, if nefs head is facing north; the add tank and adds is NE/E, when the add tank moves E/SE, the nef tank moves NE). This way the nef tank is moving as the add tank is moving so no one gets flame breathed or tail lashed

[Fayre]

When your kiter gets near Nef's head, flip him 180 degrees.

[Rekcinad]

Video of our Nefarian heroic kill: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZg07qEcgRA

The tactic used here worked best for us both on normal and heroic. You can just turn Nefarian's head ahead of the kiter, and have the raid stand on one side of Nefarian (moving along with the boss) so that the kiter is in range of all healers.

We have 1 healer run along with our kiting tank (me), to heal him constantly.

The more electrocutes you do in P1 and P2, the easier it is to kite. However, with a skilled kiter you could easily do it with only 2 electrocutes as well.

When the first fire resurrects all adds, pick them up and start tanking them on the roster. Make sure the fire doesnt catch up to them. At ~1 second left on the Shadowblaze CD timer, start moving the adds (Strafing, NOT backpeddling), make sure the shadowblaze ball animation has spawned, then position the adds so that the fire won't hit them. Repeat this for every shadowblaze and they should never get hit by the fire. Just tank them inbetween shadowblaze casts and use shockwave to diminish damage taken on Electrocute damage spikes (plus Tol Barad trinket and Shield Wall/Last Stand + Enraged Regen rotations).

With this strategy you can kite for a good 6-7 minutes without ever running into previous fire. A disc priest worked really well for us as the kiter healer, because of the Pain Suppression, shields and fast burst heals.


Regarding 3 electrocutes in P1: This is possible. The first 2 electrocutes can be done as normal. On the 3rd electrocute, make sure Onyxia is on ~30k health. All DPS just takes Nefarian low, and trigger the Electrocute cast timer. 3 seconds before Electrocute finishes, let the Onyxia tank kill her. As long as she dies before Electrocute actually damages the raid, then you will not have an exploding Onyxia on your hands. Use a raid CD on this 3rd electrocute as you want to be on 100% health as P2 starts. A Tranquility could work at this point as well.

[Thad]

quick question we've been using 2 tanks to split the damage with the adds but is it possible to do it with only one tank?

[Gnoo]

quick question we've been using 2 tanks to split the damage with the adds but is it possible to do it with only one tank?

Yes. I believe it is usually done with one tank. The key is resetting the adds properly.

[Angur]

I have a few questions...

1) When we get into Phase 3, should we have already completed 3 Crackles or 4? This would mean 2 in Phase 1 and 2 in Phase 2.

2) With tanking the adds how many times should the adds roughly die?

We seem to be running into an issue where we push 3 Crackles: 2 in P1, 1 in P2 (to resevre healers mana), we cannot get Neffarion past 22% in P3 before the adds end up 1 shotting our Kiting Tank. We also have 3 healers following him and topping him off. Any other reccomendations as we are very close to killing him?

[thecrazyman]

The problem with the adds one shotting them is either their energy bar not being reset or your tank not helping the healers out some by reducing the dmg from them.

So are your tanks moving so the add's energy bar is not reset? They should be moving when they see the purple item on the ground. This should happen at least once or more.

The other item is what type of tank is taking them? I believe all tanks got something to deal with them. As a warrior tank I tend to SW them right i moved them for the fire that happens. I.e. fire spawns I move them out of it and once they are out of it SW to relieve stress on healers. I am the 2nd tank for the adds as we use a prot pally for it, so hes job is collecting but while he is doing that I try and keep up demo shout on the adds to reduce the dmg from them. Overall kiting the adds are a pain and your tank needs the practice in P3 to get it done right.

[Angur]

Is it easier to tank the adds in one place and move them at ~1 second before the flame or continuesly keep them moving around the whole room??

[thecrazyman]

I would say its is easier at 1st to tank them for a little bit and move them at the 5s mark so the adds are moving at full speed to avoid the flame. Then once they are out of the fire stun them while waiting for the next 5s mark. The thing I notice if you manage to do this good they all will drop but when they get hit and respawn backup the timer is way quicker. I.e. We were moving consistently to avoid the flame but it got to the point where we were kiting the adds through fire too.

At sub 25%~ it becomes a stun/root/snare game for distance on them so the tank has threat but not taking any dmg. Then if he goes down the 2nd agro target (hopefully your 2nd tank) grabs agro and does the next distance / stun game. We even had our main add tank SS so when he died I would take over and after I died he would get them again just so we would get an extra few sec of no adds on the raid.

[Superworm]

It's possible to reset the adds indefinitely. Just turn on the stopwatch when the first fire is coming down. The next fire should be 30 seconds later, and then 25 seconds later, then 20 seconds later, then 15 seconds later, then 10 seconds later. From then on, it lands every 10 seconds. The add tank only need to move when the fire is coming down.
The biggest killer is the crackle, once the tank gets used to the timing. When I kite the adds, I pop a CD or use the Tol'barad trinket when the crackle is about to land.

[Fujka]

Just kite the adds around the very outter edge of the room. Move them as the first fire is hitting. You can just back peddle the entire time. Make sure to keep Demo shout and thunderclap up as they will save your life. You dont even have to slow the adds to be honest. Later in the fight if you feel like you are going to die and you have no cds available, utilize shockwave and heroic leap. That will buy you about 15 seconds of no dmg, BUT the adds will most likely get hit by fire so its a last resort.


Also, call for outside cooldowns. Pain Suppression and Safeguard from your co warrior tank go a long way.

[Thad]

k we switched to one add tank other night and one shotted him . would of been perfect if i hadn't been killed by electrocute at last 10% but still got him down since the adds running loose were recently reset.

[Angur]

So we should:

- 2 Crackles in Phase 1, 2 Crackles in Phase 2?
- Tank Nefarion in the middle... and slowly move him so his breath does not hit the adds.
- The OT tanks the Adds in 1 position and starts kiting the adds with ~1 Second remaining on Shadowblaze.
- Pick up ALL Adds + MD Adds to OT incase some slip.
- Pop CD's on Crackle

[klausi]

0-1 Crackles in Phase 2

.. depending on your lineup unless you're running with something like a dual protpala/discpriest/unholydk/warlock combo. You can stretch out phase 3 as long as you want to, healer mana shouldn't drop if kiting is done properly. You can even stop damage multiple times and wait for cooldowns to come up again.

[swelt]

Have done this in 25 man, but attempting it now in our 10 man alt group, we are having issues with adds. The problem I think stems from phase 1 - without a proper tank to handle the adds, they end up dying in less controlled positions. The 'nef in middle, kite around the edge' strat I've used in 25 man does rather rely on the adds all collapsing in a pile at the edge of the room. Any 10 man specific suggestions?

[klausi]

Use a DD (Feral, DK, Fury, Ret - wearing shield/defstance/bloodpresence) with a cooldown and assist of hunter's freeing trap (kiting) or Mage's Ring of Frost when they become bigger. You can shackle/frosttrap some in place as well.

[swelt]

Yea... don't have any offtank capable dps in our lineup. Hunter + Mage kiting we can do, but they are having difficulty grouping the adds at the end of their energy bars (when they are their most dangerous) at the edge of the ring.