How do I solve my guild problem?

[Zatira]

Hey!
I'm sorry if I'm posting this on the wrong forum but anyway, here I go.

So about two and a half month ago I joined a 10man raiding guild that were getting started to raid in cataclysm. I offered my assistance to the guild as a raid leader since I had previous experience and we started out quite well.
After 2-3 weeks we had about 7/12 bosses down but we were noticing a dps problem, that it was way too low.
One of the dps that were doing way too low dps were our guild leader, so I and the officers talked to him about his performance that he's doing quite badly at the moment and we wanted to see improvements(we asked nicely). But he didn't improve for the coming 2 weeks.

But then his computer crashes and he's absent for 2-3 weeks. So we talked to him and we told him that we have to take someone else for our group in the meanwhile he's absent.
The coming raid we saw an large increase in dps and performance from our new member, since our guild leader had been doing really badly(dps and performance wise),
and we managed to take 11/12 quite flawless.
But now our guild master is back and of course wants to raid with the main group, but people are looking at this situation like it's not gonna work out with him. Also it feels a bit bad for the new member that we recruited that he's gonna lose his spot when he helped us greatly with the progression. Also I of course give credits to the guild master for getting us started and bringing us together and he's a nice guy.

There has been talk about starting a second raid group, but our guild leader wants of course to raid in the main group. So now the latest days he's been using power as a guild leader to demote certain officers because he doesn't share their opinion even though they have been a great help to the guild etc. and it's starting to turn quite ugly. How should I solve this?

Please any opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!

[dagimp007]

he is the guild leader... if he cant do what is best for the guild he should step down.

run the group with out him, and if the guild leader remove like repairs or something then start a new guild. Yes u will have to start all over with rep, but would u rather start over with rep or deal with a sub par, power controlled GL.

have the GL start group 2, and then once group 1 is done with everything they could want you could mix the 2 groups if group 2 is still behind.

also dont call your groups 1 and 2 call them like Bill's Fourth Eye, and Ted's Left legged Hoppers. something that doesn't says this is the best group and this is the group of left overs

[Theotherone]

He's the guild leader who brought you all into his guild and now you want to "demote him" - I can see him getting ugly and angry with that knife sticking in his back, it must hurt like hell. I think the alternative for you and the rest who want to demote him is for start your own guild, build up your rep and move on. I just have this thing about disloyalty. It really is like going to the kid in the neighborhood's house who has the pool, then telling him to stay out "'cause you just don't swim as good as us."

[Zatira]

Oh, I think you got me wrong there.
I'm in the situation that I think that he should be raiding with us because I definitely think that he has the right to do so, but other people do not agree(a quite majority of the officers etc.), and I can agree with both parts on certain things.
Since it would of course be unfair to not let him.

[Theotherone]

Okay, I understand, but it came across badly.

What is his class, spec and what's his dps - on average? We can probably fix him.

[Zatira]

Fire mage, around 8-9k average. Sometimes even less.

We've told him to look up about the rotation and gear etc. Given him sites to check up on also.

[Theotherone]

Fire mage, around 8-9k average. Sometimes even less.

We've told him to look up about the rotation and gear etc. Given him sites to check up on also.

My fire mage just hit 85 so I've not raided with her just yet; but that does seem very low for a fire mage. How's his damage done? Could be a haste issue or, he's just unlucky with RNG. Fire, while it can do nasty damage, if it does not get Hot Streak procs for instant cast Pyroblasts will seem gimped.

It's a shame Goros isn't on he's got some good adivce to give on Fire Mages. You may want to point your GL here

http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...ge-Guide/page6

[Zatira]

Thanks for replying again.
Anyway, the problem for him seems to be focus. Following tactics and keeping a rotation up at the same time. Just a guess though, since his gear is really good and he's been reforging to the right stats and gemmed right, but thanks for the link anyway! Will let my GL know about the the thread.

Thanks again.

[Theotherone]

Thanks for replying again.
Anyway, the problem for him seems to be focus. Following tactics and keeping a rotation up at the same time. Just a guess though, since his gear is really good and he's been reforging to the right stats and gemmed right, but thanks for the link anyway! Will let my GL know about the the thread.

Thanks again.

Sure. Just curious, what's he reforging to? Hopefully, not mastery.

[Zatira]

Mostly into crit.

[Selene]

I thought Frost was the Raid Spec and Fire was the Heroics Spec.

[Sky]

Wait, no! My guide is out of date. Link a parse and stuff and i'll help out

[Timberton]

guild leader...raids...doing quite badly at the moment and we wanted to see improvements(we asked nicely)

This is one of the reasons why a raiding guild should have 1-2 /other/ raid leaders.

How stuff happens in my guild:
- guild leader/raid leader takes care of the raid administration side (raid invites, calendar entry..etc)
- Main tank + offtank take the lead during the run itself. Develop main boss strategy, coordinate pulls, set the overall pace and hasten raid recovery after a wipe
- Overall, during the run, guild leader usually steps in for 50-50% debates on strategy and for ... encouraging "get out of the fire" proper play
- During the boss fight, guild leader coordinates ranged grp. Main tank/offtank coordinates melee grp
- main tank - offtank - guild leader stay in near constant communication over voice comm to coordinate tactics, cd usage, special events and any tank switches

If anybody is not performing up to par, they will hear from guild/raid leader, main or off tank and given advice and a chance or 2 or 3 to shape up. If it doesn't happen, a replacement is not too far away.
We'd have no problem benching any of the tanks, the guild leader or any other raider due to performance issues. The raid is a team effort, and if one person's performance negatively impacts the team, he's out until he can properly pull his/her own weight.


Pertinent to OP's case, the raid has been doing well, you got a good team there. Don't go breaking it up just because of "some high guild rank" wants in. The team can raid without him, but the reverse is not true.
- State your case clearly but firmly, you are not to be pushed around. He must shape up or else he won't justify his raid spot.
- Have him attend first bosses (2/12 - 4/12) on a weekly basis to gauge his progress. Make sure to let him know why he's invited, and let him know he got the raid spot because a proper dps was willing (this time) to step down or come a bit late due to various reasons.
- if he shapes up, work out a rotation. Have him play reserve for starters and fill in for the cases where a dps has to go early/can't come.
If he continues to improve to acceptable levels have him (and every other dps) attend on a performance basis for the later bosses (10/12+, or heroic raids)
Congrats on your well oiled raid team!

Now, if he starts throwing his weight around, kicking, demoting, strong words...etc... and causing drama, that's a sign he just wants to be carried. Best course of action is cut the evil at the root and eighter have him step down - let him know he'd still be attending raids, but not on a main raid spot. The alternative would be for the raid team to leave him behind and form a new guild, and in this case he'd probably get no raids at all for quite some time. Pick the new guild leader wisely.
Good luck to you!

P.S.

Fire mage, around 8-9k average. Sometimes even less.

Lol, our tank crew has dps like that

[Zatira]

We tried him on our farm run yesterday when we cleared 10/12 and we saw improvements, have also been talking to him. He wants me to take place as co-gm and told me to choose some officers for other matters now. Else the guild is quite well setup, but the guild leader also said that he was overreacting a bit when he demoted one of the officers, but that matter is fixed now. We've been talking a bit and yeah, the some of the officer is still a bit grumpy. But that's just a temporarily situation, gonna work out one way or another.

Anyway, overall he seems to be in a better mood and the only thing is for the officers to kind of accept the situation but kind of wants to let the leading responsibility to others and just keep on raiding since he's been quite busy in real life. So it's looking quite much brighter right now.

Thanks for all the responses everyone! It really helped me to get some ideas also about keeping the guild up etc.
Cheers!