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Thread: So now I have enough of a score to do heroics, but now not enough hitpoints...

  1. #1
    Join Date
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    So now I have enough of a score to do heroics, but now not enough hitpoints...

    I cant win Please look at my gear and offer advice

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...istayne/simple

  2. #2
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    Get rid of that +4 all stats gem and put a real gem in there, other than that I see no reason why you couldn't tank heroics as long as you're using CC and your healer isn't a complete moron.

    I mean, your toon isn't raid ready by any means, but you should be able to do heroics.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  3. #3
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    This is weird, hehe. When I dinged I had 120k hp unbuffed. Go normals, get more gear, gem for stam. Do heroics.
    Clone - Horde @ Sylvanas EU

  4. #4
    do not gem for stam.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by cptwafflez View Post
    do not gem for stam.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  6. #6
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    The socket bonus in your helm is worth getting. Throw a parry/stam or parry/mastery gem in there instead.

  7. #7
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    Logged in, was going to say the same thing. Those who gem for stamina do not know how to tank in Cataclysm, period. Right now wowarmory is down, so I could not look at your character.

    But the fact is, if you are a pally, make sure you are survival build and nothing else. If you are a warrior or druid, I do not know. Warriors and Druids are harder to heal compared to pallies in survival build.

    Also, like the guy said above me. NEVER, EVER gem for stamina unless you need that socket bonus, then only use a hybrid gem. Parry, Dodge, Mastery is higher priority over stamina for gems. (and pretty much anything else, enchants, etc).

    If you get kicked out of pugs (or sit out of a guild run) due to you having close to 100k health, then they are the griefers (and there are tons of those kinds of kids).

  8. #8
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    Well, I'm a warrior. But it's the same for them as for paladins. (And I personally feel when I'm on my priest that good survival oriented warriors are easier to heal than survival oriented paladins, but that's another discussion.)

    The same as multiple people said before: Mastery (Block) + Avoidance will keep you alive, not stam.

    The reason is that nothing out there is hitting as hard, that you die within few (1-3) hits, so healers have not time to heal you up. That's the only thing Stam is good for. Well there are some boss-abilities that can kill you quite fast. but you can deal with them easily by doing something in a special way or by using CDs. All of them are timed and have very obvious emotes.

    But tanks die in cata. That's because healers are either running out of mana, or running out of time. In most cases both together. In the first case they have the HPS to cover your ase against the DPS the boss hits you with. But they only have it with their fast/big and quite expensive heals. In the second case, they don't have the HPS to hold you up even with their best heals. It's not their fault, because healing is much more restricted than it was in Wrath. Bosses don't hit as hard, but heals are much smaler, too.

    Something else about heals changed, too: Every healer can spam the slow and small heals infinitley. At raiding gear level, they even can regenerate mana doing so. But they will drain all their mana with maybe 15 fast heals. If they spam them, that's only about 20s. Well make it 30s. But if you need another heal after that, because you got anothr hit, they cannot follow it up again.

    So having a big health pool does not help them much. Well you may survive this other hit, but what's after that? You just will live 32s instead of 30s. But if you can stop them from the need to use this extremely expensive heal, they can heal you much longer. As I said, if you only need the slow small ones, they can you heal forever. It's just this drastic.

    Btw: In most cases you will not be heald to full for quite long times. So the additional max HP is not used for most of the time. While survival stats are there all the time.

    There are some ways to help them to use less expensive heals: Dmg avoidance, dmg reduction and dmg smoothing. Parry and dodge do the first. They give the healers some free time to catch up with the dmg. Block covers the other two. Reduction to get their HPS over the DPS of the boss, smoothing to help them to know how much you will need in the next few seconds, so they can switch to the appropriate heal instead of chaing casting the one with the high HPS just in case that you may need it (that's the most expensive one).


    Well every healer feels the difference. If they pay a little bit attantion about what tanks can do, they can tell you who is gearing for mastery/avoidance and who is just geming stamina, just by doing some pulls in a rdm dungeon. It's such a huge difference for them.

    If you eventually met an encouter, where you need more stamina, you can switch trinkets and use a stamina flask or whatever. But if you are doing stuff at your gear lvl your gear has all the stamina you need to do it.


    Well, I'm able to see your toon on the armory. You are using some weird gems and enchants. Green cata gems would help you more.

    Anyway, try to reach 72.4 parry + dodge + mastery as soon as possible. Because if you have this, you can use Shield Block so that you cannot get a full hit while it is up, anymore. (It adds 25% additional block, and the boss hase a miss chance of 5%.)

    Get there, by geming with the focus on mastery:
    blue: stam/mastery, yellow: mastery, red: parry/mastery
    If you don't think a bonus is worth it, use a pure mastery one.

    If you don't trust us, you can focus more on stam (replace the mastery part with stam), because you have relatively low gear, but I doubt that you need it.

    And reforge everything as follows, it's cheap, do it:
    If an item has no mastery, reforge for it. If it has hit/expertise (or crit/haste) use this, if it hast dodge+parry use the higher value.

    If an item has mastery, reforge to balance dodge and parry.

    As long as you don't have 72.4% dodge+parry+block, they should be quite close together. Becaue you get the most out of your ratings doing so. If they are to far away from each other, you lose too much due to the higher getting diminishing returns. (You get less percentage per raiting point, if you have already a high rating.)

    Anyway, parry should be a little bit higher (1-3% buffed) than dodge, because of Hold the Line.

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    Reforge the Crit on those shoulders to something more useful, like parry or dodge.

    Otherwise pretty much what the others have said.

  10. #10
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    I dont know if you have any gold you can use for Boe items.

    If you do then I would suggest trying to get the Blacksmithing Shield, belt and chest peice

    They will add alot of stats to you.

    From your armory feed I can tell you pvp atleast a little.

    See if you can get I think it was around 700 conquest points and you can get the epic thrown weapon aswell (a Boe epic tank gun is also usually available on the ah, usually not as cheap as the crafted items however) , If you have alot of conquest points im sure there is a 1 hander you can consider.

    PVP items may not be ideal and maybe worse than epic raid drops but they will do as a good stop gap measure until your raiding.

    Therazane

    Just by finishing the quests in deepholm and doing 1 set of dailies also got my level 83 mage to revered which means you can get a shoulder enchant from honored and a nice tank ring from revered.

    You can also do dailies for dragonmaw to help you towards a pair of epic tank boots.

    Tol Barad dailies also offer a very nice trinket although that normally takes a couple of weeks to obtain dependng on how often your faction holds tol barad.

    So while your gear is the item level for heroics you can do soo much much to boost your gear before you step one foot inside.

  11. #11
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    I would be carefull to recomment pvp items. At least if it's relatively easy to get an ok pve one for the same spot.

    Resilience is just a wasted stat. It does nothing for PVE and you cannot even reforge it. So the actual pve-item-lvl of a pvp item is much lower. Sure you can take the gun, there is no good pve one (beside of the rdm raid drop), anyway. But the only stat pvp items have more of than pve items for tanks is stamina. And as said before, it's not such an important stat anymore.

    But yes: Do your dailys, get your factions up, run the 3 last non-heroic dungeons if you cannot find poeple for the heroic ones, they give reputation, too. There are even some decent quest rewards waiting for you. But I just assume you are doing stuff like that, anyway.
    Last edited by Katzazi; 02-06-2011 at 06:34 AM.

  12. #12
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    I agree about the PVP gear bit which is why I mentioned the gun as a good alternative and the 1 hander just to be looked at given what the orginal poster is currently using.

    I had bad luck with getting a heroic weapon with tank stats and went through several dps one handers before I eventually had one drop.

    These are just stop gaps till he could get something better especially if he had the points already.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sifer View Post
    I dont know if you have any gold you can use for Boe items.

    If you do then I would suggest trying to get the Blacksmithing Shield, belt and chest peice

    They will add alot of stats to you.

    From your armory feed I can tell you pvp atleast a little.

    See if you can get I think it was around 700 conquest points and you can get the epic thrown weapon aswell (a Boe epic tank gun is also usually available on the ah, usually not as cheap as the crafted items however) , If you have alot of conquest points im sure there is a 1 hander you can consider.

    PVP items may not be ideal and maybe worse than epic raid drops but they will do as a good stop gap measure until your raiding.

    Therazane

    Just by finishing the quests in deepholm and doing 1 set of dailies also got my level 83 mage to revered which means you can get a shoulder enchant from honored and a nice tank ring from revered.

    You can also do dailies for dragonmaw to help you towards a pair of epic tank boots.

    Tol Barad dailies also offer a very nice trinket although that normally takes a couple of weeks to obtain dependng on how often your faction holds tol barad.

    So while your gear is the item level for heroics you can do soo much much to boost your gear before you step one foot inside.
    If you have a steady JP income, I wouldn't recommend the BS BoE Chest, as it is worse than the JP Chest, and even worse than the H BRC drop. It tends to run for around 4k on my server, which I can't justify when a vendor chest or drop is easily available. The belt and shield, however, are BiS until raids, and heroic raids, respectively, so they are more worth the cost.

  14. #14
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    The chest is getting changed next patch to make it quite nice.

    One extra socket can do that despite a slight stat drop in other areas.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    Get rid of that +4 all stats gem and put a real gem in there, other than that I see no reason why you couldn't tank heroics as long as you're using CC and your healer isn't a complete moron.

    Bad Agg. You should know better that. Any moron can cause a group to fail. Shouldn't single out healers, dps or tanks. Stupidity knows no bounds.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  16. #16
    But the only stat pvp items have more of than pve items for tanks is stamina. And as said before, it's not such an important stat anymore.
    And armor. And agi or strength (PvP gear turns out to be much better for Bears due to all the agi.)

  17. #17
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    Wipes are always the healers fault (so I'm told by PuGs when I heal); wipes are always the tanks fault (so I'm told by PuGs when I tank); wipes are the idiot dps's fault (so I'm told by PuGs when I dops.

    But, wipes are NEVER the fault of the PuG who points out to the group whose fault the wipe is.

  18. #18
    But, wipes are NEVER the fault of the PuG who points out to the group whose fault the wipe is.
    Conservation of Blame, sir. Only one person can be to blame in a PuG, and if one person is already assigned blame...then no one else can be!

    PuG Psychology 101.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bovinity View Post
    conservation of blame, sir. Only one person can be to blame in a pug, and if one person is already assigned blame...then no one else can be!

    Pug psychology 101.
    rofl

  20. #20
    So, to set the train back on track. Gear looks good now, Though at 120hp Grim Batol will be fun. I would say go farm Lost City for the belt off lockmaw.

    Plus, grind out REP for the factions. You get some sweet 359's, and some of the dailies rock ( literally ).

    And you have Skinning and no second one. Let's pick something tank-friendly.

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