+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: Taking more dmg in raids than other tank. Cant figure out why?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    4

    Taking more dmg in raids than other tank. Cant figure out why?

    Need some advice, i seem to be taking a lot more dmg in raids than our other tank.

    I seem to have better gear etc, he is a pally and im a warrior.

    I am much harder to heal and take more damage according to logs can anyone help me figure out why?

    here is my armoury

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...entendu/simple

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    2,043
    Do you need hit? In a couple of places you've reforged avoidance into mastery when you had hit/exp to do so (and once reforged mastery into hit). That wouldn't be the cause because it's only a few %, but it is curious... Also you have 3/3 in incite, but then 2/2 in thunderstruck instead of War Academy - if you're going to buff HS, you'd be better off grabbing War Academy as well over Thunderstruck. At least I think so.

    Do you have logs? Since you seems to have good gear, are you taking avoidable damage or not using your CDs appropriately? Are there particular bosses?

    Looking just at your gear, nothing explains "much harder to heal and take more damage" unless the other tank is in 359+ (as you're in 346/359).
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    725
    Well I doub't it's something with your character. It looks ok. Well I think there are better choices as a trinket than the alchemists at the momenht. You don't gear for stamina anywhere else and in most cases it's just better to drink an armor pot or suff like this.

    Are you using SB more or less on CD? Especially when you know that hard abilities will come up? Are you using your SW and LS and Enraged Regeneration? Is your Demo Shout up all the time against bosses?

    @Loganisis:
    He only reforged dodge/parry over hit/expertise, if the hit/expertise on the gear was extremely low. He got more mastery out of this, than if he would have reforged the hit/expertise. You cannot tell which strategy is better by only giving it a short look.

    Anyway, what is true is, that the you have many items with hit and expertise. They are not BIS. You lose much there. Upgrading them to an item with better stat coverage will help. I myself have less purples but slightly more dodge and mastery with the same parry. Even while NOT using pure mastery gems so much at the moment.
    Last edited by Katzazi; 02-02-2011 at 10:48 AM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    WI, USA
    Posts
    2,614
    Quote Originally Posted by brersam View Post
    take more damage according to logs
    You need a combat log to more accurately determine what is happening to one character versus another. Also without reference to the second character, or the particular encounter it isn't really possible to determine why player A takes more damage than player B when we don't even know who player B is, and what is hitting player A. A combat log would be ideal.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    899
    Does the combat log show you take more damage on equal conditions on the same timer? If you are spiky that means you need more health because you stacked too much mastery yet still aren't unhittable, and will not be until t13.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    4
    I am swapping out the mastery trinket with Vial of stolen memories depending on the fight.

    We have some World of Logs here http://www.worldoflogs.com/guilds/104431/ but im not sure how to use it very well.

    I am using SB near enough on Cooldown and shield wall, last stand also. Last week it seemed i was alot harder to heal on Nefarian, but swapped over with the other tank to onyxia, and still seemed harder to heal on the same mob.

    Also seems last night during conclave i was alot harder to heal also.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    2,043
    Quote Originally Posted by Katzazi View Post
    @Loganisis:
    He only reforged dodge/parry over hit/expertise, if the hit/expertise on the gear was extremely low. He got more mastery out of this, than if he would have reforged the hit/expertise. You cannot tell which strategy is better by only giving it a short look.
    That makes sense - which made me look at it closer, and I still think in this case it's not optimal.

    Though it's undone by the 128 mastery he converted to hit in the trinket.

    *****

    Why I think it would be better to reforge hit, even though reforging dodge gives more mastery.

    http://elitistjerks.com/f15/t29453-c..._85_cataclysm/

    ~177 rating = 1% dodge
    ~179 rating = 1 mastery = 1.5% block

    I'm going to simplify this as they are close and say the net effect is a rating point of mastery is 1.5x more effective in maximizing passive unhittablity than dodge. I know this is a simplification, especially given diminishing returns - so mastery is probably better than 1.5x more effective. But I don't understand diminshing returns calculations well enough (yet) to really delve into it.

    So...

    190 dodge becomes 114 dodge and 76 mastery. 76*1.5 = 114 'effective' rating points.

    So 114 + 114 = 228 'effective' rating points towards unhittablity when reforging dodge.

    When reforging hit, 96 hit becomes 38 mastery. 38*1.5 = 57 'effective' rating points.

    So 190 + 57 = 247 'effective' rating points towards unhittability when reforging hit.

    The inflection point is 1.75. If, when calculating, for this item only (since it will be dependent on the differences in the two raitings and how much mastery is given), mastery is actually more than 1.75 time more effective towards reaching 102.4, then reforging dodge maximizing potential. If it's less, then hit gives more. If it's 1.75 exactly, then it's basically even.

    So for the neck... and I'm sure someone will correct me if I've screwed this up royally, reforging hit would be better if the target is maximizing passive unhitability.
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    2,043
    Quote Originally Posted by brersam View Post
    I am swapping out the mastery trinket with Vial of stolen memories depending on the fight.

    We have some World of Logs here http://www.worldoflogs.com/guilds/104431/ but im not sure how to use it very well.

    I am using SB near enough on Cooldown and shield wall, last stand also. Last week it seemed i was alot harder to heal on Nefarian, but swapped over with the other tank to onyxia, and still seemed harder to heal on the same mob.

    Also seems last night during conclave i was alot harder to heal also.
    Maybe someone smarter than I can figure it out, but looking at the Nef encounter from last week, the average melee hit was virtually the same. You took a little more from Blast Nova on average (about 8k) but there weren't many of these. And about 8k more on Electrocute.

    On average, the hits looked identical...

    Did you have the same healer most of the time? Could it be that one healer tends to focus more on you and one more on him and that the difference there is the cause?

    Of course, in near death situations, good use of AD will still trump virtually everything out there - a Pally really does have a get-out-of-jail-free-card if used in a probably death scenario. That might be part of it?
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

+ Reply to Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts