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Thread: Heroic PVP

  1. #21
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    No it's about the differences in skill.

    High PVP skill = good pvp gear.

    High PVE skill = good pve gear.

    but high PVP skill does not = good PVE skill or vise versa.

    Also how ppl with high PVP skill do not care enuff about pve to learn how to do it; but still want the points, rep, and gear.

    Although the reverse is probably also true but not to as great of an extent.

    The real point I was trying to make was ppl should have to do the reg. instance to unlock the heroic version; then whether pve or pvp oriented they would have some idea of what to do.
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity View Post
    I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say that this thread is just pretty dumb overall.
    Most topics with

    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    What Blizz should do
    in the original post tend to end up that way.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    The real point I was trying to make was ppl should have to do the reg. instance to unlock the heroic version; then whether pve or pvp oriented they would have some idea of what to do.
    I've done better my first time ever in many heroics than most people do in their 5th time there. And this was back when relatively little was known about them. Just because you have been there, doesn't mean you've actually learned anything from it.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  4. #24
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    Or how about the fact originally you couldn't even queue for the lower dungeons on normal once you hit 85. What if you leveled out of the range to queue for Blackrock Caverns. Sorry, you have to wait for a patch to allow you to queue for that dungeon on normal, or make a group yourself and walk there. And what about everyone with alts. It was already annoying enough that you had to discover all the enterances on each of your alts which they are getting rid of in the patch, but you suggest to run all of them as well.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  5. #25
    High PVP skill = good pvp gear.

    High PVE skill = good pve gear.
    That right there is already wrong in so many ways.

  6. #26
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    Experience

    Quote Originally Posted by Quinafoi View Post
    Or how about the fact originally you couldn't even queue for the lower dungeons on normal once you hit 85. What if you leveled out of the range to queue for Blackrock Caverns.
    That is what i was talking about with ppl lvl'n to 85 and thenn queing up for heroics without knowing how to do the dungeons.
    If you do that then go back and do the dungeon so you know what your doing in the heroic; and if you believe that is too much trouble then you fit into the category of people that "can't be bothered" to learn the strategy that i was talking about.

    And what about everyone with alts. It was already annoying enough that you had to discover all the enterances on each of your alts which they are getting rid of in the patch, but you suggest to run all of them as well.
    Unless your lvl'ing all mellee dps then your role will be different each time with new things to learn.

    My first 85 was a healer/range dps which is very different than the Tank/Mdps I lvl'd next; the mechanics - role - and experience was very different with new things for me to learn.
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity View Post
    That right there is already wrong in so many ways.

    Your right I forgot about those that "camp out" in pvp, lvl their cooking during the battle, get free honor, and buy pvp gear.

    I will also say I may have been a bit harsh on PVP'ers.

    A lot of people think they become invincible once they get a few epics; PVP'ers are just more noticable because they get them earlier than others.

    So i guess a more appropriate title for this thread would have been "Epic Noobz" and not targeting just PVP'ers.
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    High PVP skill = good pvp gear.
    Usually True, especially for access to gear that requires a rating.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    High PVE skill = good pve gear.
    Not always true, because there is the RNG for loot. Have known people that have such horrible luck with drops or rolls it isn't even funny, yet did so much more than the people (people with better gear too) that won the rolls.

  9. #29
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    I'm pretty sure Mike B was saying how he HATES when people come into dungeons in PvP gear. Might wanna watch again. Even if the dungeon is completable it just feels dirty like it would be alot faster if the person came in actual gear for what hes doing. Healers and Tanks especially but even dps as they are severely lacking hit rating in full pvp gear. The days of pugging archivon make me shudder.

    Also the only gear that requires a rating and gives better stats now are weapons... and if you happen to be the right class/spec during the right patch for arena only very average skill is required for 2200. Most of the 'skilled' players sit a 2.5k+

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    Unless your lvl'ing all mellee dps then your role will be different each time with new things to learn.
    Sorry, but just because you didn't play a particular role doesn't mean you can't be aware of what they are doing. That is pretty much a requirement of a leader, and a quality player in general. Awareness of what is around you. That includes the other players you are grouped with.

    I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to agree with others who have stated, this topic simply isn't going anywhere.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinafoi View Post
    Sorry, but just because you didn't play a particular role doesn't mean you can't be aware of what they are doing. That is pretty much a requirement of a leader, and a quality player in general. Awareness of what is around you.
    Having a maxed out range dps will teach you very little about how to TANK heroics or even reg. dungeons.

    If you max out a tank you will learn more than most but still not how to manage mana when healing, or even where to stand or how to move as a ranged player.

    Getting your first maxed out toon will make it much easier for the next ones but not teach you everything you need to know about all the other classes.

    For instance if you are hear then you probably tank; and have had "that guy" who has a maxed out mage telling you how to tank!
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinafoi View Post
    Or how about the fact originally you couldn't even queue for the lower dungeons on normal once you hit 85. What if you leveled out of the range to queue for Blackrock Caverns. Sorry, you have to wait for a patch to allow you to queue for that dungeon on normal, or make a group yourself and walk there.


    There was always a way around that especially if you are tank or heals just get a guildy or announce in trade that your running X and group with someone of appropiate lvl then you can que and port there if you had discovered it. With the coming patch it just gets easier for those that hadn't figured out the work around.
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  13. #33
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    So you're saying a good player can't learn from other people. In that case, the entire purpose of these forums is pretty much out the window. For example, if we can't learn from other people's experiences, then what is the purpose of encounter guides? Clearly you don't know anything about anything unless you have done it yourself and in your specific role.

    Sorry, this whole topic is pretty much worthless.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  14. #34
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    fail thread is fail.

    some pvp 2/4sets are OP in pve.

    with int str and agi being in general a bucketload more of a damage increase than every secondary stat ( except arguably hit) pvp gear can actually be a viable upgrade.

    a 339 - 359 pvp piece is going to be an upgrade over a 318 pve green.

    i got 329 on my hunter yesterday so this weekend i'll be doing hcs.
    i have 2 crafted epics and pvp gloves to boost my iLvl.

    by this logic ishouldnt be in the LFD for hcs.

    yet i have tanked and mellee dps'd every hc on my main, ive also killed 10/12 raid bosses, know how 99% of pulls should go in regards to optimising cc and yes, i have wyvern sting and freezing trap keybound as well as knowing how to distract shot kite anything that gets loose and that i shoudl tranq shot enrages off of mobs.

    - i can effectively cc 3 mobs per pull.

    now would you really not want me in a hc for having some pvp gear?
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  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Illidra View Post
    fail thread is fail.

    some pvp 2/4sets are OP in pve.

    with int str and agi being in general a bucketload more of a damage increase than every secondary stat ( except arguably hit) pvp gear can actually be a viable upgrade.

    a 339 - 359 pvp piece is going to be an upgrade over a 318 pve green.

    i got 329 on my hunter yesterday so this weekend i'll be doing hcs.
    i have 2 crafted epics and pvp gloves to boost my iLvl.

    by this logic ishouldnt be in the LFD for hcs.

    yet i have tanked and mellee dps'd every hc on my main, ive also killed 10/12 raid bosses, know how 99% of pulls should go in regards to optimising cc and yes, i have wyvern sting and freezing trap keybound as well as knowing how to distract shot kite anything that gets loose and that i shoudl tranq shot enrages off of mobs.

    - i can effectively cc 3 mobs per pull.

    now would you really not want me in a hc for having some pvp gear?
    Unless I'm mistaken this wasn't about someone having 1-2 pieces of pvp gear, it was about people being decked out in nothing but pvp gear with no knowledge of the instances at all even the regular version.

    Yep I was right, here is the significant portion of the opening post:
    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    A toon will get to max lvl thru BG's then que for heroic in epic PVP gear having never done the reg instance or even reading up on it.
    Last edited by Selene; 02-07-2011 at 01:17 PM. Reason: added more

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinafoi View Post
    So you're saying a good player can't learn from other people. In that case, the entire purpose of these forums is pretty much out the window. For example, if we can't learn from other people's experiences, then what is the purpose of encounter guides? Clearly you don't know anything about anything unless you have done it yourself and in your specific role.
    The guides give you an advantage if you use them but 90% of players do not.

    Watching someone do a task and doing it yourself are competely different. You can't learn to manage rage/runic for interupts by watching a video, and you will not know to use bigger heals on the tank to give you time to dispel debuffs on the dps on a video.
    (Plus if they have never run the instance b4 reg or heroic they haven't watched anyone to learn anything)

    True a small percetage of players will be prepared, but for those that are prepared a 30 minute run in normal while recieving badges, gold, and gear will not be a major inconvenience.

    So you can kill the "DRAMA QUEEN" routine.
    Last edited by Uranos7; 02-08-2011 at 04:36 AM.
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Illidra View Post
    a 339 - 359 pvp piece is going to be an upgrade over a 318 pve green.

    i got 329 on my hunter yesterday so this weekend i'll be doing hcs.
    i have 2 crafted epics and pvp gloves to boost my iLvl.

    by this logic ishouldnt be in the LFD for hcs.

    yet i have tanked and mellee dps'd every hc on my main, ive also killed 10/12 raid bosses, know how 99% of pulls should go in regards to optimising cc and yes, i have wyvern sting and freezing trap keybound as well as knowing how to distract shot kite anything that gets loose and that i shoudl tranq shot enrages off of mobs.

    - i can effectively cc 3 mobs per pull.

    now would you really not want me in a hc for having some pvp gear?
    You would be just fine but ask yourself; would you want to be in a group with a PVP 3's team that had NEVER run a single Cata instance or looked at a heroic guide for that 1st heroic?
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uranos7 View Post
    You can't learn to manage rage/runic for interupts by watching a video, and you will not know to use bigger heals on the tank to give you time to dispel debuffs on the dps on a video.
    Clearly you're not a teacher if you don't know that for some people they can learn from such things. Even if you personally can not.

    Again, this thread is full of fail because it is built on the fact that everyone is the same calibur, everyone is an idiot. This is not the case.
    "In anything, if you want to go from just a beginner to a pro, you need a montage." /w TankSpot WTB Montage for Raiders.

  19. #39
    You would be just fine but ask yourself; would you want to be in a group with a PVP 3's team that had NEVER run a single Cata instance or looked at a heroic guide for that 1st heroic?
    Could this entire stupid thread just die already? We don't need to hear about how you hate PvPers in every other post, just let it go already, stop worrying what gear everyone is wearing and what parts of the game other people play when you're in a silly 5-man heroic JP farm.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity View Post
    Could this entire stupid thread just die already? We don't need to hear about how you hate PvPers in every other post, just let it go already, stop worrying what gear everyone is wearing and what parts of the game other people play when you're in a silly 5-man heroic JP farm.


    I don't hate PVP'ers.

    I PVP also; but I prepare for instances and raids b4 I join them.

    I do not just "show up" and expect others to explain every single ability a boss has!


    I am proposing a world where you could que for a pug, and not have to explain everything on every single boss, only what is different on heroic.

    After I started this thread Lore said much the same on PST.

    "And now every slobbering idiot gets to 85 then pvp's till he meets the item lvl for heroics."

    So if your taking offense, wipe the drool of your chin, and watch a video or read a guide.

    PS: Think of this; if these "slobering idiots" had to run the regular instances in order to unlock the heroic ones they would get more of their gear from them and spend less time
    "mucking up" your PVP!
    "It's always the Healer's fault; unless it's the Tanks fault, just ask the DPS'er in purples doing 5k!"

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