From last night testing, if phase 3 starts and the adds are still alive it's pretty much a wipe unless they go down in seconds. They will not cease casting, so interrupting is needed, but if you stay on platform after Nefy lands, you're going to die pretty fast due to him casting Shadow of Cowardice (30000 Shadowflame dmg + 100% Shadow dmg taken - stacks) on you.
Originally Posted by avidan
So make sure you got enough dps on each platform to kill the adds before the 3 minute mark.
Originally Posted by Indoril
Thanks for the info!
yes the bone spell i sused only if there is no one inside the pit where ony is. say for example one person in ur raid jumps inside the pit before anyone else is ready and the rest of the raid remains on top. as soon the person who jumped in dies and once there is no one in melee range for the adds to hit they will start shooting the bones and trust me they are nasty. u cannot bubble through it,.. it kills u any way unless u manage to outrun and take the elevator and run all th way out of instance.
Originally Posted by Luvaria
Question: did anyone encounter this on p1? Ony gains 20% in her exploding bar every time a crackle happens,. I can conform this happenned on our 25 man last night. We saw her jumping from 45% to 75% and then on another pull she jumped from 75% to 95% even though we had all range on onyxia. so after a couple of pulls we had to adjust ourself for 40% in her exploding bar for just 2 crackle and nuke her before the rest of her 60% fills up. This was particularly difficult cos even a slight miss calculation on dpsing here and pushing 2 crackle before she is dead will result in here explosion
This increase in energy bar is not because of lack of dps on her for sure. Can someone tell me if this is a part of mechanics on 25 man or is it bugged still?
Last edited by psathyanhome; 02-17-2011 at 01:09 PM.
We started doing this encounter this wednesday, yesterday we managed to get phase 1 under control, but when we get to phase 2 everything seems to go to hell pretty fast.
We all manage to get to our pilars and get all the interrupts as soon as they start casting. The problem comes when we try to push for a crackle. As soon as the crackle hits mostly we see 2 or 3 deaths right after, even considering we have everyone topped off right before it.
One of our healers said they read somewhere that there is a small AoE from shadow barrage, something like 3 yards, and that we should spread out on the platform. Is this correct?
Is it possible to do phase 3 when getting 2 crackles in phase 1 and none on phase 2?
Is there anything we can do to try and reduce the damage we take from shadow barrage aside from prismatic elixers and Mirror of Broken Images?
I would like any advice you guys can give for this fight. Thanks in advance.
From my experience, it is not 20%, more like 17-18%, but yes, it's not something you can ignore, you should always have it in mind. It is a mechanic of the fight, not a bug.
Originally Posted by psathyanhome
Also, if you get problems getting a 2nd crackle in ph 1, you must be quite low on raid dps. The possibility of her exploding made us think about pushing or not a 3rd crackle.. Why don't you try to start with all dps on her, stopping at 12% of her health then everyone switching to Nef? It will be easier to control her death (tank dmg alone should get her to 3-4%) and decide whether or not to push another crackle.
The crackles in ph 2 are a delicate matter, what we do is push one as soon as 2 prototypes are down and the raid is topped with people using cooldowns (barkskin, raidbubble etc), dps Nef for another 7-8%, wait for 1 minute without killing the remaining add (so cooldowns like barkskin, AMS are refreshed) and push the second crackle, with people assisting by Divine Hymn, Tranquility etc. Mirror of Broken Images is also OP in preventing deaths (it's not absolutely necessairy, but whoever tells it's a tank-only trinket is ignorant in my book)
About going into ph3 with only 2 crackles.. It's gonna be hell for your kite-tank and his healer. It is not impossible, but it will need perfect "kiting" and very good cooldown management, adds stepping once in fire and it's game over for you. If you cannot do with the 2 crackles in ph 2, try pushing at least one, using all cooldowns, we've killed him with 3 in the past
About Shadowflame barrage AoE component, I personally think it's a myth that originates from the spell's visual effect, I've heard people insisting there is a 2y AoE, others saying there is none. To be on the safe side, we are not standing on top of each other, but I do not believe it is true. If someone can confirm/deny it with proof, I'll edit out these lines asap.
Last edited by Indoril; 02-19-2011 at 04:29 AM.
i've created an addon based on the information in this thread:
This is an add-on that helps you the raid-leader to do the following during Nefarian BWD 10 man non-heroic:
(1) Keeping track of Onyxia's alternate power bar and Nefarian and Onyxia's health levels
(2) Marking the Animated Bone Warriors automatically when you target them.
(3) Keeping track of the stacks of Empower buffs and cc's (snares, slows, and binds) on the Animated Bone Warriors
(4) Shows the actual or estimated (in blue) power bar remaining on the Animated Bone Warriors. The estimate is used when it cannot be read directly as the mob is not being targeted by a player. It assumes that the energy bar has not been refilled since the last time it was read (i.e. not hit by the Shadowblaze or shadow breath).
(5) Counts the time to the next Shadowblaze in P3 (no combat log events so quite hard to time)
(6) Shows who the adds attacked in the last 3 seconds (useful to see who has aggro)
(7) Shows the time in seconds since each phase started (e.g. Phase 2 has 3 min cutoff). Phase 2's clock starts with Onyxia dies. Phase 3's clock starts 10s before the first Shadowblaze Spark.
- Ensure that all adds are being cc'd and not free to beat up on your healers. Some groups may use a third tank. Fear may not be a good idea because you want them to die together for phase 3 and because they may get into the shadowflame breath.
- Do not let the adds near the bosses because their shadowflame breath will reset their energy bar. If they do not get hit by the shadowflame breath, they should die in 50 seconds or around 12 stacks of the Empower buff.
- Can last up to 3 min. You may want to use as much time to let your healers regain mana.
- Timing here is crucial. Again the adds should die around 50 seconds or 12 stacks of the Empower buff if they do not get hit by the Shadowblaze Spark, Shadowflame Breath or Shadowblaze. Since the Shadowblaze Sparks come at 30, 55, 75, 90, 100, 110, 120, 130 seconds marks there should be two 5 second intervals where the adds are dead and the second tank isn't taking any damage (i.e. 50 - 55s, 105 - 110s). Thereafter there aren't any more damage-free windows.
Alternatively you may want to make sure they are in the fire at 7s (resetting their energy bar). They would die at 57 seconds (assuming you avoid the Shadowblazes on the ground and two Shadowblaze Sparks), giving you 57 seconds to 75 seconds damage-free. The next damage-free window is 125s - 130s and so on.
Last edited by acruxis; 02-26-2011 at 10:40 PM.
According to the logs i have from my 25 man trys it always targets 10 random ppl and the dmg is pretty much the same to each so i'm almost sure there's no splash dmg involved.
Originally Posted by Indoril
We're trying to push 2 crackles in p2 but healers are having a bad time to keep ppl up, how are you guys handeling the crackles in p2?
0-1 is enough, depending on your setup and (self)cooldowns avaible. Shorten p2 should save your healers tons of mana and if your kiting tank does his job well there's no reason to worry about risky p2 pushes whatsoever.
Splash was present during beta, has been removed since release due to organizing 7-8 people plus gazillions of pets was to hard.
Dealing with crackling (electrocute) is kinda tricky as people noted previously. You need to not only top people off just before it happens, you also need to use available cooldowns.
We noticed it helps a lot to have a discipline priest with Power-barrier to help with electrocute in phase 2. It works wonders to have a lightwell ready and let people use it just before electrocute happen (let people use bandage and healtstones here). If they die it is mainly their fault. Nobody should instantly die of it.
For people having difficulties with phase 2 and 3 I advise them to also take a look at http://25man.com/cata-guides/nefarian which is a pretty nice guide for this fight. Hope it works out!
i've just got a quick question..
does anyone know who hits harder between the three of these?
Onyxia, Nefarian, and the reanimated adds in p3.
i'm trying to adjust our assignments so i can take the hardest hitting ones (since i'm the best geared in our guild).
I would say that it depends:
Nefarian is definitely the hardest hitter of the three followed by Onyxia and the adds. However, in P3 you are tanking/kiting 5 adds that are getting progressively stronger, up to the point that they are hitting extremely hard given that there are five of them if you do not handle them well. One single add will not kill someone until it's frenzy is stacked pretty high, but 5 adds landing a hit at the same time that lightning machine hits can be extremely dangerous.
Our healers are struggling alot with their mana in phase3, we are doing this on 10man
Our closest try has been at around 23%, but then all healers were oom and all i heard was "ur gonna die", and well.. we died.
So what can we do to help ourselves keeping mana up for the entire fight? Our adds have been bad, and been all around the room, so if we can fix this i guess that would help.
Is there anything else we can do to get more or use less mana?
What healers are you using? One thing you might not be doing is grouping up. Everyone except the two tanks and the OT healer should be grouped up. Another thing we found is that mana in P2 wasnt nearly as bad if we interrupted EVERY add cast without fail. How many crackles are you pushing in P1 and P2? Posting logs always helps
Well is it 10 or 25 man?
Yesterday we had an off raid, that I couldn't attend. So my guild moved to BWD at nefarian.
The group setup was this: http://raidcomp.mmo-champion.com/?c=...00000000000000
The group was not the best one, would be better with a Priest healer istead of 2 druids and a warrior tank istead of 2 pallas.
I hope this helped you.
so my first time here was after we got Atramedes and Chimaeron in much less time than we anticipated, so for S&G we went after Nef and he roflstomped our faces in. Last night however, I joined a friend's group that needed one more on my DK, and I have some tips about the pull!
As a frost DK, I was able to completely and easily handle the adds in P1 with no outside cooldowns. Go blood presence on the pull. Put up diseases, and blood strike twice for the death runes. Then, as the adds spawn, literally a CoI on each will slow them and the tick will outthreat any heals going on. CoI the first, the second, the third, and then the 1st again. Literally I wasn't taking damage until Ony tail-swiped me. For the last two, just taunt/grip whatev. Then when they're all on you, DS on CD (BT is fine, but don't ERW). IBF about 5 seconds into the final add reaching you. When that's up, HC and they're all frozen. You'll have about 3 seconds of one of the adds hitting you, which is fine, then pop into frost and go beat on Nef.
Worse than you.
We're having the same issues with the 10 man version of this fight. We get Nef to 71-74% in phase1, kill ony, then head to our assigned pillars. However, once we get atop the pillars, we don't last very long.
Originally Posted by Hnetto
We had been doing the encounter with 2 pally tanks, and each tank was using a Divine Guardian for the the first two Crackles, and it was a night and day difference. However, now I think we may be better served saving one of the cooldowns for the start of phase2, at least until things get stable. As an alternative, we do have an Aura Mastery CD that we could use to reduce some of the Shadowflame Barrage.
I'll have to look through the logs to see if we were getting our interrupts out - there's just so much damage going that I'm sure some Blast Waves hit us.
I don't really see how we could push a Crackle (much less 2) in phase 2 and live through the fight. It almost seems like it would be easier to push 3 in phase 1 and none in phase 2.
Question regarding p1 adds:
My raid has killed nef a few times before with using a frost dk kiting the adds in p1 and he has had no problem, this week our dk had to stop playing for RL stuff and we're now forced to not have a dps dk.
Our set up is:
1 tank dk
1 tank war
1 heal shaman
1 heal pally
1 heal druid
1 balance druid
Tonight we tried to have one of the hunters kite them in p1 and it just didn't go too well, he was generally able to get aggro but went splat if they ever caught up with him.
I came here hoping to get any tips from people who haven't used a dk or mage to kite them, or a 3rd tank to tank them, on 10 man.
Looks like you should have enough to CC them. Hunters trap/pet tank can get 4 out of 5 at least. Root from the boomkin, lock has a pet.
On 10-man, our hunter uses a turtle pet to tank all 5 skeletons.