The Cataclystic Protection Warrior Spreadsheet

[Tengenstein]

I mentioned it to a GM a few days ago, he told me to go make a post on the suggestion forum...i miss that forum.

[Booi]

People need to keep in mind that the deep wounds damage is rolled into the crits. And since we're looking at > 60% uptime on deep wounds, these are not realistic results. You do not get 6 ticks of deep wounds for every crit you get.

If you just crit and applied deep wounds for 6 seconds, surely the next GCD is worth more as a revenge than a devastate. Yes, devastate has a 20% higher chance of applying an extra tick (2 ticks?) of your current deep wounds, not a 20% chance to apply 6 more ticks of deep wounds.

Not that I'm going to begin monitoring deep wounds to determine which buttons I push. But I still find myself in low rage situations, and I don't think revenge is as dead as people make it out to be.

[Airowird]

Booi, Deep Wounds is a rolling DoT, like Ignite, if you have 4 ticks for X damage each still going and crit again you don't just get the normal weapon damage, you also get those 4*X spread out over the DoT (so 0.75*X extra per tick).
You can stack that up pretty much as high as you practicly can, up to ticks doing more damage than a SS-HR crit (although good luck critting that much)

[Booi]

good to know, thanks for the clarification.

[Tengenstein]

There are however 2 bugs that have a slight impact on Deep wounds Functionality, nothing major, but still good to be aware of.

Deep Wound Munching: if you get two procs of deep wounds in quick sucession, the first proc is ignored if it isn't full processesd by the time the second proc occurs.

You can't refresh dots that are longer than their regular duration; if you managed to safeclip deep wounds instead of being 6seconds its now 7 seconds, until it drops below 6 seconds again you cannot refresh it.

Ignite suffers from the exact same problems.


I love Revenge, it's one of mey favoureit abilities, one of my fondest moment in WoW was being getting Rev back in tirisfal an tearing things apart at low level with it. unfortunatle the only thing it has going for it now is its low rage cost. The problem is almost every other move doesn't require a 2 talent point investment to make it worth using in a situationyou nver want to be in. if you didn't take war academy, or Sword and board you would still use Devastate. I can pictuire a Shield Slamless rotation but it seems pretty wierd, picturing a revengeless one is optimal. i need Revenge because i am that rage hungry. It's just it doesn't get the talent support it needs. almost evey other move in our arsenal has at least 2 different talents you can take to support it. Rev only has one and it doesn't share it , it doesn't interplay at all.

Revenge is the equivalent of a mage's wanding right now. It requires 2 talent points and a Prime Glyph slot to be worth having on your bar....sounds awefully familiar

it needs either better scaling, to be affected by other talents Rev benefiting from SnB, or WA would be nice, or Imp Rev needs to do something Funky, like stop revenge being Dodged/parried/Blocked, or always Hit twice (if there isn't a second target, it hits the first one again). Hell have Heavy Repercussions do something for it, the talent sounds like it should effect Revenge

[klausi]

i need Revenge because i am that rage hungry.

That's an important point. After reading about all that hate for (improved) revenge on the Alysrazor thread i just looked on the spreadsheet again to check the numbers, my average revenge hits on high vengeance fights like Baleroc or Domo heroic is fairly decent (13-14k) and i can almost always use that free'd up 10 rage to squeeze in another (well 2/3) heroic strike.

Comparing that to another 6% damage on rend/thunderclap (that's about +0.5% of my total damage or less then 100 dps) and empowered shockwaves (i actually tend to not use them enough/at all).

[Tengenstein]

It hinges on wether you can use the rage saved for another HS. I prefer dropping BnT than TS, it just shows a slight increase on my single target sims, and is a simpler way to play. Maybe i'll change my mind when my guild reaches Rag, but for now the only AoE i eet is rhyolith fragments and I don't need ot to hold aggro on them

[Grimfist]

Also, if you aren't using BnT, let Rend run out! Applying Rend gives you an instant tick, refreshing doesn't. (There is some pro AoE way of using TC 0.3s before Rend runs out, getting the tick + one for the 'new application', but it's very time-sensitive so don't do it unless you got some practise on it)

This is no longer true. This was hotfixed a while ago. You can refresh Rend with TC or Rend and get the initial tick of Rend. Look at WoL Logs you can clearly see this. I only have german Logs so can't give proof here, but it's defentily hotfixed.

[Airowird]

As I can read German enough to understand it, I'ld actually love to see these logs. If TC really does instant damage from BnT, it would be a big plus for BnT. But you gotta be sure that they are refreshes, not applications through BnT. That means that the first time you spread Rend, you do get the instant ticks, but I've yet to see the refresh do extra damage.

[Fetzie]

If you upload a German combatlog to WoL and browse to the expression editor all the functions are still in English, only the spell names themselves are in German.

#Correction: the spell names also appear to be in English on a log uploaded by a guidie with the German client.

[gom]

I'ld actually love to see these logs.

Are you looking for something specific? I could give you a link to my logs but we only raid once every week. Last week I tried to maintain tengensteins first rotation. With BnT safeclipping top priority. 8/2/31 no imp. revenge.

[Airowird]

Actually, I got to check it myself, BnT does indead give an 'instant' tick the moment you re-apply Rend through it.

[veksen]

The boss swing damage is unmitigated swing, correct? I added a table to calculate it, thanks to you

Maybe it could be nice to add one to the sheet?

Also, some things that I think are missing :
Unmitigated boss melee swing calculator from mitigated values
Stamina Flask
Windwalk
Different/mixed stat values for different gearing strategies
Wowhead filter scales links

I've myself incorporated a mixed up stat rating giving out a wowhead link, using BurstTime values for avoidance, then scaling armor with mastery according to Total Reduction (atm 90 mastery = 1000 armor), and then stamina from it's relative value to armor. I gear for CTC > Damage Reduction > EH, so these values make the most sense to me. Maybe assign different values to stats (CTC, DR, EH) and then the possibilities to mix-match the scale of those values.

[Airowird]

I noticed the Stamin Flask thing yesterday, it was a Validity issue with the removal of the Agility one.
I will also add in the reverse-number boss hit if you like it, guess it won't be that hard to implement
Windwalk I kinda hate, because it's gain is not exactly "buff * uptime" due to the DR and doesn't help on Unhittable gearing, but I'll have a go at it when I got some spare time.


The stat values tabs has EHP, TankPoints (= EHP / (1 - DR)) & Burst Time of which the last 2 already have HEP, which are sorta the stat weights (and the weighted columns being stat-value adjusted, so you know which gem/trinket is generally speaking the best).
I can definately look for a way to have it spit out Wowhead links, but I don't understand your question about different values for gearing strategies. If you want to go for pure damage reduction, the stat highest ranked on TankPoints is the best, for CTC coverage, Mastery always wins, for guaranteed reduction, the only gearing is SB or full Unhittable (with the esception of an Armor trinket), for magic bosses, Stamina > all. There is usually very few difficulties in stat priorities when you know what your gearing strategy is. It's finding out that strategy that matters
In fact, the only difficult gearing strategy is Burst Time, which I already give you stats for (and with the added option to filter out block if you like).

[kopcap]

If you have not seen it yet, check the updated mastery/avoidance graph on MMO-C. Basically what it comes too is parry dramatically jumps in value the moment we get unhittable due to HtL's effect past the cap.

[pulled]

not sure i really understand what you're saying properly but if you're asking what i think you: Pretty much, though maintining rend is your no.1 priority in the first rotation so you should be making sure you're ina postion to refesh rend in those last few moments. you shouldn't ever need to refresh rend early though Shield or some of top end trucks would probably beat it, depends on how early you refresh it.

As a 10 man tank i'm not hit anywhere near hard enough to get the rage for the first rotation to be maintained, so i use the second.

I had a similar experience. h domo tonight was first time i ran into a true feeling of unlimited rage in 10 man and utilized ur first rotation as best as i could(def a more challenging then ur 2nd), it was very useful ty. our mage pulled 49.5k dps and I didn't make him or ne of our dps throttle at all they said.

[Tengenstein]

Good to know it works in practice aswell as theory. Was it really that much harder to pull off or is it just breaking the SnB Habit that's causing difficulty.

[pulled]

it was my first night tryen it, and tbh not that bad i think with an addon to help better monitor rend it would be even ezer(atm i usen icehud which shows it near my char, but its bunched up with other debuffs) i was considering possibly usen the showmewhen addon that pvpers use alot. Im sure the next time i go to try, it will be ezer. And on domo there really isn't much going on for us tanks, possibly on more complex tanking fights it could be a challenge. Overall not to bad to maintain.

[marklar]

i just tried out your spreadsheet, and i have a question about it (4.2.0).

on the stats tab, i looked at the AP (effective) formula, but it seems to leave out the contribution of your strength from raid buffs. if you entered armory AP in B8, wouldn't you need to add something to the C8 formula like "(C6-B6)*2"?

or am i looking at it wrong?

[Airowird]

Will have a look at it