So I guess this is "works as intended" then?!
However, until now my Rotation was like this:
But with the issue mentioned above I can see how this can become a problem to this "rotation". Letting Rend fall off and reapply it is probably better then playing the rng and try to safe clip it unless you're hit capped. But I wonder if it is even worth now?
Originally Posted by Tengenstein
I would suspect that if you shifted your priority to
2.TC to maintain rend <3 second duration
3. fish for SnB procs if SS's CD is >1.5
so that means I apply rend after the first time I didn't got an SnB proc?! and then try to maintain it with TC unless I get a Situation where rend duration is <3 and at the same time SS comes off cooldown then I would rend fall off in favor of SS. is that correct?
Well being that the GCD is 1.5s and the interval between rend ticks is 3 seconds you have a 2 gcd window in which to refresh rend so you never have a conflict between SS and refreshing rend. you either refresh rend as soon as it drops under 3 seconds, or you SS and Refresh rend the next GCD when rends got less than 1.5 seconds left.&amp;lt;br&amp;gt;&amp;lt;br& amp;gt;the only time this isn't true is if you're sitting with SS available while rends ticking (out of melee range perhaps?)
TC has a 95% hit chance in low hit gear, you gonna miss like 2 BnTs over a course of a ten minute fight.
Thats what, less than 50 dps? I doubt this is going to affect anything.
another question: In this tier I find myself more often in Battle Stance. I'm not sure what the optimal rotation is when I'm not tanking. I pretty much do the same except I prioritize Colossus Smash over Shield Slam. Also what is best after 20%: do you keep your rotation or do you spam just execute?
Probably spam Execute if you've got the rage. The thing hits harder than anything bar a heaver repercussions Shield Slam. I'll do a little work in simcraft later after i've gotten some sleep
that would be awesome thanks in advance. It would also be interesting if you could test if colossus smash worth it or is it maybe better to stay in berserker stance?
Execute drains your rage away almost instantly, i found myself rage starved after 2-3 executes with nothing left to do for a while. That's why i went back to the regular "rotation". Execute hits harder but getting a free shield slam while spamming devastate isn't to shabby either.
Right, its all incredibly dependant upon your rage gain, to the point that are if you were prot DPS you're gearing would be Hit>haste>Crit>expertise your rotation would be SS>Dev assuming no external sources of rage (i.e blackhorn after your P1 debuffs have run off). Its very difficult to assign arbitary rage thresholds at which you should be using stuff since while you may be able to heroic strike now its no good if you it stalls you out 5 gcds later. For the most part you want to go back to basic Wrath tanking rotation of SS>Fish>fish>truck, using HS sparingly and only to stop you capping out, This should be done in Berserker Stance, and you should move behind the boss
Colossus Smash is cheapest mechanic to add in, and it should be treated as The first priority Truck, if its available it should be used the GCD before SS comes off CD, if you're stalling out on rage drop it from your rotation.
Execute can be weaved in but you will need some serious incoming rage to spam it (probably an unhealable amount of damage), Treat it like a truck and slide it in above Shockwave but below CS, but you're really gonna have to feel your way with this as it will very easily stall you out if you're not managing rage well, you want to have at least 50 rage to make it worth pushing the button, but that's a real are minimum with no concerns for your rage in 2gcds time you probably want to be banking rage close to the cap to start weaving this in.
Rend requires us to off DPS in battle so is a ~4% damage loss straight away, AND still have the rage to be able to sacrafice SnB procs to time your TCs, and if you've got that much rage, you'd probablyl be better off spamming it away with HS in zerkerstance.
It's all gotten a bit john fucking madden.
very interesting. I didn't thought that berserker stance would outdps battle stance with rend since rend has such a high priority in our normal rotation. I think I will mix it up a bit though. i.e in the encounter spine of deathing I use berserker stance all the time for the tentacle but in madness of deathwing I use both. After the corruption tentacle I will start with battle stance on the claw so that I can use my rend and spread it on the corrupted blood asap. I also try to have 3 stack thunderstruck for a monstertruck shockwave for these adds. after that I go berserker stance. After 20% the group damage and therefore the rage income was sufficient that I was able to spam execute ~85k average per execute for about 10-20sec. SS was only about 25k. this was 10m with blue aspect as the last platform.
on the other bosses where you need to tank back and forth between the two tanks I need further testing. I'm the only one with the attack speed reduce in our group so it might be better to dps in battle stance if the tanking time is more then 30s between the 2 tanks
the thing is Rend has a high (theoretically infinite) damage per execute time. the problem comes from maintaining it since TC is expensive and due to having a limited timing of it will almost certainly eat into our SnB procs making even more expensive.
its entirely viable to say hold on my DPS while not tanking is patheitc so i'll sacrafice a small amount of it to mainitain rend, but gain a GCD not putting rend back up when i start tanking again.
so today when I was buying a set piece for my warrior I stumbled upon the 2PC dps set bonus.
I'm sure a lot of you guys are aware of this but personally I don't pay attention to the other set bonuses until I'll get in reach of one. However this is awesome for tanking as well (from a damage point of view) I would trade this bonus for my 2PC prot bonus anytime. I did a quick sim and it turned out to be a 2000dps increase for me in my gear ~395ilvl. Unfortunately the 4PC prot bonus is kind of mandatory for the heroic content but for farm content and other stuff besides raiding it's nice to have especially for low rage situations. The chest and the legs are probably the best choice for this since they have a combination of hit/mastery and expertise/mastery
^Yup. I wish we could get the 2pc dps and 4pc prot too. The 2pc prot blows.
Originally Posted by Tengenstein
As the official talent calculator seems to be Alpha ready now, I'll be starting on a spreadsheet for 5.0.
I'm also thinking of maybe (should I have enough time) building a stand alone tool/executable for some armoury importing etc. which would eventually (this is a REALLY big if, but it's an option I wouldn't consider in a spreadsheet) of building a small sim. It would probably be a C based sim (best speed imho) with most likely a Java interfacing front, although I'm open to suggestions (and a helping hand if you are burning to build a sim for some dark mysterious reason)
But before I even start that I'ld love some feedback on what you guys would find useful in the current spreadsheet and what you guys would be looking forward to in such a exec/program in MoP.
I would love to be able to create, save and share both boss and character profiles. And then plot things like TtL and BT against that.
So I had some spare time left and decided to take a peek at the pre-alpha talents & abilities.
I actually came up with some interesting changes...
Note: I took the liberty of retaining AP modifiers where no new was specified and used the tooltip values as base dmg. Except for Shield Slam & Victory Rush they seem a bit logical, but no guarantees! My estimate for them is ~35-40% of AP (coming from resp. 60% & 56%). This is assuming 8-9k AP.
* The talents that are comparable (Tiers 2,4,6) are actually pretty close together;
* In Tier 2, both Impending Victory & Second Wind (the new Blood Craze) are actually slightly winning from Last Stand + Enraged Regeneration combo on overall HPS (assuming 2s boss swings). Due to rotation quirks, IV only wins from SW on overall HPS when you're fighting a caster/fly-phase boss.
* In Tier 4, Avatar is the best single-target DPS, Bladestorm wins on AoE burst, Shockwave is the middle ground.
* Stormbolt is your best Tier 6 boss ability, Bloodbath is the runner up/compromise, just before Deadly Calm(3xHS). Deadly Calm is best used while AoEing with Cleave.
* Shockwave and Stormbolt miss out on decent synergy with the abilities on the other Tier, making them less ideal for burst phases as well as burdening your rotation.
* With only 1 ability that can proc SnB every 9 seconds, we move closer to a rotation compared to today's mess.
* Assuming same weapon DPS (and AP without Vengeance) as now, the damage seems to be toned down to about 20% of your current DPS
* Due to the new cooldowns on Rev & Dev as well as the numbers being changed around, it seems that Revenge is starting to actually be decent and Dev is not "that one wore-down button" anymore. Even Impending Victory seems to be competitive!
* A max output priority seems to be naturally returning to a simple rotation of
a) Shield Slam or Thunder Clap
b) Revenge, CD/filler ability or Devastate
c) go to (a) for more 69696 rotation!
or in a complex way: Rev-SnB SS-Dev-TC-?-SS-Rev-TC-Dev-SS-?-TC-repeat (SS > Rev > TC > filler/Dev)
* In the above rotation, you ideally need only one 'filler' ability every 9s, but it can be changed freely with Devastate in the rotation. (This allows Shockwave & Stormbolt to be used twice resp. every 45s (36s with glyph = 25% more SWing!) and 66s (only 10% less than it's max DPS).
* Every other Revenge will actually be followed by SS regardless of SnB. Luckily this starts at the 2nd Rev after SnB.
* Revenge = Rage, so delay TC if Rev lights up later than expected. But don't leave SS in the cold
* An SnB proc is roughly worth (SS damage - TC damage) + 10 Rage ('lose' 5 from the SS CD already gone)
* Shield Slam + Revenge rotation is worth up to 2,4 Rage per second (or enough Rage to SB every 25s)
That's about all I got for now. I'm actually looking forward to most of these changes! (Although Revenge still being a proc is kinda meh)
Rest in Peace Fishfishtruck. You served us well. I will always miss you.
Great info, quickly looking at the talents I thought Bloodbath is way better than Stormbolt but running some quick numbers it does look like Stormbolt is a bit better and much better burst, plus if things say like they are we are going to need as many things as possible to fill in GCD'd. I guess for AoE Bloodbath would easily win out, at least compared to Stormbolt.
Stormbolt only really shines due to it's quad dmg on boss component (I assume the stun would otherwise make it mandatory for PvP).
My initial prediction would be that Bloodbath + Bladestorm will end up as the favourite combo for bursty AoE, Deadly Calm + Avatar as single target combo (still does pretty decent in case of an AoE/add burst phase) and halfway in between would be Bloodbath + Avatar (favours neither AoE or single target).
Stormbolt will probably fighting Bloodbath/Deadly Calm depending on whether the fight is about mobility or burst, and Shockwave, unfortunately, is probably just going to end up as a heroic only choice due to it's stun and the less-than-perfect cooldown making it lose out ~10% of it's DPS compared to it's theoretic max, making Avatar even better for overall DPS while Bladestorm still wins on burst AoE.
I also think that Blizz seems to not mind the extra 'free' GCD (available for shouts, IV, hell even Slam will do!) so it wouldn't worry about 'filling the gaps' with your talents rather than picking your favourite play style.
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