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Thread: Earth, wind, & fire

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    Earth, wind, & fire

    After the new patch has dropped, i was looking at this new achievement for VoA 10 and 25 player mode. I couldnt find a link to the achievement on a website, but its basically this-kill archavon, emalon, koralon in 60 seconds of each other. So basically, my question would be how is this possible?

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    Simple. The bosses don't leash when you move out of their room, so you just pull them all into one room.

    You'll have to keep in mind the mechanics of each fight;
    Archavon will grab the primary aggro target from time to time.
    Archavon will jump around and leave clouds to not stand in.
    Archavon will throw rock shards at a random person so ranged should be spread out.
    Emalon will cast Lightning Nova so he needs to be away from ranged people.
    Emalon will charge one of his four adds and it needs to be zerged.
    Emaon will chain lightning people so ranged people need to spread out

    Koralon isn't out yet, but once he is, you learn and master his mechanics. Remember Koralon will have the most health of the three and will hit hardest, so you'll have to decide which pull order you start with or if you just pull all three at the same time. Also need to be careful on how low you get each one. Archavon can be killed extremely fast, Koralon will take the longest.

    This will probably be done with an "abnormal" raid comp such as using 3 tanks or 4 healers on the 10-man version. It'll be about coordination and properly dealing each of the abilities.
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    and what about the add tank for ema? I cant think my raid group can down over charged minions w/ 3-4 tanks 3 heals and 2 dps for 10man. or when arch throws the tank, who taunts off. Obv i am getting ahead of myself but im trying to figure it out in my head but its not working for some reason.

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    People were thinking the same thing about the OS 3D encounter and look how fast people learnedit

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    Quote Originally Posted by luv2tank View Post
    and what about the add tank for ema? I cant think my raid group can down over charged minions w/ 3-4 tanks 3 heals and 2 dps for 10man. or when arch throws the tank, who taunts off. Obv i am getting ahead of myself but im trying to figure it out in my head but its not working for some reason.
    The group you use will depend primarily how geared your members are. The better the tanks are, the fewer you need etc. 3 tanks, 3 healers, 4 DPS will probably be the best comp to try at the start and work from there.

    As for what happens on things like Archavon grabbing/throwing the tank, that will require coordination. For example using 3 tanks you could have one tank on Koralon (plus adds), another holding Emalon (plus adds), and the last holding Archavon. When Archavon grabs his tank, the better geared tank or whoever is taking the least damage of the two will hold Archavon until the held tank gets thrown. After the first tank gets thrown he just taunts Archavon back. I'd be hesitant to have the Archavon tank hold adds due to him being grabbed, and depending on ranged DPS, Emalon may not be the best choice to hold adds by due to Lightning Nova, leaving them to the Koralon tank (Naturally I don't know if Koralon will have any sort of AoE melee will need to avoid). Another possibility would be the Emalon tank just hold the adds and one of the others taunt whichever one gets overcharged.

    This fight relies strongly on coordination, similar to Sarth 3D used to (and gear to a lesser extent). Remember that by the time Koralon is out, most raids will be vastly overgeared for Emalon and Archavon, so the vital DPS (Emalon's overcharged add) should NEVER be an issue. There are many ways this fight will be doable, it comes down to what will work for your raid set up.
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    my friend said it would be a pure nuke fest. his idea was tanks on all bosses at once with a healer on them and then having only 5k+ DPS just rape the bosses and move on to the next as fast as they can and repeat, he said a good group could do it in about 45-50 seconds.


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    from what I know, koralon has a sabre lash that is ideally split between two tanks (and will probably one shot people not in plate or bear fur in front of him), places fire on the ground and does a fire quill style aoe about once a minute or so.

    I do not know the extent of which the sabre lash would be reduced to if it was shared around 8-10 players though.

    Remember, the bosses have different amounts of health.

    Archavon has the least, about 3 million, Emalon has a bit more, we can expect koralon to have 20% more health than emalon. Emalon is the boss with the highest hp + hard berserk, koralon has a soft berserk mechanic like gruul (does more damage over time until the tank dies and he rapes the raid), and archavon has a hard berserk timer..

    I would start with koralon, then emalon, then arcahvon; bring them all down to about 7% life, then kill emalon (because adds are annoying), then archavon (because these have hard berserks) then koralon (who should be really low then because he has the tank beating on him for about 3 mins while below 7% life). Take a druid who can teddy form to taunt archavon at the threat dump and then siwtch back to kitty/bird to dps. Emalon needs tanking away from the raid because of the nova, archavon away from the other tanks because of the stun at the aggro dump. koralon probably needs a high armor class next to the tank because of the sabre lash.
    Last edited by Fetzie; 08-17-2009 at 07:08 AM.

  8. #8
    You also have to bear in mind that the bosses have enrage timers to deal with.
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    im still thinking about the overcharged adds tho. I really dont see this happening w/ minimal dps. eh, maybe blizz will put a lil trick in there for us...

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    Tank all of them on intersection. Each one at the start of corridors.

    1st pull Archavon and bring him to 10%,

    2nd pull Emalon, and bring him to 10% (by the time this is out 2dps should be able to kill emalon add, or 5 on 25 man)

    3rd pull Koralon, burn him - heroism/BL right after emalon's enrages 1 add)

    Will not be easy, but lots of fun

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    Setup:
    4 Tanks
    3 Heals
    3 Extremely high burst dmg.


    Everyone heads to the new guy. He doesn't do all that much. Get him somewhere along the lines of 50K hp left. Leave a tank and a healer for the fight. If the fight goes right the 15k dmg (its some random targeted 15k dmg) will be put on the healer every time.

    Everyone else moves to Emalon. Burn to around 35-40k. Leave 2 tanks and a healer there. Should be plenty to live through the tank switches.

    Rest of the raid moves to Emalon, here is where the higher ilvl gear comes into play. 1 tank, pref a pally/.DK for aoe tanking EVERYTHING in the room. Boss and adds. Burn Emalon with a hero of course, killing adds when necessary, that's the hard part. Once you get him under 10%, the other 2 and 3 man groups should be able to kill new guy and Arch with ease alone and the raid nukes Emalon.




    Thoughts? Only an idea. I am REALLY into getting this as soon as I possibly can. Sounds EXTREMELY fun.

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    Personally i was thinking this setup and idea.

    3 tanks - 2 Pally warrior
    3 heals - two pallies, 1 priest
    4 dps - Drood and 2 hunter for sure

    Tanks in my guild are pretty well off. 50k buffed and two 48k's

    have a pally tank run in and grab emalon and all of his adds (poping cd's)

    then have the other tank get Md to the arch and have the priest pop speed buff. You then md the fire guy to a drood. Emalon will be in his side with his tank and heals, the others will be in the middle.

    Md the drood with fire and the warrior with the arch. Have warrior taunt off arch and then drood go bear when the warrior gets picked up. Have the pally be taunted off from the third tank and have the adds brought to the main dps group on top of the stairs by the Emalon engager

    When adds spawn they go up to the pally from a taunt and all the dps has to do is switch. It seems simple enough just have to have good tanks and heals

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    just as a side note a dps that has a taunt ability such as dk war or pally (druids would have to change form and would be to slow to taunt as you only have half a sec) can taunt arch right as he casts he stomp. this requires quick skill usage but the dps will be grabbed instead of the tank. also mages pallys and druid BRs will reset the koralon fire stacks to slow down the soft enrage koralon has. dk's ams will come in handy for soaking up nova and koralon's massive fire dmg.

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    Has anyone actually tried this yet? I have read over numerous dream strategies and none of them seem viable (mostly because of the engrage timers). Having finally seen the new boss this week, I can only assume there must be something about the fight I don't know yet. My immediate guess would be that something happens when you get the three opposing elements together, like a global boss debuff, or enhanced damage on each other from their respective abilities.

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    I agree Neph.
    I'm sure we can all speculate as to what the best strategy might be. But actually putting it into action is completely different.
    I haven't had the opportunity to attempt this yet; but I'm guessing this will be a different fight once all 3 bosses are together.
    3D Sarth is a much different fight than people probably expected it to be when they first went into it.

    I'm guessing (<--- "guessing" is the key word here), that the bosses might receive a debuff, or we'll gain a buff. Perhaps Emalon's minions will be destroyed somehow so you don't need to worry about overcharges.

    The best 'dream' strategy (assuming that all bosses stay how they are with their abilities) I've heard is Mangrytank's idea. Although poorly written I did my best to follow it.

    Start with Archavon: bring him down to ~100k health, stop all dps and move to Koralon; bring him down to about ~100k health, and have everyone move to Emalon; and have the OT tank Koralon, and the minions; have the remaining tank on Emalon. Burn down Emalon as fast as humanly possible keeping in mind the mechanics of the fight.
    At this point the Tank on Archavon should have him nearly dead; and should be on his way back to the Emalon fight. Same for Koralon; the tank with Koralon (and the adds) should have Koralon nearly dead as well.
    It's at this point where popping all long CDs would be essential to burn Emalon as fast as possible right after Archavon and Koralon are down.

    ^^ Is again an unattempted, untested, 'Maybe this will work' strategy. But I'm excited to give it a try.

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    I think Blood DKs will be invaluable for at least one spot. They will have the ability to stalemate a boss, which is to say, tank a boss indefinately through minimal external healing (self heals to deal with most incoming), while not doing much damage.
    On my server, people now 1 tank emalon. Same tank holds adds and emalon (so raid comp for 10 man is 1 tank, 2 healers, rest dps). I see this as being the way to go
    You might be able to 2 man archavon, using a blood DK and either a feral druid switching between cat dps while DK is out and going bear while archavon has DK grabbed. Other option is to have a ret pally with some strong sheath of light/seal of light/judgement of light capabilities. The blood DK would essentially stalemate the boss, although some healing may be needed from feral/ret (ferals getting heals + mana back through ImpLotP + extra party healing, ret healing through free FoL).
    You need 2 tanks on Koralon just to keep up the Meteor Fist, even with higher gear levels than what you normally see now. I haven't read any feedback about the usefullness of massive Fire Resist gear attempts or 4pcT8.5 warrior or talented Spell reflects, but I can see the same tanks holding Koralon pulling double duty with Archavon in 10 man, with a gamble being that you won't get too many meteor fists while a tank is grabbed.

    To me, the hardest part will still be DPS, in two ways, because based on my observations the tanking and healing are down pat and are conceivable with today's top end gear levels. One, I think average DPS will need to be in the range of 9-10k per person, and the second will be rapid raid mobility and choosing a kill order correctly. I think that by the time the world top guilds get outfitted by full 9.75 or equivaelnt, they will do the achievement, and then blizzard will water down something a few months later so the rest of the mere mortals can catch up. Nerfs will probably include reduction in Health Pools, and/or slight reduction in Koralon's damage output of his meteor fists.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Insahnity View Post
    Nerfs will probably include reduction in Health Pools, and/or slight reduction in Koralon's damage output of his meteor fists.
    Or they could just add a stacking debuff to the bosses depending on how many are in range of each other. Like -10% damage for every other boss in range.

    Having to avoid clouds, chain lightning, lightning nova, and fire patches when all 3 massive bosses + adds are in the same area is gonna suck. Does anyone know if Koralon's fire whirl thing or Emalon's nova is LoSable? That way you could fight archavon in his hall while the other 2 are out in the middle area to the sides and have dps run into the hall to avoid aoe damage.
    Last edited by Dragaan; 09-13-2009 at 11:57 AM.

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    This is going to be an interesting one, doesnt seem enough space in a 10 man raid to do it ;P
    25 man will be a lot easier.

    I would say you need to get both Koralon and Archavon down to 5-10% or something first before even engaging Emalon.
    Once they're low hp leave some tanks and healers to slowly kill them while the rest of the raid + all dps burn Emalon plus adds.
    Syncronise the kills and win.

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    Can overcharge from Emalon's adds be out-ranged? If so just leave a tank and a healer with them and basically 8-man the bosses.

    Drag Emalon down to be front of Archavon. Misdirect/sprint combo to bring Koralon to the same area and cleave them down. One tank with a few external cooldowns tanks both.

    When they die pop heroism and blow up Archavon within 60 seconds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oratory View Post
    Can overcharge from Emalon's adds be out-ranged? If so just leave a tank and a healer with them and basically 8-man the bosses.

    Drag Emalon down to be front of Archavon. Misdirect/sprint combo to bring Koralon to the same area and cleave them down. One tank with a few external cooldowns tanks both.

    When they die pop heroism and blow up Archavon within 60 seconds.
    I can say with certainty, when I see all the tanks go down and emalon starts munching the raid, I have tried to GTFO and save myself a repairbill. The overcharge is over the whole instance.

    Also, When koralon does flame breath, it is also instance wide. I went afk at the foot of the instance entrance stairs and somebody decided to pull koralon. I came back with 259/20k health Lucky for me I was a holy paladin.

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