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Thread: Dark Command(Taunt) Mechanics

  1. #1
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    Dark Command(Taunt) Mechanics

    http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread....d=144681449167

    Well I've asked in Wow-Europe.com forums before I got the answer but I'm asking in here since many experts walking around here.

    Hi fellow Death Knight players,

    I would like to learn how Taunt mechanics work, I've searched thru all the forums and web but I couldn't find enough information that I'm looking for.

    As a DK I have Dark Command as a Taunt ability, what happens if I taunt a target I'm already tanking? It says "has no effect if the target is already attacking you." but some of my friends say 'Target will attack you until the debuff wears off even if the target is already attacking to you.'

    Which one is a false information? Tooltip or this? Anyone has extended information on DC mechanics?
    Lets put few numbers on the table.

    1. Me - 100.000 Threat
    2. A Mage - 99.999 Threat

    Let's say I'm tanking a 83 Elite Raid Boss (named Gamon q and boss is attacking to me

    I cast Dark Command and put Dark Command debuff for 3 seconds on Gamon and stop generating more threat.
    Mage casts an instant cast Pyroblast within that 3 seconds and Pyorblast projectile hits Gamon for 50k damage(and threat) in 1.2th sec.

    What happens in the next 1.8 second?

    Gamon keeps attacking me till DC debuff wears off?
    Or changes its target to Mage?
    Please read the topic and first 17 posts before proceeding.

    Any kind of extra information would be greatly appreciated.

    Thank you.

  2. #2
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    As between Blizzard's Tool Tip and what a friend says, I'd believe the Tool Tip; unless the friend happens to be Ghostcrawler.

  3. #3
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    There are two taunt elements:
    1.) Fixate
    2.) Threat Parity

    Fixate means that the target will focus on you for a period of time (usually 3 sec on tank moves), and will not change targets unless someone else overwrites with another fixate. This will usually specifically have no effect if the target is already attacking you.

    The threat move on taunts works like this: your threat is matched to theirs and the you are made the active target (which means others have to pass the threat difference threshold, 10/30, in order to pull threat back).

    So, standard taunts Taunt, Hand of Vengeance, Growl, and Dark Command combine the two. So, taunting something that is on you doesn't normally have an effect (I'm 99% sure), but the debuff will show up still for the sake of diminishing returns, which is not omni-present but still sometimes significant.

    Some moves (like Hunter's Distracting Shot) only have a fixate and do not change threat.


    More fun reading:
    http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...ide-Discussion (good work by Jere)
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  4. #4
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    ^^ what they said

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satorri View Post
    ... So, taunting something that is on you doesn't normally have an effect (I'm 99% sure), but the debuff will show up still for the sake of diminishing returns, which is not omni-present but still sometimes significant. ...
    It still causes the fixate. Especially with a move like Mocking Blow, which can last up to 6 seconds, you'll be certain that in those 6 seconds, you're guaranteed aggro, after that, it's back to threat levels (in this case, the Mage will gain aggro as soon as taunt runs out due to him/her being at 50% more threat than you)
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  6. #6
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    Also, note that for example, a ranged dps pulls agro at 130% of your threat. This means that if the boss is attacking you and the ranged dps is between 100% and 130%, you will NOT get the ranged dps' threat. However if you let him rip and then taunt back you WILL get that threat.

    This used to be pretty common practice on Hodir hardmode in ulduar, where caster dps threat would be so high that you would tell them to not soulshatter etc til they rip and you taunted. If they shattered when they ripped but before you taunted, you wouldn't get the threat but if you taunt and then they shatter, you get a free 30% more threat. In most cases however, this is not a good tactic!

    Also remember that despite it saying "if the target is already attacking you it has no effect", taunting WILL still count towards the diminishing return on taunt immunity. I can't remember the exact numbers (it was changed quite recently) but its something like taunting 5 times within a minute makes the boss immune to taunt.

    Also note that moves such as Death Grip and Mocking Blow have the fixate component to them, but no actual threat changing component, so after the fixate effect wears off, the target will swap back to its original (top threat) target.

  7. #7
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    Death Grip does both fixating the enemy's attention to you for those 3 seconds and setting you on par in threat with the former aggro holder.

    Also just logged in to test it, as the English tooltip from wowhead distracted me slightly (got some pretty badly translated tooltips in the German client).

    /Edit: And it does this fancy pulling enemies around thing :>

  8. #8
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    If you are taunting bosses death grip is the first move you should always use as a DK, far before Dark Command.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgewalker View Post
    If you are taunting bosses death grip is the first move you should always use as a DK, far before Dark Command.
    Why is that?

  10. #10
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    I'm not sure of Edge's logic, but maybe because it has a longer CD, so you can start that off first?

    Personally, I don't worry about Death Grip unless Dark Command misses or I am actually trying to reposition something.
    The (Old) Book on Death Knight Tanking
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    Who f-ing divided by zero?!?

  11. #11
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    WarTotem is correct, the Fixate effect will still apply. There is a standard paladin "trick" where you taunt a boss and then Divine Shield (to clear a debuff, for example). The boss will continue to attack you for the duration of the Fixate despite the immunity. Of course, if you don't /cancelaura Divine Shield before the Fixate wears off, the boss will chase down the #2 threat target and munch on him.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satorri View Post
    I'm not sure of Edge's logic, but maybe because it has a longer CD, so you can start that off first?

    Personally, I don't worry about Death Grip unless Dark Command misses or I am actually trying to reposition something.
    DG can not "miss", it's been coded not to. It's not based on spell hit, or melee hit or any hit - it will never miss.
    Mobs can be immune to it (mostly immune to all taunt effects). It will not pull the target to you if it's snared or stunned - but it can not "miss".
    Failure is not an option. It comes bundled with the software.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andenthal View Post
    DG can not "miss", it's been coded not to. It's not based on spell hit, or melee hit or any hit - it will never miss.
    Mobs can be immune to it (mostly immune to all taunt effects). It will not pull the target to you if it's snared or stunned - but it can not "miss".
    I've missed few times with DG while tanking Horrors on LK. I always grip them as soon as they spawn. I'm 100% sure I was in range for DG to work and it fired (cause it went on cooldown), but Horror didn't focused on me at all. Had to use Dark Command and Death Coil to get him back on me. If only grip effect would miss, then I would have 3sec fixate time, but it wasn't the case.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by coe View Post
    I've missed few times with DG while tanking Horrors on LK. I always grip them as soon as they spawn. I'm 100% sure I was in range for DG to work and it fired (cause it went on cooldown), but Horror didn't focused on me at all. Had to use Dark Command and Death Coil to get him back on me. If only grip effect would miss, then I would have 3sec fixate time, but it wasn't the case.
    I was googling it and found a deleted post on the WoW forums that mentioned the same thing, but it's in the google cache still (http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us). It seems as though the problem with Shambling Horrors might be because you're taunting too soon because they're not active immediately when they spawn.

    I've never had a problem with Death Grip not taunting, but I'm not the add tank on LK.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by coe View Post
    I've missed few times with DG while tanking Horrors on LK.
    As above the Horror's aren't "active" when they are first able to be targetted. The ability didn't technically "miss", it's just that the mob was unaffected by it.
    This applies to all tanks/taunts.
    Failure is not an option. It comes bundled with the software.

  16. #16
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    Looks like bug to me (that you cannot miss with DG). I agree that horrors aren't active right away after spawn, maybe that was the case when I "missed" with DG on them. I cannot recall any other situation when my DG missed in the past.

    Anyway, good to know. There's always room for learning new things, that's what I like about this game

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