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Thread: Stam vs Agility

  1. #1
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    Stam vs Agility

    Is there a point where gemming 10 Agility + 15 Stam will become more beneficial for the armor gain? Right now, in ICC my druid fully buffed (25% Buff) has 89k Health and around 39k armor w/ my Idol at five stacks. I'd link my armory, but I prologged with Resto gear on.

    With 4pc bonus, Barkskin, Survival Instincts and Glyph'd Frenzied Regen + Double trinket use, I feel like I have enough Cooldowns to supplement a loss in health for more damage reduction period.

    Any opinions?

  2. #2
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    Heres the great thing, it's your choice. If you want to min/max go agi/stam, if not go pure stam.

  3. #3
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    I don't know bears well, so this is, tbh, and attempt to understand their abilities as well....

    Don't bear armor talents/dire bear form only affect cloth/leather armor, not agility armor? In that case you're suggesting exchanging 20 armor for 15 stamina * 1.1 (Heart of the Wild) *1.06 (Survial of the fittest) * 1.25 (Dire Bear form) so it's 21.86 sta for 20 armor?

    Add in kings and you get 24.05 sta for 24 armor.

    So that's 241 sta for 24 armor, and in the ICC buff and that's 301 HP for 24 armor.


    It doesn't seem like the trade off is anywhere near useful.
    Last edited by Loganisis; 07-20-2010 at 06:41 AM. Reason: Forgot Dire bear 1.25 stam modifeir
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  4. #4
    Ive been actually considering weither I should think like this on my paladin tank or not, I want to min/max my paladin completely, should I be using agi/stam on my red sockets? http://www.wowarmory.com/character-s...em&cn=Shieldie (yes i know im using corpse tongue coin atm, i havent been raiding for a month basically and I switch trinkets constantly. and YES i know I cant be min/max completely without finishing JC im (slowly) working on it)

    with my gear, would I actually benefit more with agi/stam gems in red sockets for bonuses? or would I stay optimal with my full stam setup

  5. #5
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    I'm by no means a druid expert, so take what I say with a grain of salt, but it's my understanding that it's not the armor gain component of agi that is so good for druids, actually a lot of it is the crit that gives them the bearfaceblockshield thingy. Agi gives a small amount of armor (2 armor per point of agi, then 11 agi ~ 1 stam worth of EHP, so +10 agi gives just under 2 stam worth of EHP, so really not that great) but also you get crit which = threat + bear block and you get some really nice dodge coefficients.

    I have no idea about the ratio of how much agi is good for how much stam though. Just that those are the benefits and it goes beyond just armor.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  6. #6
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    Ah. Is wowwiki still correct? It takes 83.33 agility for 1% crit for bears To reach 1% crit (almost), you'd need 7 +10agi/+15 sta gems.

    That's 70 agility which gives:

    70 * 1.06 (Surv of fittest) = 74.2 * 1.1 (kings) = 81.62 = 163 armor
    81.62 agi = ~1% crit for the bear version of block
    81.62 agi = 1.71% dodge before diminishing returns

    Compared to 105 stamina as the trade off.

    105 * 1.1 (heart of wild) * 1.06 (Surv Fittest) * 1.25 (Dire bear form) * 1.1 (kings) = 168.34 Sta = 1683 HP * 1.25 (ICC Buff) = 2104 HP.

    So it's essentially trading 2104 HP for slightly more than 163 armor (hitting socket bonuses), slightly more than 1% of the bear's block (hitting socket bonuses), and slightly more than 1.71% dodge before diminishing returns (and some greater threat gen because of higher crit).

    Does that look accurate?
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  7. #7
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    Looks about right, seems like stam is far as the tradeoff in gems go would be way better to me.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  8. #8
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    Here's the simple facts of the matter.

    If 10 Agility and 15 Stamina were better than 30 Stamina...
    Then... 20 Agililty is better than 30 Stamina...

    If 10 agility were better than 15 stamina, you would go for pure agility. You always benefit most by stacking the strongest stat. Why would you gem slightly better if you could gem a lot better.

    If you want to consider agility as better than stamina, then you would use pure agility cuts instead, because it is twice as "better".
    10X+15Y>30Y
    10X>15Y
    10X-15Y=Better
    20X-30Y=2*Better

    In this case however, 15 stamina is better than 10 agility, therefore you should continue to gem for 30 stamina.
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  9. #9
    i dont really understand what you were trying to say but im not sure i agree with it..

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinafoi View Post
    Here's the simple facts of the matter.

    If 10 Agility and 15 Stamina were better than 30 Stamina...
    Then... 20 Agililty is better than 30 Stamina...

    If 10 agility were better than 15 stamina, you would go for pure agility. You always benefit most by stacking the strongest stat. Why would you gem slightly better if you could gem a lot better.

    If you want to consider agility as better than stamina, then you would use pure agility cuts instead, because it is twice as "better".
    10X+15Y>30Y
    10X>15Y
    10X-15Y=Better
    20X-30Y=2*Better

    In this case however, 15 stamina is better than 10 agility, therefore you should continue to gem for 30 stamina.
    I think the arguement is more either 21stam+10agi (+6stam socket bonus) or 24stam+10agi(+9 stam socket bonus) > 30stam. I don't think the OP is talking about tossing in 10agi/15stam gems into anything regardless of socket bonus.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  11. #11
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    Druids will most likely only have 4 socket bonuses with +Stam and they will only have +6Stam bonuses. ATM I have only 2 red sockets with a +Stam bonus. The other sockets with a +Stam bonus are yellow sockets.

    So there would be a difference, but a very small one I think. Only changing, like I said, 4(at max) (more like 1 or 2 TBH because you are likely to be using the exalted Ashen Verdict ring and the Armor cloak from badges) 30 stam gems to 10Agi/15Stam with a +6Stam bonus.

    If you are doing the opposite of what Agg is thinking you are asking about (switching to 10agi/15stam in any socket, regardless of if the bonus is +Stam) then you'd see more significant changes. Whether these changes would be good or not I cannot comment on.
    Last edited by Gape; 07-20-2010 at 10:35 AM.

  12. #12
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    I should have clarified that, I know. Yes, this is for red sockets only.

  13. #13
    honestly, for the current raiding selection (RS, ICC) with such a range of damage types going from physical to magic, unless your going to build a set for a certan boss, there really isnt a point to try and min/max, because it might be as good as possible for one fight, but then next you might be doing it wrong,

    so in favour of being universalally geared, go stam, then threat, mitigation and aviodance just dont seem to cut the cake like they used to, healers are rarely on the cutting edge of being able to handle the encounter, give them somthing to do,

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