+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 20 of 20

Thread: Difficulty knowing if my Damage is on-par

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096

    Difficulty knowing if my Damage is on-par

    Hey guys,

    In addition to my Holy Paladin and my Frost DK, I have a Destruction (and Demo, but, we generally have Demo covered) Warlock. Now, to be honest, I don't find DPS particularly exciting, but, Holy Paladins aren't really in high demand on my server, and no one really wants my DK Tank. So, as it stands, my most progressed character is my Warlock.

    I'm someone who really tries to work hard at whatever they do, and so I work really hard on my DPS. Look for mistakes and try to improve upon them. Yesterday was my first night in ICC 25 in more than 4 weeks, I died once to LDW ghost adds because I wasn't looking, and you can bet that won't happen again next week.

    However, I was #1 on DPS in a lot of the fights, and in the top 5 on all of them I think. In LDW I was actually far and away #1 until I died. The person that was supposed to Brez me Brezed someone else, there was lots of confusion and it took them probably about 45 seconds to get me Brezed, and, of course, I was lacking a lot of buffs at that point and my imp (boss was low, was just better to dps) so even though I'm #2 there, in reality I was #1 for most of the fight at around 9k.

    Despite being #1 though, I feel as though my DPS output has stagnated. The ICC buff has been increasing, but my DPS in there hasn't. My gear has gone up, but my DPS hasn't. And now I'm beginning to wonder if I'm doing something wrong that's causing my DPS to not go up. I was hoping to check a spreadsheet for my projected DPS, but unfortunately most of them seem to want Excel, which I don't have at the moment.

    I was wondering if there were some alternatives for me to look at my projected DPS so I can compare it to my actual DPS. Or perhaps suggestions on things I can do differently. My priority system is being followed to the letter, so I know that isn't it. And I feel like my gear decisions and stats have been good, though there could be an issue there, who knows.

    Last Night's ICC 25
    Note: Festergut Vile Gassed me 3 times (2nd attempt), No Mutated Infections on the initial attempt, but I got one Mutated Infection on the 2nd (and successful) attempt. So I don't really have any boss fights where I stood absolutely still with no interruptions, but I can sort of subtract that difference from a projected total.

    Lalia | US | Icecrown

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    899
    Go aff. Our locks do like 14k dps with it.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    Oh, I hate affliction with a burning, raging passion. But I may have to. *sighs*

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    1,783
    Quote Originally Posted by Lulia View Post
    I was hoping to check a spreadsheet for my projected DPS, but unfortunately most of them seem to want Excel, which I don't have at the moment.
    Have you tried OpenOffice (openoffice.org)? I think it's compatible with spreadsheet macros in excel.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    That Place Above the USA
    Posts
    2,282
    I am still grappling the part of your post that says "not much demand for holy paladins". There are people on our server who swear that holy paladins are all you need for ICC, and can't get enough of them. I've even see silly people take 3 holy paladins out of the 5 healers because they love them so much. Due to the state of Disc priests (*must not rant about Grace, must not rant about Grace, must not rant about Grace, must not...*), and the disgust when many shamans or druids are asked to tank heal (they can't, but it's not optimal), it's a wonder such a state exists.

    Maybe it's like Fallout's Vault 8 Water Chip.

    Anyways, for DPS, you might try a sim program to see how much a character is capable of for a given gear set and conditions, and see how you compare that way.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    Quote Originally Posted by Bashal View Post
    Have you tried OpenOffice (openoffice.org)? I think it's compatible with spreadsheet macros in excel.
    Yeah, I've tried. It wasn't working for me. If someone else gets it working, I'll certainly try again.

    As for a sim program, Insahnity, I was hoping someone could offer me a link to one that I might use. If, indeed, I am doing the proper amount of DPS for my spec, then I may consider going Affliction, even though I hate it with a passion.

    And yes. None of the top-guilds on my server need Holy Paladins. I've checked their guild websites. Something might have changed in the past month, but I doubt it.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    2,043
    How is RAWR's DPS predictor?
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    I've no idea, currently I wouldn't know if the output was correct. So I'd have to hope someone can confirm one is fairly accurate.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    1,783
    Quote Originally Posted by Lulia View Post
    I've no idea, currently I wouldn't know if the output was correct. So I'd have to hope someone can confirm one is fairly accurate.
    The few times I've used Rawr, I found the DPS to be within the general ballpark of the DPS I crank out.

    On the other hand...I don't know if there's some guy out there who routinely does more dps than rawr says should be possible.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    Well, really, I expect more of myself. So I'd want my damage to be higher than the predictor, because I know it's possible. My problem is that, since I don't know the accuracy, even settling for the same numbers isn't really an option since I have no way of knowing if that's what I'm actually supposed to turn out for dps.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    2,043
    Unless the predictor is using a maximum based on the inputs. Sometimes you can't 'beat' the target because it's the ideal. If you're beating Landsoul's its almost certainly because your reaction time is better than average and your latency is better than what's typed in. There is a definable maximum that can be reached because it is a mathematical model. There is some point where an inflection point is reach and production starts to reach the maximum and a decreasing rate.

    I think you're looking at this the wrong way, that the predicated damage is an 'average' of which better is possible. Now it can be that the prediction model has flaws or that variables like latency/reaction time/maybe you have found a better rotation may allow you to beat the 'predicted' maximum, but I don't think assuming it's not a good predictor is valid.

    It's fine and dandy to expect more of yourself, but there is a hard mathematical limit here :-)
    An introduction into WarTanking (no longer updated as I've retired from WoW - the concepts will still be mostly accurate but the numbers no longer will be.) - http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.p...101-The-Primer

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    Quote Originally Posted by Loganisis View Post
    Unless the predictor is using a maximum based on the inputs. Sometimes you can't 'beat' the target because it's the ideal. If you're beating Landsoul's its almost certainly because your reaction time is better than average and your latency is better than what's typed in. There is a definable maximum that can be reached because it is a mathematical model. There is some point where an inflection point is reach and production starts to reach the maximum and a decreasing rate.

    I think you're looking at this the wrong way, that the predicated damage is an 'average' of which better is possible. Now it can be that the prediction model has flaws or that variables like latency/reaction time/maybe you have found a better rotation may allow you to beat the 'predicted' maximum, but I don't think assuming it's not a good predictor is valid.

    It's fine and dandy to expect more of yourself, but there is a hard mathematical limit here :-)
    Well, that's fine. Just looking for someone to confirm whether or not there's a non-spreadsheet sim with accurate numbers then :P

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    By the way, I did anywhere from 500-1000 less DPS in Affliction than Destro. Admittedly I could use some more practice with Afflic, but I was only counting the attempts where I hit the priority fairly spot-on. I didn't use CoE with the Destro spec for balance purposes.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    9
    If you want to stay as destro you want to change that LT glyph to a Incinerate glyph because as destro you would gain more from it. Other than that actually changing to either demo or aff will provide better dps on most fights in ICC.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Blood Glutch Outpost #1
    Posts
    159
    Quote Originally Posted by gacktt View Post
    Go aff. Our locks do like 14k dps with it.
    To be honest, I play affliction and it is one of the easiest specs for a warlock to play IMO. The cooldowns and stuff run really well into each other and as long as you have a "Dot timer" (or power auras for that matter) tracking your stuff is rather easy.

    I honestly find destro to be the most boring of the warlock specs and I hardly ever play it. That being said, your haste is pretty low and you should try to get that up more. You can also grab some socket bonuses without feeling like you are gimping your dps. Red = Runed Cardinal Ruby Yellow = 12sp/10 haste (name is eluding me) and blue obviously 12sp/10spirit.

    Your spec looks good and you are over hit cap, a general rule of thumb you might want to look at (1% Heroic Presence, 3% boomkin, + hit talents only if you need them) you can drop your hit quite a bit seeing as your raid has everything you need, just ask to be put in the Dreanies group. Also, when I was FT on my Affi warlock I tried to weasel all the buffs I could, I'd pop Potions of wild magic off the pull NMIC (get my crit good and high) and have a rogue Tricks me for the extra damage from the buff. It makes your dps skyrocket, if you have other MD's in the raid I'd say its a safe option.

    As per your rotation, it seems like you have it down, using COA when the boss is almost dead and Corr while moving it seems keeps your dps high. But if you really are looking to increase your dps, try switching to affliction (even if you don't like it) the numbers don't lie and it is the best dps output right now.

    By the way, I did anywhere from 500-1000 less DPS in Affliction than Destro. Admittedly I could use some more practice with Afflic, but I was only counting the attempts where I hit the priority fairly spot-on. I didn't use CoE with the Destro spec for balance purposes.
    If you don't have it already get Never Melting Ice Crystal from Pit of Saron, it really helps with crit rolling also pop your potions of Wild magic at the start of a boss pull and MAKE SURE that corruption doesn't fall off. The way I deal with that is always have the boss in my focus and use macros for /cast [target=focus] shadow bolt/haunt whichever will get to the boss faster. You don't want to let your shadow embrace fall off, that is a very good debuff to add to the boss. Affliction will take some time to get used to and obviously practice makes perfect. Affliction relays heavily on Haste, the more haste you have the faster your corr ticks the faster you cast spells. Just watch out though, I've found when you get a lot of haste your corruption tends to fall off early so you want to make sure you are refreshing it before it reaches 4seconds.
    Last edited by PvtCaboose; 06-22-2010 at 11:31 AM.
    Caboose: My dad always said "Why buy the cow? When you can get the milk for free."
    Church: Rookie did you just call my girl friend a slut?
    Tucker: I think he just called her a cow.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    2,067
    download the free version 60 day trial of excel and just re-download another one after that one expires. i've been doing that for months now with landsoul's spreadsheet....
    -Jimmy

    |Ex Tank|

    TWITCH.TV STREAM


  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    16,409
    Destruyen: in your internetz, pirating your warez.

    READ THIS: Posting & Chat Rules
    Quote Originally Posted by Turelliax View Post
    I will never be a kaz.. no one can reach the utter awesomeness of you.
    http://i.imgur.com/3vbQi.gif

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Philadelphia
    Posts
    146
    Quote Originally Posted by Lulia View Post
    Yeah, I've tried. It wasn't working for me. If someone else gets it working, I'll certainly try again.

    As for a sim program, Insahnity, I was hoping someone could offer me a link to one that I might use. If, indeed, I am doing the proper amount of DPS for my spec, then I may consider going Affliction, even though I hate it with a passion.

    And yes. None of the top-guilds on my server need Holy Paladins. I've checked their guild websites. Something might have changed in the past month, but I doubt it.
    Transfer to my server, I'll take you!
    Vuhdo 101: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBoImKCY1Fs Vuhdo 102: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEbM0XG7XsU http://www.twitter.com/soragrey

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    3,096
    Quote Originally Posted by EressŽa View Post
    Transfer to my server, I'll take you!
    :P

    I do seriously need to do something. The guild I'm in is in a rut of nothing...

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Blood Glutch Outpost #1
    Posts
    159
    If you hate affi so much you can always try demo (one of my favorite specs). Not only can you do good dps but you have an awesome buff to all the casters in the raid and they'll love you for it. Also, who doesn't love seeing 32k crits?

    If you haven't played it here is a quick run down. Keeping up immolate and corruption is MAJORLY important. After that if there is not SP/boomkin making sure you have COE up is better then putting up COD but if you do, COD is a dps increase for you. Shadowbolt is your filler spell which isn't that bad, once Molten Core procs however, throw up 3x incenerates and go back to Shadow Bolt. @ 35% you will get a decimation buff which makes your Soul Fires cast shorter and this is your new "Filler Spell" always keeping up immolate and corruption obviously because corruption procs Molten core and Soul Fire gets a buff from that as well and immolate helps proc our 4pc.

    http://www.wowhead.com/talent#IZbhchkAbihsgdAoE00VnN

    You can fool around with the major glyphs, incenerate and life tap but those are the ones I found that I do the most dps with those there. There is also this sweet macro that pops all you cds all together on every cd it is:
    showtooltip Shadow Bolt
    /console Sound_EnableSFX 0
    /petattack
    /use 13
    /use 14
    /cast [pet:Felguard] [pet:imp] Demonic Empowerment
    /cast Metamorphosis
    /script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()
    /console Sound_EnableSFX 1
    /cast Shadow Bolt

    You can change shadow bolt to Soul fire as well.
    Caboose: My dad always said "Why buy the cow? When you can get the milk for free."
    Church: Rookie did you just call my girl friend a slut?
    Tucker: I think he just called her a cow.

+ Reply to Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts