Time to finally fix my talents
I've procrastinated long enough on this. Now that I'm starting to get into ICC 10 (Festergut hits like a truck), these talents should get fixed. My biggest concern seems to be even with all the talents I have to reduce costs, grant more mana, etc., I still manage to run myself out of mana and dumping those talents are likely to make it worse. Is this something to be concerned about or should I just suck it up and find out where I hotkeyed my mana potions to?
Huh. I thought they used to have it so you can see my armory somehow, but I'm not seeing a link. I'm too tired to load up armory, so my character is Lucen on Feathermoon.
First of all, you shouldn't be needing any mana cost reduction talents, the int talent or even 2/2 SA - 1/2 is generally enough.
Especially in the case of ICC 10 bosses, the amount of damage you take should get you a lot of mana back from the heals on you.
I would look at the following things :
1) what judgement are you using? - i find that judgement of wisdom works best if you don't have another pally in your group
2) is divine plea kept up? (shouldnt be a problem during boss fight unless you didnt activate it at all)
3) are you using BoSanc?
I would also take points out of the intellect buff in holy tree and put it into toughness - your giving up 6% increase to your armor value which helps with all incoming physical damage for some mana points - that's really wrong
Other thing is would be your rotation - given that you don't have a point in the improved judgements talents in the ret tree suggests that you aren't using the 9-6-9 rotation - so if you're spamming consecrate a lot, it would explain why your mana drains really quickly - single boss fight especially where you dont have to hold aoe aggro, it would be preferable to use either holy shield or judgement over consecrate
ardent defender should be 3/3 - aside from the leap frogging - an extra 7% dmg reduction when at low hp is nothing to sneeze at
anyways to sum up:
I would look at the 3 points listed above as well as your consecration usage
That's probably a good summation of talents I'm missing. I'll need to take a closer look as to what to give up.
As for rotation, I generally just use whatever's off cooldown. If consecrate is all that's left, that's what I use. I never thought about missing a point in improved judgements as being a potential reason for running out of mana.
Running out of mana generally happens only in heroics, although sometimes it occurs when the other tank in a raid is the one with aggro on everything and I'm saving divine plea. Let me give one example where I often run out of mana. Heroic VH. Caster mobs where I can't block, dodge, or parry. Divine plea will almost always run out before the next group spawns (I also like to loot my kills, so that often causes Divine Plea to fall as well). And since I'm waiting for the mob to appear, the best way to snag initial aggro is consecrate.
VH is one of the hardest places for pally mana. Here is the method I use there now for no problems.
Originally Posted by Lucen
Memorize which portals are four mobs and which are one or two. Only use Divine Plea on the four mob portals. This allows you to use consecrate in your normal rotation and hold them easier. On the two mob portals, make sure you are using Judgement of Wisdom and do not consecrate. If you watch Omen, you will see that you really do not need to cons on these ones to maintain a healthy threat lead in most situations. Also, you should only have 5 or 6k mana. Get the water that replenishes 19k and you can top off easily while waiting for the mobs to actually come out of the portal if you get behind on mana.
That is the ONLY place that I save Divine Plea. DP is refreshed when you hit a mob so even if you are off tanking, you can keep it going. If mana becomes an issue while off tanking, make sure you use Judgement of Wisdom and drop consecration from you rotation.
Your statement that you just use conscecrate if it is the only thing off cd make me think you don't understand the 969 rotation. Please google this as it is fundamental to paladin tanking.
the spec i would suggest is
if that link does not work look up Astoria on Azgalor
i have tried many specs and so far that one works best for me.
the healer u have in the instance depends on your mana regen if you run VH with a priest thats always bubbling you u wont get back mana.
for most heroics i dont use conscecrate. i have the glyph of hammer of the righteous ( makes your HoR hit one more target)
so for grabbing agro on the 4 mob pacs in VH i use Avengers Shield, then target the one it dident hit and use HoR and i never have issues.
I also noticed you have alot of defence you might want to switch some gems but that is just a suggestion.
also seal of command is very very good for trash or for 5 mans. AVS + HoR + SoC = amazing tps for trash or 5 mans.
if you have any spicific questions let me know
I'm already on a site dedicated to tanking. Why would I bother using Google? I guess maximizing threat didn't seem like a priority until recently. I started tanking at 70 in BC where the rules were stay alive and if the dps pulls aggro, it's their fault. If I'm understanding it right, there will be a time when judgement, holy shield, hammer of the righteous, and shield of righteousness will all be on cooldown anyway. And while I'm sure it's the best method when tanking a boss, how is it when tanking groups? You'll often have people attacking the wrong target and aoeing. When handling a group, I'll try to group them as close as possible and frontload as much threat on as many targets as possible.
I'll take a look at the spec that's posted. As for defense, I've been wondering if I should bother socketing yellow sockets for socket bonuses anymore. I think I stuck an enduring gem in my last one on the advice of another tank who has probably progressed a lot further than I have. Well, it's a bit off the original topic, but since it pertains to defense and someone asked if I had specific questions, I'm also wondering if I should switch trinkets, especially for Festergut. The first time, I didn't seem to have any trouble, but the second week I had to start off with the boss so the other tank would have him when all the blight got inhaled. The change in talents will be a start I'm sure, but it doesn't seem like I have much to use to keep myself alive. I've been activating my trinket and reactivating Divine Plea for extra dodge, then putting up Sacred Shield and hoping for the best...