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Thread: [Video]: HC HoR - Warrior strategy & tips

  1. #1
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    [Video]: HC HoR - Warrior strategy & tips

    Video recorded from Heroic Halls of Reflection. With comments and tips for warriors tanks, as well as a strategy (fighting at the Altar).

    I forgot to turn on recording for the first part of the waves, so only Wave 6 through 10, as well as the escape are recorded. I might make an additional video later.

    Vid is 8 min long total. HD Quality will be coming online when YouTube's processing system gets a move on, probably sometime in the next century or so. Until then, the quality will be a little lower. Enjoy.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvP7ABQwrw0&hd=1

    Edit: HD Quality is finally online.
    Last edited by Athinira; 03-28-2010 at 09:35 AM.

  2. #2
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    Kind of weird, I thought the accepted strat was just to use the small off-shoot to the room and just get everyone to LoS the pull. It makes it alot easier.
    The best way out is always through!
    Eraser - Ragnarok - 10 Man Strict - Gundrak Server

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eraser View Post
    Kind of weird, I thought the accepted strat was just to use the small off-shoot to the room and just get everyone to LoS the pull. It makes it alot easier.
    In my opinion, it's a terrible tactic, especially if the group is undergeared. First of all, it should be mentioned that before my prot warrior in the video hit 80, i tanked the instance on my Feral Druid, as well as i healed the instance on my Druid with all tank classes. I've tried all tactics, and i initially also started out with the hiding tactic, but found it has some problems:

    1) First, if the healer (and the rest of the group) has to LoS the mobs, and if the tank has to go out and pick up a mob, then he will also be LoS'ing the healer. I've seen quite a few tanks do that on me and die because i couldn't get into LoS and heal them fast enough when the huntermob has dropped a Frost Trap right where the group is. I've also died myself a few times charging out.

    2) When you are gathering all the mobs up like that, the group is going to take more AOE damage from the priests Circle of Destruction and the mages Flamestrikes.

    3) If you don't have a persistent AOE (Consecration or Death of Decay), there is always going to be a chance that the mobs pass by you before you can hit them and gib someone (most likely the healer)

    5) Makes CC impractical if you decide to use it

    5) Finally and most importantly: When you are gathering up all the mobs, you will be taking more damage as a tank. This is especially a problem when the tank and healer is undergeared. If you use the tactic above (or the tactic where you stand at the front door), then you can Charge, Intercept, Intervene or Feral Charge around, and therefore make the melee mobs chase you, giving your healer breathing room.

    I have another video on Youtube where i tanked the instance using the front door tactic. This was part of a bet where i had to lower my gearlevel to 4k Gearscore (unequipped both rings and one trinket) and not use Intercept, Intervene or Heroic Throw on my warrior, as well as no CC. Tanking the instance in the Alcove would probably have been impossible with those restrictions. You can watch the video here: HC HoR Doorway Strategy - 4k GS prot war


    My suggestion is to stay away from the Alcove tactic if you play a Druid or a Warrior, and only use it as DK/Paladin. I found that using the Doorway strat works best as a druid, and Altar tac works best as a war.
    Last edited by Athinira; 03-28-2010 at 10:34 AM. Reason: Formating

  4. #4
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    I'm a warrior and I've always used the alcove tactic and found that I've had no problems. I'm not sure whether this is a case of what is the best strat, or more the case pick the strat that you feel more comfortable with. Anyway, appreciate the effort and I'm sure someone will be helped by the video in any case.
    The best way out is always through!
    Eraser - Ragnarok - 10 Man Strict - Gundrak Server

  5. #5
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    When I tank H HoR, I tell my group to stand just inside the doorway, so that they aren't locked out. I then can use all those fun tools that warriors have to zip all over the room, picking up mobs.

    People tend to be surprised when I say no alcove, really no alcove, GET OUT OF THE DAMN ALCOVE, but when they see how a warrior operates everyone has liked how smooth the run goes.

    Come to think of it, the only time I have wiped when tanking was when I tried to use the alcove method. AoE damage and healer LoS issues wiped us out.

    Del.

  6. #6
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    I've gone by the doorway strat from the start, the alcove is way too confining for my taste. Warriors are made to move, not to stand still! On the other hand, I prefer the mobs to converge to cleave/thunderclap range before they actually reach the healer. What's the advantage of Altar over Doorway? That trigger-happy DPS can start earlier without making it too much of a pain to get the mobs back?

    On another note, you've got yourself quite an extraordinary UI there. Would you mind revealing some of its secrets, such as this cooldown slider at the bottom of the viewport?

  7. #7
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    Yeah, very interesting UI.

    I believe the cooldown bar is either Coolline or Forte Xorcist. But the OP can confirm.
    "A man can learn twice as much from milking a cat as two men can from a very tall fourth man.
    - Mark "Alec Baldwin" Twain

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Khordam View Post
    On another note, you've got yourself quite an extraordinary UI there. Would you mind revealing some of its secrets, such as this cooldown slider at the bottom of the viewport?
    Sure, here are all the addons:
    Combatlog at the top left is EavesDrop
    Omen Threat meter below it.
    Bartender4 with ButtonFacade for the potion bars
    Viewport is Sunn Viewport
    Cooldown Slider is ForteXorcist
    Nameplates is TidyPlates with the addon Tideplates Threatplates
    Cooldownbuttons, procs etc. in the middle is PowerAuras

    UnitFrames are Pitbull3
    Recount
    Party/Raidframes are VuhDo (i play a druid as a main, so using VuhDo for healing)
    Buffs are Elkano Buff Bars
    Minimap is SexyMap
    The ring that appears when i mark mobs is OPie
    And then a few misc mods, like CT_Core (from CTmod.net), DeadlyBossMods, AtlasLoot, Baggins (bags) and FuBar.

    Bolded the more important ones.

    What's the advantage of Altar over Doorway?
    The mobs gather more quickly, and that you always know where the healer is (i ask the healer to jump up on the altar). It makes picking up the adds much easier than at door.

    I prefer the door when tanking on my druid though. Just make sure the healer is behind you and you can pick up everything with Swipe. Much harder as a warrior since TC isn't spamable.
    Last edited by Athinira; 03-28-2010 at 02:24 PM.

  9. #9
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    Thanks, for both the listing and the clarification! I'll try it next time I get it on my random trip... can't be too long, it feels like I get either HoR, Nexus or Ahn'kahet eight out of ten times.

  10. #10
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    I've tried it from all different locations, behind the alcoves, simply have ranged in the alcove, at the front door, at the back door, in the middle of the room, all work pretty well for me

  11. #11
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    <3 doorway.

    Charge the mob that appears closest to the door (as he breaks the plane from the main room to the doorway alcove), then use your taunt and thunderclap to pick up the next couple of mobs (it's cake if your timing is good). If the straggler mob is the mage, heroic throw it over to you, if it's the hunter what you can do is just drag all the mobs over to him, sit on top of the hunter and spam your aoe abilities.

    Just make sure the priest always dies first, followed by the rogue, then preferably the ranged. The priest is the worst due to the combination of healing, fear, and knockback stun. The rogue goes next for the healing reduction poison and the ability to stun you at bad times and shadowstep over to the healer.

    When I tried the left or right alcove los method the healer died due to lack of rage (no charging for me!). That tactic seems to be for pallies and dks who can drop consecrate/dnd and bears who can swipe spam.

    If mobs get past you and onto the healer, there are a number of things a war can do to save his butt. They are shockwave, challenging shout, and intervene in order of utility.

    When I tried middle of the room tanking I had some rage issues (can't charge, it'll drag me away from the healer!) and if I got both ranged they would immediately open up on the healer.

    Offhand I'd say the biggest advantage the doorway gives you is time. You get an extra second or two to see what mobs spawned and pick them up before they kill the party.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Athinira View Post
    Video recorded from Heroic Halls of Reflection. With comments and tips for warriors tanks, as well as a strategy (fighting at the Altar).
    Saw your post on the wow forums, thanks again for posting it here too. Great stuff.

    Need to make a campaign out of this to get everyone who pugs H HoR to use this strat w/ Warrior tanks. No more hiding in the alcove like a bunch of feeble cowards!!! LOK'TAR OGAR!
    Last edited by Kurtosis; 03-28-2010 at 07:43 PM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Delmonico View Post
    When I tank H HoR, I tell my group to stand just inside the doorway, so that they aren't locked out. I then can use all those fun tools that warriors have to zip all over the room, picking up mobs.

    People tend to be surprised when I say no alcove, really no alcove, GET OUT OF THE DAMN ALCOVE, but when they see how a warrior operates everyone has liked how smooth the run goes.

    Come to think of it, the only time I have wiped when tanking was when I tried to use the alcove method. AoE damage and healer LoS issues wiped us out.
    Same. At the start of HoR I ask everyone to come over to the Lich King's doorway, b/c it's "too hard to use Charge/Intercept/Intervene in the corner". So far that's been acceptable to everyone, and I've only wiped once when a dps didn't get message and stayed in the alcove anyway.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsize View Post
    When I tried middle of the room tanking I had some rage issues (can't charge, it'll drag me away from the healer!) and if I got both ranged they would immediately open up on the healer.
    That's why OP says to start each wave standing at a mob, as soon as you can Shield Slam/Devastate/Mocking Blow/whatever threat move is available, then immediately Intervene the healer so the ranged mobs don't kill him. Only then do you use Charge, Intercept, Heroic Throw to round up the rest of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsize View Post
    Offhand I'd say the biggest advantage the doorway gives you is time. You get an extra second or two to see what mobs spawned and pick them up before they kill the party.
    I do like that too, but I don't think it's significantly more time than OP's strat. The two (sometimes three) mobs that spawn on your side of the room are actually closer, and you have less time to deal with them.

    I hate it when the neither the priest, rogue, or mage are part of that group, and it's footman/hunter or footman/footman. I've gotta swivel the camera trying to see what's coming from across the room and marking the priest, while simultaneously grabbing the two mobs on this side. If anything goes wrong during this fight, that's when it happens.

  15. #15
    One thing H HoR has shown me is exactly what people mean when they say the other three tanks just hold aggro and take the beating, while a Prot Warrior actually has the tools to do something about it, and is hence so much more fun.

    Charge, Intercept, Intervene, Heroic Throw, Disarm, Shield Reflect, Shield Bash, Shockwave, Concussion Blow, Demo Shout, TC debuff, Challenging Shout... I actually enjoy H HoR on my war, it's a chore on my DK.

  16. #16
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    I feel the same way. I get to use my arsenal in H HoR unlike every other instance.

    A warrior can tank from any position in the room. The other tanking classes simply can't, at least not as well.
    "A man can learn twice as much from milking a cat as two men can from a very tall fourth man.
    - Mark "Alec Baldwin" Twain

  17. #17
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    The alcove is the worst spot to tank it, and really just caters to idiots who are like OMG OMG IM BEING ATTACKED LET ME RUN AROUND LIKE AN EVEN BIGGER RETARD. The biggest problem is the "o look a mob which interupts casters, lets drag it right on top of the casters". Granted I never ran that place without a DK on my warrior which made it 1000x easier because you only needed to use heroic throw in an emergency and it was no big deal on waves it was still down. But on my druid I still refuse to tank in the alcove for the above reason. I agree with going just far enough into the room you do not get locked out and standing there. Makes things so much easier.



  18. #18
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    I don't think that's quite fair Darksend, but then I'm not sure that "tank in alcove" means the same thing to everyone:
    - Some people think "tank in alcove" means "everyone jammed right in the corner, tank using whatever AOE they have to agro everything". This I can see is terrible technique.
    - Some people use the LOS block at the edge of the alcove as a means to draw the spawning mobs to one side of the room, but then take the fight out onto the steps. This is the way I've always done it and don't see any problem with suggesting it as an approach.

    However you choose to do it, you need to handle the fact that there are 2 possible spawns that will hang back at range: the mage and the hunter. If you don't handle them, they will drift very quickly to attacking your healer and shortly afterwards you'll be eating floor. Darksend used a DK to grip one in, that's a good example of using the capabilities of the GROUP rather than expecting the tank to do everything. Other alternatives like shackle, freezing arrow, repentance or turn undead might also be worth considering. The vid in the OP seems to rely entirely on the tank doing everything, and doing it in the centre of the room. That positioning seems to make the job harder to me, but if you can make it work that's great.

  19. #19
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    Almost every time I ran that it was with my warrior a DK from my guild, and an enh shaman from my guild. We would always get a pug healer, the pug DPS would go run off into the corner and hide and scratch his head when we did not go also, and usually leave the group. The healer on the other hand, EVERY SINGLE HEALER we ran with said "thank god I hate tanking it in the corner stupid LOS and aoe." The instance actually goes faster if you CC and single target everything, and needing to be out of LOS means you cannot CC, and also means you as the tank are out of LOS of your healer, which I am sure they do not like.

    Harder = funner, I would much rather do the way in the video because it is 100x more enjoyable and in the end probably faster.

    Also when I was running this on my rogue I convinced every single tank I ran with to tank it in the middle. The way you do that is you see what is spawning where, the entire group moves over to where a hunter is going to spawn, that way the tank can grab it right away and does not have to worry about moving it, and burn it down right away while the other dps mobs are running in. When the melee get there just pop an aoe and get them both at the same time. I as the rogue would tricks the tank and stand next to the mage in stealth and garrote it than kick it than kidney it and it would reach him around the same time as the other mobs are dieing. If there was no mage I would use cheap shop/kidney into a dismantle with a tricks on mercenaries.

    The alcove all-around means more healing needed and more damage needed. Play as a dam group and remember that heroics DO NOT MEAN SPAM AOE NON-STOP like it if the only ability you know and that place is a joke.



  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arikak View Post
    I feel the same way. I get to use my arsenal in H HoR unlike every other instance.

    A warrior can tank from any position in the room. The other tanking classes simply can't, at least not as well.
    This is simply untrue. I have tanked it with my DK, Paladin and Warrior and though IMO the warrior is the most fun to tank HoR with, your statement is flat out false as ive tanked that instance from "any position in the room" with my other 2 tanks with no issues whatsoever.

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