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Thread: Agroo / tallents / play style -Paladin

  1. #1
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    Agroo / tallents / play style -Paladin

    Hello , im looking for help , i have some raiding xp , but im mainly looking for help on my paladin , the probelms im have are Enc's /Gems / tallents agroo is ok but i have trouble on things like the 3rd boss in ToC 10/25man with the Fraction bosses , agroo here is a big problem , i cant hold them for very long i use my stun as soon as its of Cd wings and taunt i use all my spells but i still have trouble is there any advice that could stop this problem and help me on my way

    Rightofway -http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bloodhoof&cn=Rightofway

    Befor people add about my proff's , they are there for a reason , i picked dwarf as they looked cooler and for stoneform ,my lifeblood (i call it flower power) has come in very handy even i raids such as naxx/uld/toc and even the frist 3 bosses in Icc , my othe proff is a good way to make money and at the time i never had or could find people with this so i give him that , Flasks last long and i get endless manna/health pots if need be . I also got all 3 secondary proffs up including cooking/fishing/frist aid i got bored and i wanted the flip coin so i got fishing up ,cooking well my frist character and my last to have it i maxxed it out as everyone wants free fishhys :P

    i gemed all stam as i was told to by 5 other tanks , i havent got the gold 2 re gem so untill i get new gear we see what happens also i have been looking for a new shield (they just dont drop) the sheild form Toc 10man normal droped but i lost the roll by 3 points , im going for the one from Icc 10man battleship/gunship boss


    Is there anyone that can help me

    Once apon a time there live a Dwarf Called Rightofway , he was very clear what he wanted to do in life and that was to have fun :P

  2. #2
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    There are countless posts on the subject. Please use the searchbox on the top right of your screen.

    True Knowledge exists in knowing that you know nothing.
    Agg's tanking guide

  3. #3
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    First : When it comes to faction bosses....your tps is not an issue, there generally isn't an aggro table.....so you aren't losing aggro because you are doing something wrong

    Second : Spec wise, you are set up pretty decently - but i would suggest reading up on the 9-6-9 rotation and respec slightly

    Third : Get rid of the Divinity Glyph - get the vengeance glyph instead - this brings your expertise up by 10 which also helps with threat

    Fourth : I'm not a big fan of Stamina stacking - i prefer a more balanced approach of def/sta, dodge/sta and parry/sta > hit/exp/sta > pure stamina - that's jsut me though

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by xenogriff View Post
    First : When it comes to faction bosses....your tps is not an issue, there generally isn't an aggro table.....so you aren't losing aggro because you are doing something wrong

    Second : Spec wise, you are set up pretty decently - but i would suggest reading up on the 9-6-9 rotation and respec slightly

    Third : Get rid of the Divinity Glyph - get the vengeance glyph instead - this brings your expertise up by 10 which also helps with threat

    Fourth : I'm not a big fan of Stamina stacking - i prefer a more balanced approach of def/sta, dodge/sta and parry/sta > hit/exp/sta > pure stamina - that's jsut me though
    Parry expertise and hit should not be gemmed.

    True Knowledge exists in knowing that you know nothing.
    Agg's tanking guide

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by xenogriff View Post
    Fourth : I'm not a big fan of Stamina stacking - i prefer a more balanced approach of def/sta, dodge/sta and parry/sta > hit/exp/sta > pure stamina - that's jsut me though
    The other points were good, but you wrecked it there. If you're going to make statements like that, quantify them with the kind of content you are successful on. There are some truly hard hitting bosses in the game right now that require stamina stacking, even if you aren't doing them right now. It is better to prepare people for everything by pointing out what you should do for the harder things rather than setting them up for failure (or at least re-gemming/enchanting) on encounters they may face in the future.

    Always stack stamina unless you don't plan to raid things that are difficult for your gear level, never wear avoidance trinkets (outside of the gunship battle).

  6. #6
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    sorry, i'm strictly 10 man - up to festergut at the moment - my guild is fairly casual in terms of raiding so was jsut commenting based on what works for me.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by xenogriff View Post
    sorry, i'm strictly 10 man - up to festergut at the moment - my guild is fairly casual in terms of raiding so was jsut commenting based on what works for me.
    Getting some nonblue gems for decent socket bonuses is part of smart stam stacking (as opposed to blind stam stacking and dumping blues in everything.) Putting nonblue gems into your gear for other reasons is suboptimal - stam will get you further.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kahmal
    ...there is no true progression for a casual anymore, just hand outs.

  8. #8
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    actually, my point about stam stacking is this - currently when i play my healer i'm seeing a lot of tanks that just dump +sta gems into every slot - so you get tanks that are 40 - 45k hp but get hit so much due to low avoidance that the hp doesnt matter in the end

    this is most likely due to the fact that everyone seems to be focusing on sta only for tanking that the other tanking stats seem to be ignored - this might not be true so much for raid tanks but you get this a lot in heroics.

    however, if new tanks go into heroics thinking like this, who is to say that they won't change this thinking once they hit a raid environment?

    regarding the gemming of hit/exp+ sta gems - i rate them slightly higher than pure stamina due to them helping with TPS - since these gems usually go into a yellow slot anyway - it should not clash with stamina in a blue slot. obviously, gemming these are only to maintain the minimum caps for hit and exp - given my access to drops, i'm not seeing a lot of hit or expertise most times.

    again, these are just my thoughts - they might or might not be correct - but i'm just going with what has worked for me up to my current progression
    Last edited by xenogriff; 03-29-2010 at 08:55 PM.

  9. #9
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    Strange observation, Xenogriff.

    I run around in ICC with about 35% avoidance. The only comment I've gotten by my healers is that I'm easy to keep up. Now, it's true that it'd be hard to find a good comparison due to my gear level, but still.

    Once you get into endgame, the difference of gems isn't huge anymore, but I still think that my ~815 stamina from gems is worth more then the 482 defense/dodge/parry I would get for gemming otherwise. I mean, that's less then 10% avoidance(17% effective avoidance in ICC) versus 8150 health. (Which would total around 16% of my health pool.)
    Simple fact is, a large health pool will save your life. More avoidance may save your life. There will be times when that boss hits you twice in a row - avoidance only makes it less likely to occur, health makes you live through both blows. If you want damage reduction, going for armor is a far better choice then going for avoidance.
    Last edited by Martie; 03-29-2010 at 09:07 PM. Reason: Forgot to include an armory link.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kahmal
    ...there is no true progression for a casual anymore, just hand outs.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by xenogriff View Post
    actually, my point about stam stacking is this - currently when i play my healer i'm seeing a lot of tanks that just dump +sta gems into every slot - so you get tanks that are 40 - 45k hp but get hit so much due to low avoidance that the hp doesnt matter in the end

    this is most likely due to the fact that everyone seems to be focusing on sta only for tanking that the other tanking stats seem to be ignored - this might not be true so much for raid tanks but you get this a lot in heroics.
    If you see a lot of tanks stacking stamina, then you see a lot of tanks gearing correctly. ESPECIALLY for raids. And nobody with enough gear to have 45k hp in a heroic is going to be taking crap for damage unless they are rounding up 30 mobs and ass tanking them (I've seen it).

    People seem to forget, but there was a time when people were tanking the vast majority of 80 heroics wearing blues and 24k hp/30% avoidance, and healers with 1800 spell power and 20k mana were keeping them alive just fine. Stacking stam does NOT equal harder to heal. Bad play equals harder to heal.

  11. #11
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    I have look at the options ,

    I have been raiding with my gear which is improving , with the guild and team up guild's i have been told in raids (including healers ) agree for what i have done is wrong but they also said , that for what i gemed and geared i take less damge than a more gear tank and im also easy 2 keep up about 90% health just remeber paladins have holy shield which is a massive bouns and when my libram procts ( working on getting the frost one ) my doudge is around 71% and im also a herbalsit so i get lifeblood/lifebloom :P o , and dwarf = stone form these little help a lot i have read what you have all said ? i have no problem going for the bosses but its guild progress as they have only downed 8 boss 10man and i have dowend 6 with our group 2. my agroo is fine as i have been told by many groups/members in icc raid /other raids ect... im not planning on re gemming as of yet as im more than happy with ti as i will only throw it out and get new gear to spend my gold on ... i did change the to vengences glyp tyvm helps :P i guess :P

    Saying there is a hit cap make me a little mad as there is no such thing and i have also been told having 2 much def is wrong these capps are set but having more does not matter but having below may cause things such as wipes ect..

    i see a lot of tanks with 18+stam on the sheild , i always go for the titaium platting and gemming all stam make the healers able 2 keep me up ( as in you get a noob healer time his/her cd at the wrong point ect..) we are getting to the end of wow waiting for the new game go live and more and more people are gear ( or doing some they will need in the up comming game ) if it be gold ect..

    i hope i show other my way of playing it works for me to a point (The wall ) every guild has one where going and wipping not as we want to or its any one falut but seen if there is an easyier way to do things my guild has acouple vidoes on youtube e.g the Professor incounter in icc10man raid as we tryed a different way to do things and what you know it worked , if any one has time check out it out

    http://www.youtube.com/user/Myssham#p/a/u/2/XCk2A0UzhEY

    thank you so much for all the replays added to this tread
    Once apon a time there live a Dwarf Called Rightofway , he was very clear what he wanted to do in life and that was to have fun :P

  12. #12
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    You're welcome, but I think you may not have understood at least part of what I said, judging by your current armory.
    Shoulder enchant: Not EH. Why?
    Chest gem/enchant: Agi/stam >> parry/stam, 275 hp > 10 stats for EH.
    Glove enchant: WHY?
    Boot enchant: You have a talent that can give you twice the run speed increase and allow the use of a higher EH enchant. Why not utilize?
    Wep enchant: What do you think this is doing for you?
    Talents/Glyphs (not discussed in this thread, but you need to know): More than 1/2 SA is bad, Benediction is bad (other than a 1 pt filler), tanks spec fully into Vindication, PoJ is amazing, and Crusade >> Conviction, and HotR glyph is useless for bosses (salv or RD glyphs are much more useful).

    Good luck.

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