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Thread: Prot. advice needed

  1. #1

    Prot. advice needed

    I just recently hit over 450 def. and have been running a prot. spec. w/heavy prot., HS and Deflection in Arms and Armored to the teeth. This was working pretty well for me except for w/ casters pulling mad DPS w/AOE but I could taunt reasonably well. The problem that was pointed out to me was that I was maxing out on rage. As in 80-100% all the time in Heroics. I was told I could blow more rage and increase crits with DeepWounds, so I tried the new spec.

    Now holding Rage is a real struggle for me, even after adjusting the build to give me some AP and Rage back. I'm losing threat like mad and am wondering at this point if its just my gear holding me back with this build. Anyone got any suggestions or input I would appreciate it.

    Brahminek

    Firetree Server

  2. #2
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    I think you mean 540 defense. Use cleave for AoE tanking and even glyph it, it will help.

    http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f97/6...ing-guide.html <- may help with other general spec questions
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  3. #3
    Yes 550, sorry. I'll check out the Glyph. I've been Cleaving like a mad man on rotation for multiple mobs. Still, no dice. Thank-you for the link.

  4. #4
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    Do you keep thunderclap up and tab through the mobs?
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  5. #5
    Yeah usually, spam thunder clap, Cleave+Devastate then Tab w/ alternating revenge and shield slams on cooldowns. I'll throw down a shockwave for crowd control and throw in a disarm once in a while for fun.

  6. #6
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    sounds what like I do and I don't have any threat problems, only thing I can suggest is glyph of cleave.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  7. #7
    Im wondering if I should drop Cruelty. To me it makes sense to pair it with Deep Wounds as I am not convinced of the effectiveness of Deep Wounds if your crit chance is low. I keep hearing about how great it is though, so I'm going to stick it out with this build for a bit. I'll definitely try the glyph.

  8. #8
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    Try this (copied from the above link):
    http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#LAM00fZhZMItrx0didIzsGo
    This is the standard deep wounds spec. It maximizes threat and still has a great deal of survivability in it. It is flexible and versatile and is what I have used primarily for most progression fights since Ulduar.

    Now there are 5 kind of “fluid” points in this spec, and those are the points in focused rage and imp disciplines. People may spread these points around based on need. There are basically 2 talents that are usually exchanged, 2 points into cruelty or 3 points into shield specialization. Now focused rage actually ends up being more rage than shield spec, however you do get 3% more block and a decent amount of rage gain too. I personally prefer focused rage, but it can come down to personal preference. Some people also don’t really like imp disciplines that much or there may be fights where it’s not possible to use shield wall more than once or something, and so they don’t bother specing into it. The points usually end up in cruelty for 2% more crit.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  9. #9
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    The other option is to simply learn to AOE tank without cleave ... treat the mobs as a single big target. Requires a bit more skill but eliminates the rage issue and generates more holding threat.
    ** Remember Warcraft players fail in directions you never thought possible.

  10. #10
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    I don't even know what that means.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  11. #11
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    here is what i do when i am tanking multiple mobs. First i have the reduced cooldown shockwave glyph, glyph of sunder, and glyph of blocking on for it... i also use glyph of TC as a minor to increase the radius of it... everyone bashes glyph of sunder but the extra traget it hits, creates more threat and i find that i can hold threat more on multiple mobs over cleave because i am always spamming devestate. it is just how i play and know my toon... to each their own. others maybe able to hold aggro more with the cleave glyph... not me...

    I hit Shield Block, Berserker and i will then try and Heroic Throw a mob in the back (perferably a caster) and then swithc mobs to one that is closer to me and charge in, immediately sheild bash that target and then TC followed by a revenge then shockwave, or shockwave then revenge, devastate. I tab target, shield base and devestate, then demoralizing shout and TC. tab target and devestate revenge or HS and spam TC and shockwave as much as possible and always use devestate as a space filler when things are on cool down.

    always works for me. i rarely ever loose aggro.

    Cleetis

  12. #12
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    Many of your abilities are have bonus crit anways through other talents. 2-3% additional crit from cruelty just isn't that big of a deal.

    20% from impale, another 15 percent for TC, Cleave and HS from Incite.

    You'd be MUCH better off spending those points you've got in Cruelty on damage shield. DS is a key ability for worrier AOE tankings.

    And no Last Stand and 4/5 anticipation? Really? Very naughty indeed.

  13. #13
    I agree with you Griff, I was pulling those points out just to keep Armored and Cruelty up together. I think I will drop Deep wounds now and go with my old spec. Even though I got crazy rage, I never stalled out and could really get tons of leeway on my rotations. Just go crazy. I'll still get the cleave glyph and rock that. Im not really feeling the Intervene glyph anyways. I'm also waiting for a friend to hook me up with armsman enchant, so hopefully that boosts aggro a bit more for me.

    Thanks a lot for the input guys, Aggathon, very sweet guide. Very much appreciated.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    I don't even know what that means.
    I loled..... I had the same thought, but I think he's talking about tab targeting.... I could be wrong of course....

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by uglybbtoo View Post
    The other option is to simply learn to AOE tank without cleave ... treat the mobs as a single big target. Requires a bit more skill but eliminates the rage issue and generates more holding threat.
    This is actually what I did. I also swiched out the Sunder Armor Glyph for Devastate. So almost everything I did was single target.

    I replaced cleave with rend on my bar when I first hit 80. Cleave was just too expensive rage wise that at the time I didn't think it was worth it. Not that rend turned out to be worth it either.

    But handicapping yourself like this is an excellent way to learn to AoE tank. It's kind of old school I guess, but I believe I'm better for it. Although considering healers can heal clothies through most heroics these days I still get lazy.

    One plus side is that it'll train you to go to TC more often, rather than just relying on Cleave which will stop working once you get to a certain mob size.

  16. #16
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    I submit we don't have enough information. If he is trying to hold aggro against aoe DPS ilvl232+, he's toast unless the DPS holds back. He needs upgrades badly, head for HToC to get peacekeeper blade and work from there.

    As for threat stats, you have too much expertise and could use some more hit. Change glove enchant to armsman (+2% threat and 10 parry), and see if your gear upgrades have hit in it. The shield from H CoS is nice. You aim for 26 expertise and 264 hit, try and get as close to that as possible without gimping your survival stats.

    You have already exceeded your defense cap, no need to gem for it.

    Gemming in general, if it isn't a 30 stam, get the 1 whatever/15 stam versions. Never gem pure red or pure yellow unless you are in a real bind.

  17. #17
    Thanks for the extra input Insahnity re: gear.

    I aven't even been in H TOC but I'm starting today. I made my changes back to my original setup, except for putting two points into Impale for the 20% crit. I picked up Cleave and paid for the armsman enchant(sigh...epic flying...where are you now?). What a difference! Three heroics and I maybe lost aggro twice with easy recoverys. Cleave is working out well for me as a rage sink, now I'm not topping out on rage and my DPS is still up considerably with Cruelty/Impale.

    Since I swapped out my Brewfest Charms I'm definitely low on stam, so I'll be working on that to get my health up. Definitely gonna bump the hit up too. I guess its going to be a balancing act from here.

    I probably will hold on gemming for any new gear that I get, so high Def stats will have to do for now. Next step: weapon for sure.....

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