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Thread: Shadowmourne as a tanking weapon

  1. #1
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    Shadowmourne as a tanking weapon

    Hi, I was just informed by my guild that our DK Tank was going to get our first Shadowmourne. Would there be any benefit at all to this? Would the ledgendary even be as good for a DK tank as some of the other 2H out there? Even if it is a good tanking weapon would it be better for a dps to have it?

  2. #2
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    This is an issue that's going to be really debated, but ultimately it will probably equal out to having about the same benefit either way, partly because increasing a tanks damage output and threat output still increases the dps output of the raid, and mostly because you'll pretty much have to geared to clear all the content anyway to get Shadowmourne, so by that point it probably won't matter as much.
    It is a great weapon for DK tanks, since it increases threat value, although there are probably better weapons out there for survivability. That being said, anyone that CAN use it does have a claim to it, and no matter who you give it to it's going to benefit the raid, unless you actually end up limiting a tanks survivability by giving it to them.

  3. #3
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    don't kill yourself over it, legendaries are, have been, and will always be political. Just imagine it as a lv1 weapon with no stats with an orange color, because (most) guilds do not give it out based on who it benefits the most.

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    At this point it appears to be the BiS tanking weap for the most part, but it's BARELY better in terms of EH than other options available, and the threat is obviously going to be fantastic but it's not exactly the ideal set of stats for a threat weapon either. It's not going to be wasted in a tank's hands, but any tank that would accept it over a dps is pretty much a jerk. It's kind of like giving valanyr to boomchickens or thunderfury to a rogue (TF was amazing for rogues, just like this is for tanks, but it clearly was a monumental weapon for a tank in comparison).

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    Quote Originally Posted by blaisius View Post
    Hi, I was just informed by my guild that our DK Tank was going to get our first Shadowmourne. Would there be any benefit at all to this? Would the ledgendary even be as good for a DK tank as some of the other 2H out there? Even if it is a good tanking weapon would it be better for a dps to have it?

    Both specs would have equal penis size increase from it, so it's fair game IMO

    In all seriousness though it'd be a decent upgrade either way, so in my opinion it should goto somebody who's put a lot into the guild (if such a person exists in said guild). If the DK is just getting it cause he's chummy with the GM/RLs then that's bollocks, but if he's been your MT and around for every raid, even the wipefests, or is infact your GM or RL who's pulled the guild through the bad times and the good then he deserves it IMO. A lot about legendaries are symbolic from a guild's perspective, and not just a generous stat upgrade.
    Last edited by Xianth; 12-18-2009 at 01:51 AM.
    Xíanth <Valkyria>

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheYanger View Post
    It's kind of like giving valanyr to boomchickens or thunderfury to a rogue (TF was amazing for rogues, just like this is for tanks, but it clearly was a monumental weapon for a tank in comparison).
    Doesn't compare. A moonkin won't make full use of Val'anyr, while shadowmourne will be used by the tank and the dps equally. It's as much a tanking weapon as, say, Reckoning.

    Thing is, people want orange pixels. It'll raise bitching regardless of who got it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheYanger View Post
    It's kind of like giving valanyr to boomchickens .

    That's a bit of a bad comparison, because it has an obvious healing proc with 0 benefit to a dps, whereas the proc on shadowmourne can be used by both specs.
    Xíanth <Valkyria>

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    I personally think it is terrible to give this weapon to tanks first. While it may be a very very good tank weapon, especially since you can add 90 stam to that sucker... like... REALLY!? I did debate in high school and we had an argument called "Framer's Intent." Now this argument never really won debates persay, but it went something like "Well, we could talk about this, but is this really what the framers of this year's debate topic really intended us to talk about?" What I'm going to compare this to here is blizzard's intent with this weapon. IT HAS 3 RED SOCKETS WITH A STR BONUS AND A STR PROC. Like... This is CLEARLY a DPS weapon. If they wanted to make it a legendary tank weapon it'd have blue sockets and a better proc for tanks, like Windfury did.

    I mean, your guilds can do what they want, but like someone earlier in the thread said, Legendaries are often political. If a DK tank is getting this first, it's because he wants something orange, not because it benefits the raid more. This weapon is a 1.5k DPS upgrade from the BiS weapon in ToGC for ret pallies when you DON'T calculate in the proc... like.... DAMN.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    I personally think it is terrible to give this weapon to tanks first. While it may be a very very good tank weapon, especially since you can add 90 stam to that sucker... like... REALLY!? I did debate in high school and we had an argument called "Framer's Intent." Now this argument never really won debates persay, but it went something like "Well, we could talk about this, but is this really what the framers of this year's debate topic really intended us to talk about?" What I'm going to compare this to here is blizzard's intent with this weapon. IT HAS 3 RED SOCKETS WITH A STR BONUS AND A STR PROC. Like... This is CLEARLY a DPS weapon. If they wanted to make it a legendary tank weapon it'd have blue sockets and a better proc for tanks, like Windfury did.

    I mean, your guilds can do what they want, but like someone earlier in the thread said, Legendaries are often political. If a DK tank is getting this first, it's because he wants something orange, not because it benefits the raid more. This weapon is a 1.5k DPS upgrade from the BiS weapon in ToGC for ret pallies when you DON'T calculate in the proc... like.... DAMN.
    Yes, it's clearly a dps weapon. And dks are clearly designed to tank with dps weapons.
    See, the discussion can go on forever and in the end the person that gets it is whoever deserves it the most due to any reason other than the usefulness of it.

  10. #10
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    I guess I just care about personal loot far to little to be effective here in the conversation. As a raid leader from day 1 I've always taken and tried to distribute loot as it would benefit the raid the best. I really could care less if it makes a good DK tank weapon because imo it benefits the raid more to give it to a DPS. Thankfully we don't actually have a main spec DK tank, so I'll never have to deal with that, but still!

    I guess I do kind of agree with the "whoever deserves it" point. If you have a DK MT who has been there since like day 1 and has been loyal and helpful and hasn't missed a raid and the other options are dps that underperform, almost never show up, or are apps or something, then ya, totally give it to the DK MT. But if you have a DPS and a Tank, both with really good performance and high attendance and cool guys, give it to the DPS because it makes the raid better. If the DK MT is as cool as you think he is, he won't get upset about it. We once gave a Valy'nyr to someone because we thought the other person would gquit if we didn't give it to him, and when we didn't, he gquit, and we said, "see, that's why you didn't get it, you care more about the loot than the guild."
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  11. #11
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    Yes, since threat is not a huge deal atm, "benefits the raid the most" will be whoever will get the largest dps jump from it. None of the alternatives are inneffective to the point you can argue against them.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    But if you have a DPS and a Tank, both with really good performance and high attendance and cool guys, give it to the DPS because it makes the raid better.
    Aye of course, my point is that if somebody is giving it to the tank then there's hopefully a good reason for it, for all we know the other people who are able to use the weapon could have given much less to the guild's cause then my DK tank. For all we know the OP could be a DPS DK who slacks a bit, occasionally doesn't bother turning up on on wipe nights and is fairly new to the guild. The DK tank may not even be an officer, but he's been there from the start and is available for every raid, helps out doing tanking second runs so people get gear with no gain to himself. Not saying this is the case, but it's an example of when it shouldn't just be a case of "well X person gets 1.132% more out of this weapon".

    For me, when it comes to legendaries, people should have both earned it and get use out of it
    Xíanth <Valkyria>

  13. #13
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    With that "benefits most" argument you are shooting yourselves into your foots...in fact it would be best, to spend that saronite to crafted gear until everybody can't get any benefit of it. That's the point where it helps to buff a single player massively....

    So plz don't come up with "benefits most". Deserves most is the better term, and that should be as stated before, one that contributed to the guild in good and in bad times.

    EDIT

    Why is everybody going nuts cause of shadowmourne? There isn't even a single person now, that could have finished the first quest...and I rly can't imagine a guild that got their saronit rdy...except everybody spent their emblems for it and gave it to the guild...

  14. #14
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    Because, as you stated, the emblem gear is really good. Emblems are the best source of saronite at the moment, and AH prices are pretty steep for them on most servers, and you need 25. So... since only one person can loot the spirit shards at the end of the quest, if the other 2H wielders out there can't get spirit shards, then it's pointless for them to get saronite until they know they'll be up and should spend it on other gear.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

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  15. #15
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    I think its terrible to even say "whos getting it first"

    the ONLY thing there is to divvy up amongst your raiders who can use this is primordial saronite. the only other item you have to collect is frost shards and they are classified as a quest item so only people wiht the quest will be able to see the frost shards.

    AND if you do get shadow's edge and use it to tank with. your going to get your achievments done faster then a dps will and heres why.

    Blood Infusion
    Your weapon is now prepared to be endowed with the power of blood. You are to face Queen Lana'thel in battle and bathe the axe in her Blood Mirror power.

    Blood Mirror links the tank, and another person closest to the tank. so if your tanking her you will get this achievement by default.


    Frost Infusion
    Shadow's Edge is prepared to receive its final infusion of power. Sindragosa, the enemy's own mount, must fall. But before she is brought down, you must sustain three of her frozen breath attacks without tasting death.

    You're a tank, youre going to be in front of her anyways.


    The only quest i can think of where you might have to do something different as a tank is on prof putricide. You will need to drink one of his elixirs and turn into an abomination.

    The argument of "who should get this first" just does not apply to this weapon. If you run alt runs and use his/her badges to buy primordial saronite (like me) then it doesnt matter. Your guild should be using saronite to get the BiS patterns bought and made for everyone before we worry about giving it out for a weapon.

  16. #16
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    It's my understanding squats, that only 1 person can loot a frost shard at a time, and you need 50. If you full clear every week at a 50/50 chance (12 bosses, divided by 2 = 6, 50/6 = 8.3) then you're looking at just over 8 weeks for the first person to get the axe.

    Edit: also no, you're not getting it first =P
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

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  17. #17
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    I dont care about loot. You get good loot from being in a good guild, and i am. ill get it eventually

    and if history holds true this quest item will work the same as every other. it has a chance to drop off of the boss for each person with the quest. how do we know that only people with the quest can see the shards? because they dont have class restrictions on who they can be looted to.

    so valys may get one on boss A, but i may not. we might get one each. ya dont know.

    also

    The World of Warcraft Armory

    frost shards have a (stupidly) high drop rate even on normal bosses.

    EDIT: While this weapon will take a very very long time to craft. i honestly dont belive there will be anything to divvy up like we did with valanyr. blizzard has even been quoted saying "When the first person in your guild gets shadowmourne, the next wont be far behind."
    Last edited by squats; 12-18-2009 at 07:14 AM.

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    Ya, which is why I said 50%, and what I've been hearing is that it's like Shards of Valy'nyr... actually you know what can we get some sort of confirmation in on this. Being an officer this is important, and frankly if I don't have to worry about it and if the RNG will decide who it shows up for, then I'm f***in' happy because I hate making loot decisions.

    Edit: also I was just messin' with ya.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    Ya, which is why I said 50%, and what I've been hearing is that it's like Shards of Valy'nyr... actually you know what can we get some sort of confirmation in on this. Being an officer this is important, and frankly if I don't have to worry about it and if the RNG will decide who it shows up for, then I'm f***in' happy because I hate making loot decisions.

    Edit: also I was just messin' with ya.
    It's been asked in the quest forum several times and there have been no response other then "The next person to get it wont be far behind"

    EDIT: on another note, wtf am i going to do with bryntroll... this thing sucks in your off hand

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by squats View Post
    It's been asked in the quest forum several times and there have been no response other then "The next person to get it wont be far behind"

    EDIT: on another note, wtf am i going to do with bryntroll... this thing sucks in your off hand
    God Damn that's frustrating.
    "If the world is something you accept rather than interpret, then you're susceptible to the influence of charismatic idiots." -Neil deGrasee Tyson

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