Has tanking made you mean

[Insahnity]

I wouldn't say it makes me mean, most of the time. Sometimes it makes me mean, I guess. But yeah, I think that being a tank is like the ultimate control freak role in WoW. If you're a tank, you're used to being in control, and probably like it. So when you aren't the one in control of the pulls and the run in general, you tend to nitpick everything that other tank does, because it's not what you do, whether that's fast pulls, slow pulls, good interrupts, strong threat, smart use of cooldowns, which mobs to pull next, or whatever the deal is.

So yeah, I get frustrated with other tanks easily when I'm healing (though not as much when I'm dpsing surprisingly), but most of the time I try to let it lie. Once in a while I probably let the inner asshole out.

This is the essence of my answer too. Tanking makes me mean, and so does healing, but being melee puts me back to center, as I relax.
-As a tank, I EASE INTO chain pulling. The shock of starting a fresh raid with a chain pull is not fun. But there's nothing wrong with one slow pull and then picking up the pace if they handle it well. If somebody decides to get impatient, then I go out of my way to go slower.
-As a healer, if the tank is pulling slowly, I don't sweat it, but I start to DPS to make each battle go faster.
-As a DPS, if it's going slow, it's not as critical as tank/healer, I just do something else (browse the net in between pulls, etc.)

Jay,

you made me feel better, even though you would let me die. The worst thing I ever did on my healer, was when one the dpsers was being less than polite I just said I am not healing you. Luckily, the tank wasn't great and lost agro Everyone was at 100% he was dead. I laughed.....That's when I knew i had a problem.

Atlaon

I did this yesterday at UP. I was the healer, and I asked people not roll DE on BoE blues. I offered to trade them shards if they won the roll. Some ahole decided to say "imma gonna DE every roll" to be stubborn, including to DE some useful blues like burning pendant. He promptly received 2 extra repair bills for his attitude.

I had this yesterday with a hunter - he was just opening up on mobs before I'd pulled them. I waited til the next time he did it and just waited, let the mob beat on him for a while. Then I told him that unless he was going to start misdirecting, he should stop doing that. I don't think I got a single misdirect throughout the entire instance, but he stopped pulling.

I had a similar issue as a pally tank on nexus. Some huntard was pulling 1300 DPS at #4, I was pulling 2300 at #2 (normally I do about 1800 single target), and the top DPS was 3-4k as DPS DK. The huntard was opening up on whatever mob he felt like. First few times I taunted back, but I got fed up, and as a mob was walking towards the hunter, I announced in party chat I "..was letting that mob go, because I appreciate people who target my target". He then proceeded to melee the target instead of feigning or trapping or whatever. He complained he couldn't open up because he would pull threat, in spite of the presence of a 3-4k DK having absolutely no problems.

w

I would let you die the first time, the second time I'd boot you from the group and get a real healer that knows their place in a group.

Yes, tanking encouraged me to not tolerate bullcrap a long time ago. My groups are clean, fast and nobody dies. When somebody joins the group that upsets that it's my job to correct the problem.

Too bad we can't boot anymore in random pugs, only vote.

Pulling groups is a jerk move, plain and simple. If the tank is too slow, there are other ways to get him to speed up, like: I tell the tank in /p to "just keep pulling man, healing is no problem". The first time you pull in me, i'll rescue you, but the second time, when it's obvious you're doing on purpose, I'm going to let you tank 'em.

And random heroic pugs also means varying levels of skill. As long as the tank is pulling at a consistent pace, a little patience is expected from the rest of the group. Not every tank has the experience to chain pull all the way through an instance, or even judge the best speed that the dps/healers are capable of moving.

/agree.

I agree with a previous poster. If you did this to me your arse would be dead and then I would vote kick you. Tanking does not make me mean, stupid moves like the one you described do.

I woke up one morning still groggy and did my random daily. Getting my head straight I started pulling and warming up.



With the new Dungeon Finder anyone can easily be replaced at will. So you make the call. Do you want to complete this dungeon now or wait 15 more minutes? Seems like being a total a$$ hat and pulling for the tank would be a bad move if your in a hurry.

Normally I chain pull and go fast, but if if someone important to me is whispering or my wife needs my attention for a minute you dam well better believe your desire for me to go faster comes in a far second. This is a heroic not a progression raid.

If a tank is obviously taking forever (ie: more than just the first few pulls) then consider politely asking them to pick up the pace. If the tank just plain sucks balls, save your self the time and leave.

As a tank, we can do this. Our battle group is limited by tanks. If I log on as one of my two tanks, I get into a group *instantly*
When I get on my two healers, it takes a minute or two, but I get in
If am on my my mage, sometimes I get fed up and switch toons before getting a group.

So in short, if you are a tank, you can afford the "Leave, IDC" attitude
If you are a healer, you might get away with it
If you are a DPS, yer screwed.

And I say that they should include a secret daily buff to your account which boosts your priority on pure DPS alts if you run a random pug as a tank beforehand. And if you tank a few times, or tank on alts, your buff should increase as a stacking buff, and as your dps runs, it decreases that buff, and no decrease if you heal it.

Am I the only person who gets annoyed when dps constantly yells "go go"

No.

[Moonschwine]

I found the best way to make the tank move faster is to start pulling. (Holy fire ftw).

This pisses me off to no end. I'm sorry but you're not being mean, your being an asshole whose asking for a vote kick. It's insulting to see, can throw off a tank and simply invites mistakes and slowdowns; all because your ego is too big to consider there are other Real players on the other end of those toons who may not have the luxuary of being as 'skilled' 'geared' or 'experienced' as you are.

I feel your pain at slow pulls, but if tanking has taught me anything its Patience. I'm so overgeared for HC's its not even funny anymore and I see people screaming for me to pull more and more; but I always keep it within how much I percieve to be realistic for me not to end up running a loss of gold from the instance rather than a profit.

My blood's beginning to boil at the idea of players who run in fron of me and do the pulling. It messes with my rhythm and leaves me frustrated at the fact I can't gather my thoughts and run things right and smooth when theirs DPS and Healers throwing issues and problems my way left right and centre. I'm the Tank, I set the pace and I like to think I run pretty quick and clean heroics on my own schedule anyway. If your in such a hurry leave or go with others who run your speed.

What really annoys me are the people that refer to me as "Tank", or "Warrior", knowing full well I have a name. And then demanding that I do something...

I fully agree with you here. I may have a long name, but I respond better to it or a short version of rather than 'Tank' or 'Warr'. It annoys the crap out of me when DPS see me as some kind of lackey that is simply there for them to have fun. I'm actually a rare commodity that puts up with more BS from other players than they will ever have to. A little respect goes a long long way with me, as afterall - DPS need me more than I need them. In a way I think its why I despise DPS classes, because at the end of the day 8/10 of them don't know jack other than to cram Pop Tarts in their mouths and spam 1 2 Q.

With regards to being a control freak: Tanking works in 4 ways IMO.

1. Its done slow and steady (Slow for overgeared) - The cautious noob

2. Its done fast and sloppy. (Pace is faster, maybe one or 2 odd deaths) - The average
pug when im not tanking

3. It's shit-shaped because all the dps are unloading (Pace is slower because half the party is dead constantly) - The ever growing over-ego'd dps

4. It's done correctly - My way when tanking.

Pick which one you want, cause I know what I'd take anyday.

[Atalon]

I actually like being called tank rather than my name. Its efficient and I do not see as sign of disrespect.

Everyone plays for different reasons. some people want to get in and pew pew and don't treat it as a social game. If someone says hey, I will type hi, but I do not see it as a big deal if someone is there just to play. After all we all play this game for different reasons...

[Arvandor]

Just so long as the tank doesn't stand around with his thumb up his ass for 5+ seconds between every pull, I'm good. I don't even mind if he pauses and takes a moment to mark or whatever, so long as he keeps the pace up.

I also hate when others pull for me. On my paladin I actually don't really care, but if someone tries to chain pull for my Dk and all my runes are on cooldown, I can't pick stuff up.

So my question has playing a tank made you have expectations when you heal? And do you force your will on other poeple. And do you think I should stop? (Chances I will just run guildies, if i can't handle the pace)

1: Yes, it most certainly has. I know everyone moves at their own speed, but there are speeds that are completely inexcusably slow.
2: I only force my will on people if I'm the tank, and only if they're dicks.
3: Stop pulling for other tanks? I'd stop that, yeah. I usually just get impatient over chat. "Is there any reason we're standing around like retards for so long between pulls?"

[Jackripster]

This pisses me off to no end. I'm sorry but you're not being mean, your being an asshole whose asking for a vote kick. It's insulting to see, can throw off a tank and simply invites mistakes and slowdowns; all because your ego is too big to consider there are other Real players on the other end of those toons who may not have the luxuary of being as 'skilled' 'geared' or 'experienced' as you are.

Hit the nail on the head for mine, i have to admit disappointment more people dont see it this way. When you hit LFPug expect inexperienced players, just because someone doesnt know the pulls as well as you is NO reason to be an asshole. They have every right to enjoy and learn the game at their own pace, its you who pushed LFG, its you dint like it, dont press the freaking button.

Cant say its ever happened to me, if it did id be hitting the remove vote. I do get the odd DPS DPSing while the mob is still coming to me. Lack of rage makes me rage (only on my side of the screen however). I keep a solid pace up, pull one or two packs as they are almost dead im into the next one and never loot. However i may pause if my wife is healing as she like to loot for cloth, or if i have no rage and warbringer ect is on CD.

[Darksend]

Gearscore can kiss my _____ . Today I got the first of the 3 new ICC as my random. I was 35% of the groups damage on my druid as the tank the DPS dk was 34% the oomkin was 20% and the hunter was 11%.

When I linked meters at the end and told the hunter L2P (inc sterotype) WHY IS IT ALWAYS HUNTERS? I HAVE YET TO RUN WITH A HUNTER since the patch who was done more than 15% of the groups total damage except the hunter from my guild. Well anyway when I said that the healer said "YOU SHOULD BE TOP DPS YOU HAVE 1000 MORE GEARSCORE THAN ANYONE ELSE IN THE GROUP"

SORRY! I hate people who think like this.

Gearscore be damed a tank should never be first on damage in a heroic yet day after day both my warrior and druid are consistantly at least 25% of the groups damage, unless I am running with guildies. Even my warrior (although I cheat with glyph of shockwave and cleave and cleave is 40% of my total damage done lol)

[Spinks]

I have been called "the best tank I've ever seen" by alot of these new pugs, yet one wipe because the group can't perform and you suck. Its all relative!

A good tank doesn't pull mobs faster than the group can handle. Gauging our PUGs is a skill we're all about to get a lot of practice in

[!3M]

A good tank doesn't pull mobs faster than the group can handle. Gauging our PUGs is a skill we're all about to get a lot of practice in

I agree with this... a good tank should be able to assess the group and match the pulls according to what they can handle.

To answer the question, being a tank has given me insights of what a tank can and cannot handle. Similar to being a healer and a very casual DPS (Hunter). While I do lose my patience on and off, it's usually idiots and rude people who usually burst my bubbles.

Offnote: Playing a tank (or any role) has made me a little more critical on other tanks (or other similar roles)...

[Zerefin]

Jay,

you made me feel better, even though you would let me die. The worst thing I ever did on my healer, was when one the dpsers was being less than polite I just said I am not healing you. Luckily, the tank wasn't great and lost agro Everyone was at 100% he was dead. I laughed.....That's when I knew i had a problem.

Atlaon

My own pocket healer does this all the time . . . If I'm not the one pulling, or if they do something to purposefully pull aggro (deathgrip, taunt, w/e), she'll just let them die. Won't even rez them.

But yeah, I can't stand seeing tanks who obviously haven't put any time into learning how to tank. A 38k base health pally wanted to pause and let the healer get full mana between each pull for H UK while I was on my rogue, so I started pulling for him. Tricks ftw! Only one that had an issue with it was the tank...healer's loss of less than 2k mana was apparently a disaster waiting to happen.

[!3M]

But yeah, I can't stand seeing tanks who obviously haven't put any time into learning how to tank. A 38k base health pally wanted to pause and let the healer get full mana between each pull for H UK while I was on my rogue, so I started pulling for him. Tricks ftw! Only one that had an issue with it was the tank...healer's loss of less than 2k mana was apparently a disaster waiting to happen.

Did you try to talk to him before pulling on his behalf? While I can agree that it would be really taxing if I was in your shoes, I know I wouldn't appreciate that gesture if I was the tank.

Maybe it's just me but I find these sort of gestures a tad rude.

[woodyman]

I have been spending all my time an emblems on my arms DPS set as its need for my guilds raiding
and so my tank set is currently stuck at

30k hp unbuffed
high avoidance block set

i have tanked pretty much every heroic (except new ones obviosly) with this but i cant race along like a lunatic
since 3.3 i get so much your to low for this even on UP HC i lol'd

im easily at the required lvl to be tankin these an i dont appreciate peoples lack of patience and "go go go's"

[Xianth]

I did this yesterday at UP. I was the healer, and I asked people not roll DE on BoE blues. I offered to trade them shards if they won the roll. Some ahole decided to say "imma gonna DE every roll" to be stubborn, including to DE some useful blues like burning pendant. He promptly received 2 extra repair bills for his attitude.

"his attitude".

Sure he was being an arse but it's up to him what he does with his greed roll. because he isn't giving you free BoEs for shards doesn't mean you should just let him die to "teach him a lesson". You're just as bad as him.

[Martial]

I experienced a great group yesterday. two dps nuking two different targets and none of them my target. THEN one says 'hey Tank wake up'...

I had to laugh. DPSing is the so easy and all you have to worry about is:
1) dont stand in fire, black things, circles that have a strange glow, etc
2) make sure you're using the optimum attack rotation so you can link your dps meter after every pull
3) target the tanks target, wait a sec if there's a mob then aoe to your hearts content

I'm by no means a control freak tank as i started my wow life as a healer. This has made me pretty understanding on what groups need and provides a good chilled out approach to the game. Not all groups are speed runs and not everyone is overgeared (infact having some greenhorns in the group can make a great change to robotic runs i tend to do every day now). However that said, i'll save your ass one or twice if you mess up a pull. I'll even talk to you nice. Keep doing it and you're obviously a dick and i'll leave it to you...you spank it you tank it!

I do take the time of day into account when i respond tho as if its 5-7pm it may be a younger player and i'll provide patience all day long if they are.

I think the new LFG tool has really shown how few tanks there are across the realms and i can see why as it holds a high amount of responsibility and its always your fault(yeah right).

For those experienced tanks who, on either healer or dps alts, put pressure on other tanks cos they're not as 'epic' as you. get a grip guys. You guys of all people know that you can run a dungeon a million times as a healer or dps but only when you face it as a tank do you see the intricacies, pull lines, risk areas and other factors. Granted, the life of a tank means you have to learn all this fast but, man...i remember entering UK HC for the first time as a tank. God i was slow but slow because i was eager to do everything right by my team mates.

Just because we all received a ton of crap as we learned our skills and geared up doesnt mean the bullied now become the bully. Elitism is an illness of character progression and i've seen so many of my buddies turn into elitist dickwads just because they're starting to shine. I like to remind them of a few epic failures they experienced during their leveling/newly dinged 80 experiences i.e. Hey bro, dont you start on the tank, i remember when everybody died because you forget to change your lance to your weapon in ToC!

I prefer the approach mentioned earlier where i'd say something like 'Great tanking bro, feel free to keep pulling as i've got loads of mana. i'll let you know if i'm finding it hard to keep up'

[Berzerker]

realize, not all tanks have done all the dungeons yet (3 of which have been out for all of a week), and don't know all the pulls/fights. Just because you have time to run every dungeon every day doesn't give you the right to be a jackass while your tank tries to figure out which way he's even supposed to go, and learn just what he can get away with to avoid wiping and having to listen to the DPS start switching from "gogogo" to "omg you suck".

[jworley]

I would say made me mean, but it does make me take notice, especially when healing. I'll tell a tank from the get go to pull as fast as he's comfortable with and let go at that. Privately I might bitch when the tank keeps pulling a boss thru the ice (a la tyransis in POS) but as long as the run keeps moving and we're not wiping, then I'm good.

Now I will say that tanking has made me a bit of a control freak, especially in pugs. One of my biggest pet peeves when tanking is dps or healers making pulls. I simply have no patience for it at all, especially in light of the fact that I chain pull damn near every instance run I do. Ran into a shammy like that in nexus a few days ago. Kept pulling everything in sight; I said something to him about it and his response was basically "shut the hell up and tank what I pull." I told to have at it and sit down and watched him die...laughing the whole time, then I left.

I'll put up with a lot of stuff out of pugs (hunters who can't/won't control their pets; people who don't know how to play their toons; out of control locks and mages; etc).....I'll take the time to teach, explain the instance/pulls, whatever it takes to make the run happen....but that pulling issue will get me to left a group faster than anything everytime...lol.

[Darksend]

Did you try to talk to him before pulling on his behalf? While I can agree that it would be really taxing if I was in your shoes, I know I wouldn't appreciate that gesture if I was the tank.

Maybe it's just me but I find these sort of gestures a tad rude.

When I am on my rogue I pull, do not care if it gets me kicked from the group, if they think I am rude, dont care. If you take to long you are wasting the time of 4 other people. Learn to play the game correctly if you want to play with strangers.

NEVER EVER will I put the group in danger. Granted the pugs have no way of knowing this but having been a tank for 3 years on 2 different characters you pay attention to healer mana, if a tank had to use cooldowns on the previous pulls, etc.

If I were to group with you and you were going to slow and I knew for a fact the healer could handle it call me rude but I want my 2 frost badges and thats that. I will shove the mobs down the tanks throat because when I tank I expect no less than to never stop moving.

edit:

This needs to be said. THE NEW RANDOM DAILY IS NOTHING MORE THAN A WAY TO GET 2 FREE FROST EMBLEMS A DAY. having 4 80s to do a dungeon on every day no single run should take more than 20 minutes. I view them as a way to get badges and nothing more and once I have done it once on each character I am done for the day. It is not my job to put up with peoples crap. If you cannot carry your weight you will be vote kicked. just before the last boss, because blizzard does not let you kick people sooner than that.

[Oblivion]

Tanking hasn't really made me mean, I don't think. If anything, it gave me the confidence in myself and in my ability to do what needs to be done. Since I started tanking(early in BC, mind you so not really 'old school'), I've grown as a leader in how I operate in groups and how I interact with other people. It's not something that came naturally to me, it's something I worked at and became better at because it is expected, if not demanded of me, as the tank of many raids and dungeons. As a tank, I don't only feel the need to protect my players from the mobs, but also from any other problems that might arise.

As for the Darksend's response. I can't really say I agree. People play this game in many different ways, I've grouped with many, many, many slow tanks on my rogue, mage, ect. But I feel there is a certain line that a someone shouldn't cross. If you're tanking, you're running the group. Sure, I'll pull most of UK in four or five pulls if I'm tanking, or if I'm DPSing with a tank I know, I'll run ahead, tricks him and bring back friends, just to have fun. But to me, I'd rather support a tank than do something that I feel might undermine him.

Maybe it's because I had a few similar situations back when I was trying to learn to tank in BC, with DPS pulling off me, or pulling mobs ahead while I was still trying to establish threat on the ones I just grabbed. It was pretty demoralizing, felt inconsiderate and I spent a lot of time just wondering if I had the make-up for tanking at all and nearly stopped completely. But when I group with a tank, I am putting myself in his group and I will adapt to the way he prefers to play the best I can. I just feel it's a matter of respect and decency, personally; not intending to say you're wrong in your way of things, you clearly have a different philosophy on the matter and there's nothing wrong with that.

[woodyman]

When I am on my rogue I pull, do not care if it gets me kicked from the group, if they think I am rude, dont care. If you take to long you are wasting the time of 4 other people. Learn to play the game correctly if you want to play with strangers.

im glad there are not to many people of this opinion on my server

[Bashal]

I found the best way to make the tank move faster is to start pulling. (Holy fire ftw).

"You pull it, you tank it".

I think if I saw someone trying to rush me by pulling, I'd just let them tank it, then see how they feel about letting the tank do the pulling.

I'd instead politely encourage the tank to pull faster. "I can heal you through just about anything", or "I'll let you know if I need mana, I got ya covered," or something to that effect.

But please, don't pull if you aren't the tank.

[Bilistein]

I am one of those tanks that really doesnt need a healer in the original heroics now and my regular healing buddy often goes dps and doesnt tell the group until we get to the bosses. I chain pull like the mobs will dissapear if I dont hit them quick enough. However that is only cos I know I can take it without putting a strain on the healer and obviously I stop if the dps are not keeping up. I would not say it has made me mean though as more than once I have talked someone who had not done the instance through the whole place and yeah it took me twice as long to clear as it normally would but made me fell good for having helped that person