3.3 Arms vs Fury & Improving

[Novekk]

Hey guys, I'm really needing advice! Armory will probably show my tanking gear since I'm usually tanking but to see my gear, go to;

WoW Heroes - World of Warcraft PvE character info & ratings

US | Mannoroth | Novekk

After you click search you can click on Arms and it'll take you to my Arms gear/spec.

I was wondering if Fury still beats Arms and if so, by how much? Atm I can pull a little over 5k (About 5.1 - 5.2) in 25 mans with flask/food buff and that just doesn't sound right.

I'm gemming for ArP but now I think it's time for me to start gemming Strenght because I'm working on getting Needle-Encrusted Scorpion from the last boss in Heroic FoS to replace my Coren's Chromium Coaster (84 crit with chance to proc 1k AP on crit).

Is Needle-Encrusted Scorpion superior to GT or MJR? If not, which of these two are better (GT or MJR)?

Also, am I doing the right thing to gem ArP? I don't have Landsoul's Spreadsheet and if someone would check for me I'd be eternally grateful!

I'm pretty sure my spec is great, so surely it's not arms is it? I pull -around- 4k in heroics, sometimes more sometimes less (minimum 3.9k, max 4.7k I believe).

I know I have a really shitty cape and Relentless gloves but I'm working on improving them and not enchanting them/gemming them to my best until I get better. I'm working on getting the badges to buy T9 gloves (ilevel 232), leggings (ilevel 232), and the triumph badge ring (ilevel 245) ALL at the same time so they actually form an upgrade without gimping me (like atm if I just got the ring, I'd lose too much expertise).

Thoughts? Suggestions? Appreciate it!

[Destruyen]

Is Needle-Encrusted Scorpion superior to GT or MJR? If not, which of these two are better (GT or MJR)?

runestone is still the better trinket when it comes to arp proccing trinkets. yes scorpion has slightly more crit and arp on proc, but the big difference is the chance on hit for runestone and chance on crit for scorpion. at higher gear levels in a raid buffed setting it's not that big of a deal. but for pvp, 5 mans, and lower gear levels where crit is lower, then runestone is better.

Also, am I doing the right thing to gem ArP?

yes

I'm pretty sure my spec is great, so surely it's not arms is it?

spec looks fine, however you need to replace your glyphs with rending and execution while keeping your ms one. also, you have the rotation down right? your dps can be thrown off alot if you aren't utilizing every gcd and following the proper priority list.

I'm working on getting the badges to buy T9 gloves (ilevel 232), leggings (ilevel 232), and the triumph badge ring (ilevel 245) ALL at the same time so they actually form an upgrade without gimping me (like atm if I just got the ring, I'd lose too much expertise).

dont get the legs, yours are better. get the tier shoulders, helm, gloves, and chest for the 4 piece. plus you should get enough hit off the helm and gloves to upgrade other pieces like your neck to the agi one out of trial 10, or at the least the conquest badge agi neck.

[Novekk]

Thanks a ton for the quick reply!

I have a few more questions though;

runestone is still the better trinket when it comes to arp proccing trinkets. yes scorpion has slightly more crit and arp on proc, but the big difference is the chance on hit for runestone and chance on crit for scorpion. at higher gear levels in a raid buffed setting it's not that big of a deal. but for pvp, 5 mans, and lower gear levels where crit is lower, then runestone is better.

That's good to know, however I'm sitting at a little over 30% crit unbuffed and in 25s I'm at 40.05% - would this make NES superior since I'm no longer at low levels of crit?

spec looks fine, however you need to replace your glyphs with rending and execution while keeping your ms one. also, you have the rotation down right? your dps can be thrown off alot if you aren't utilizing every gcd and following the proper priority list.

Yeah, my priority rotation is pretty solid I think.

Charge > Rend > MS > Overpower to start out, then priority goes to;

Rend (Let it tick off first, to get that last OP) > OP (ONLY if the 6 second tick isn't about to happen > MS > Execute > OP (If the 6 second tick isn't about to happen > Slam with Heroic Strike as my rage dump on single targets unless there's 2 or more mobs in which I then Cleave instead.

I use Bladestorm when there's two or more mobs, or if it's single target I'll try to fit it in IMMEDIATELY after an Overpower and if possible while MS is still on CD.

dont get the legs, yours are better. get the tier shoulders, helm, gloves, and chest for the 4 piece. plus you should get enough hit off the helm and gloves to upgrade other pieces like your neck to the agi one out of trial 10, or at the least the conquest badge agi neck.

Alright, thanks. Question though, when you say get tier shoulders, you mean the ToC 25 trophy ones right? My current shoulders are ilevel 245 badge and the same thing with my helm. It's ilevel 245 badge, and my chest is ilevel 245 ToC crafted. I'll definitely be getting the gloves though.

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Last question; is Arms pulling as much DPS as Fury or is Fury beating Arms? If so, is it beating Arms by over 500 DPS?

[TomHuxley]

I have to say I'm also curious if Fury is significantly ahead of Arms now. I only maintain one dps set (and normally have two tank specs) but I've been switching to an Arms offspec on non-raid nights and it's a lot of fun, but I'm wondering if I'm gimping it by going Arms over Fury.

[Novekk]

Hm, could anyone share some insight on this?

[BWarner]

Both are competitive. Really. It comes down to experience, preference, and significant mechanic discrepancies in certain fights. For example, I prefer Arms, so I play that in most situations. However, the specific mechanics of Anub'arak on 25HM lean too heavily in Fury's favor to ignore, due to the high number of adds that put Whirlwind to good use, and making liberal use of constant rage-dumping through 3-target Cleaving.

[Novekk]

Great, that's good to know. Now, I do have one last question.

That's good to know, however I'm sitting at a little over 30% crit unbuffed and in 25s I'm at 40.05% - would this make NES superior since I'm no longer at low levels of crit?

What about this? When does NES become superior to both MJR and GT? I'm guessing it's always superior to GT but is MJR better than NES? What's the proc rate on NES, if anyone knows? I'm trying to decide which one I want, although MJR will probably be a little more difficult to get.

If MJR is better, then will it always be better or does NES surpass it at a certain point, like so much crit, ect.

Oh, and I'm pulling between 5 - 5.5k in 25 mans with full raid buffs, flasks, food. Is this good for my gear, especially considering I'm using a blue cape and Relentless gloves, as well as Coren's Chromium Coaster?

[squats]

mjolnir procs from hits, needle encrusted scorpion procs from crits and the proc chance on needle encrusted scorpion is slightly less then mjolnir's

[Dragaan]

Fury is still ahead of arms on most fights. Arms MIGHT be able to pull (very slightly) ahead on a tank and spank fight where there is no movement involved (saurfang, for example), but those fights are rare and almost any fight with more than 1 mob makes fury the ideal spec. The only reason for staying fulltime as arms would be if your guild's rogues have all switched to mutilate spec over combat.

[wired]

Guys I need help with ARMS also......any advise?
The World of Warcraft Armory

[Kinetix]

Guys I need help with ARMS also......any advise?
The World of Warcraft Armory

You need the 2pc T9 bonus badly. Get Broach of the Wailing Night. Then pick up the T9 helm. Change your meta to Relentless Earthsiege Diamond. 1 Nightmare tear is all you need to fulfill the meta requirement. Get a weapon in one of the new heroics, they're 232 level. You have 17 expertise AND weapon mastery. You can get rid of weapon mastery. Pick Unrelenting Assault up. The hit you'll gain from the T9 helm will probably be enough so you can drop your belt. Try to get Girdle of the Impaler.

On that note. I feel like I have to keep my rotation tight and use consumables to keep up with my fury counterparts.

[Kazeyonoma]

@OP, wrong forum, moving to HALP forum.

@ wired, make your own thread in the HALP forum please.

[Chaosjet]

Based off my gear only and assuming the correct rotation. What should my dps be on a boss such as Saurfang?
Link The World of Warcraft Armory

[wired]

thanks for helping....on my server warriors don't get alot of love and getting into raids can be really hard but I'm working on it. it is sad tho when a dk with trash gear can beat your dps so easy.

[redrocket855]

I currently raid as Arm's, use Grim Toll and more or less stack str, with the exception of recently changing my jewelers gems to ArP. I pull between 6-7k dmg...usually around 7k and around 7.3k on Marrowgar/Saurfang/Festergut..even when stacking pure str. So I dunno if ArP is the ultimate way to go...

[remu00]

I currently raid as Arm's, use Grim Toll and more or less stack str, with the exception of recently changing my jewelers gems to ArP. I pull between 6-7k dmg...usually around 7k and around 7.3k on Marrowgar/Saurfang/Festergut..even when stacking pure str. So I dunno if ArP is the ultimate way to go...

Ya there is alot of debate between arp Vs Strength. I wish there was one declared winner so i could know whats the one to use. I am Fully gemed strength for a while now and i wanted to know if Arp is the way to go for both fury and arms.

My armory link.
The World of Warcraft Armory - Gaothaire @ Proudmoore - Profile

[Dekar]

Ya there is alot of debate between arp Vs Strength. I wish there was one declared winner so i could know whats the one to use. I am Fully gemed strength for a while now and i wanted to know if Arp is the way to go for both fury and arms.

My armory link.
The World of Warcraft Armory - Gaothaire @ Proudmoore - Profile

Generally rule of thumb for either spec is, if you can hit 100% by using a trinket proc (needle, GT or mjolnir) and gemming ArP, then do it.

Or if you're able to hit ~90%+ passive ArP (not factoring a trinket proc), then do it as ArP gets better the more you have. This is usually a lot easier as Arms than it is as fury because you don't get the added 10% from battle stance as fury (or 16% with t9 2p).

Personally, my offspec is fury (prot ms) and I use needle (only because we've had 2 mjolnir's drop total since uld came out, and ones rotting on my kitty) and I only need about 2-3 +20 ArP gems to hit the softcap when needle is proc'd, and I stack +20 strength in the rest. It may take more gems than that depending on how much ArP you have on gear but most of mine is toc/icc 10/25 gear i've gotten on offspec rolls so it'd riddled with ArP.

I've tried both specs (including gemming for passive ArP of 94% as arms) and I personally can pull more dps as fury. That's not to say fury is better, it's just what I happen to be better at and more comfortable with. Both specs do competitive dps equally geared, Fury only stands out as better if there's more than 1 mob being attacked (togc 10/25 anub, twin valks, etc)

[remu00]

So whats the % or Arp i should go for? so should i gem everything 20arp or what gems should i focus on to get what stats.

[Breadfast]

I just re-spec'd to Fury from Arms and at my gear level (mostly 245~) it's cleanly beating Arms on almost all fights. I'm sure there are some situations where arms can pull ahead...

Arms is better than fury at lower gear levels, as well.

[Antioch]

I know this is off-topic, but really, how did this thread with 18 replies get over 6 THOUSAND views???