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Thread: Icecrown Lady Deathwhisper

  1. #81
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    The easy thing for me has just been to tell melee/physical dealers to kill all kinds of adherents, and tell magical damage dealers to kill all kinds of fanatics. You can tell them that there are 3 types of each if you like, but to keep it simple, Fanatics = Kill with Magic Damage. Adherents = Kill with Physical.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reev View Post
    The easy thing for me has just been to tell melee/physical dealers to kill all kinds of adherents, and tell magical damage dealers to kill all kinds of fanatics. You can tell them that there are 3 types of each if you like, but to keep it simple, Fanatics = Kill with Magic Damage. Adherents = Kill with Physical.
    The AoE strategy as a few aspects to it.

    1. The melee still has to kill the Adherants, usually by the bottom of the stairs. Sometimes you can deathgrip them into the AoE provided the spell reflect isn't up. AoE can't be reflected regardless.

    2. Some of the casters aren't AoEing. Most are, but you still need some assigned to single target focus fire on Fanatics, in particular any Deformed of Reanimated ones. Because you have some people who are doing single target DPS instead of AoE DPS, generally don't stick your raid dunce in this role who will cast on an Adherant and kill themselves. Also generally you'd have your main DPS assist be one of the two to three ranged set in the non-AoE role.

  3. #83
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    My guild were sturggling with 25 man last week, wiped so man times. I'm an MM hunter. But today we 2nd shotted it. Everything just came together.

    1. 2 grps on left and right and 1 tank on stairs at back.

    2. 5 dps on boss. We used 2 hunters, 1 shadow Priest, 1 ret Pala, 1 Boomkin. they must be good dps! all doing over 5k.

    3. Grp on the left (if your facing the boss) had 1 tank 3 magic dps and 3 phsical dps. Grp on the right had 1 tank, 2 magic and 4 physical dps. 1 tank tanking add at the back. 6 healers in total, 1 on each tank and 3 on raid.

    4. We nuked adds with about 10-15 secs remaining and so could get in about 1 rotation on boss before being on adds again. I think we had about 6 rotations of adds.

    NOTES : my grp on left had the mage in our grp sheep the fanatic closest the door every time new adds spawned while the tank tanked the adherent from the middle and fanatic closest boss. We nuked the fanatic first then caster then the sheep. then we all helped kill add at the back quickly. Other side were doing similar thing.

    Whenever Deformed add spawned EVERYONE including boss dps nuked it as it cannot be tanked. The boss dps (all being physical) also helped on reanimated adherents sometimes too.

    The reanimated and demormed adds are your priority.

    Make sure you have a sharp witted mage or 2 always ready to sheep mind controlled player.

    And 2 nd phase is a bit of a walk really, just interupt forstbolt and run from ghosts. Think tanks swapped occasionally too.

    Hope this was of use to some ppl. Last week for us it looked unbeatable, but don't give up!!! this encounter is just about good communication (everyone in vent) and awareness because of the many different add scenarios possible at any time.

    Good luck

    =)

    p.s. i should mention now we 1 shotted Gunship battle after that (EASY!) but are now wiping on Saurfang. We only gave him 2 tries and got to under 30% but then he just heals back up to almost 50%. Defo gonna be some wipes on him.

  4. #84
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    Our big question is can Shroud of the Occult be spellstolen/purged??

    Our 10 man keeps getting hooped because of the shields. Could this be not enough focused dps on 1 at a time or should we be ae'ing everything??

    thanks for any tips.

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmyzee View Post
    Our big question is can Shroud of the Occult be spellstolen/purged??

    Our 10 man keeps getting hooped because of the shields. Could this be not enough focused dps on 1 at a time or should we be ae'ing everything??

    thanks for any tips.
    In 10 man you should never use AoE on this encounter. The AoE strategy only applies to 25 man because AoE has a minimum number of targets to be viable. Only someone speced into improved AoE would be viable against something as low as 3 targets. The AoE strategy for 25 man is based off there being at least 3 fanatics which are melee that can be brought to the boss for sure to have 4 targets to AoE (which is break even point for most classes with AoE).

    Your melee DPS needs to burn the adherants down first, focus fire one at a time. Since Adherants are casters, and also the boss is casting spells randomly as well, it doesn't really need a conventional tank since a conventional tank would only have a small magic damage reduction beyond what anyone would take. You only have 3 adds total in 10 man and worst case you only have 2 adherants (right side of the room facing the boss). Meanwhile your tanks and caster DPS would focus on the fanatics. If you're having trouble killing the adds quickly enough in 10 man it is possible you are simply undergeared or underperforming for the content.

  6. #86
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    I know this is beside the point, but I love the nameplate (like aloft, etc.) mod that Lore uses and I have not been able to identify it by sight on add-on web sites. If there is anyone out there who knows the name of this add-on,please let me know. Thank you.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by homet View Post
    I know this is beside the point, but I love the nameplate (like aloft, etc.) mod that Lore uses and I have not been able to identify it by sight on add-on web sites. If there is anyone out there who knows the name of this add-on,please let me know. Thank you.
    you'll likely find it here http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f211/45772-lores-ui.html
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    www.ordnance-guild.org - Ordnance is back!

  8. #88
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    Our guild found it is a good idea to if you bring a class that can crowd control well (particularly a mage) into the group, to allocate one side for the that person to crowd control one of the adds, so there is less damage going out and tanks dont have to worry so much. Also, it could also be a good idea to put a class like a rogue or warrior up on Deathwhisper during Phase 1 to burn down her mana shield because they do consist damage and do not have to worry about going OOM.

  9. #89
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    In today's raid there was someone who said, that the adherents get shielded, when there is magical damage done to them. Is that true? Because that would make a warrior-tank almost a must for this encounter.

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ereren View Post
    Our guild found it is a good idea to if you bring a class that can crowd control well (particularly a mage) into the group, to allocate one side for the that person to crowd control one of the adds, so there is less damage going out and tanks dont have to worry so much. Also, it could also be a good idea to put a class like a rogue or warrior up on Deathwhisper during Phase 1 to burn down her mana shield because they do consist damage and do not have to worry about going OOM.
    If you're casters dps is going OOM, they probably shouldn't be DPSing in Icecrown Citadel. However much DPS they do is only as valuable as their active time DPSing. If they are running out of mana that's a very serious problem. When melee DPS is beating on a boss, do you ever stop? Gee, my daggers are getting worn out, I should stop DPSing for a little while so I don't have to repair them. Of course not.

    DPS is always looking for something to kill, and if they aren't they aren't doing their job.

    The reason melee DPS would be on the boss is completely different. They would be on the boss because you either have too much melee in the raid and instead of having spare ranged, you have spare melee. Or because everything else is dead and they are doing their job, finding something else to kill.

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerr View Post
    In today's raid there was someone who said, that the adherents get shielded, when there is magical damage done to them. Is that true? Because that would make a warrior-tank almost a must for this encounter.
    Adherants are casters and don't require a conventional tank, they are burned down by physical DPS. Only benefit a protection warrior would have over a rogue is the passive damage reduction of defensive stance. Magic damage is not mitigated by dodge, parry, block, or armor. Most raids won't even tell the tank to pick up adherants, they will ignore them and focus on picking up the Fanatics, the ones that actually do require a tank.

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quinafoi View Post
    Adherants are casters and don't require a conventional tank, they are burned down by physical DPS. Only benefit a protection warrior would have over a rogue is the passive damage reduction of defensive stance. Magic damage is not mitigated by dodge, parry, block, or armor. Most raids won't even tell the tank to pick up adherants, they will ignore them and focus on picking up the Fanatics, the ones that actually do require a tank.
    Hm... we had about 5 wipes until we killed her tonight (10-Man). Most of the time we got overwhelmed by adherent adds.

    We did it like that: One tank (me) picks up the Adherents (dps by 1 rogue and 1 hunter), and the other tank picks up the Fanatics (dps by casters, focus them down and then go back to Lady Deathwhisper). I'm not quite happy with this strategy, amongst other things because it involves switching targets a lot for all dps. So I'm trying to find one that fits for our raid-group.

    But I found that there is a lot of conflicting information about this encounter. I hope you guys can help me here:

    a) Can the Adherent-Shield (Shroud of the Occult) be purged/stolen/whatever?

    b) One wipe, our tree claimed he was silenced for a while. The only thing I can imagine this could come from would be Dominate Mind. Did they insert this into the 10-man encounter with 3.3a?

    c) The 10-Man video suggests that all casters dps on the shield, while melee/hunters take care of the adds - unless they mutate (get empowered, transformed, resurrected and what not). So melee and tanks do the Adherents first and then the Fanatics (tanked)? I'm wondering because this differs from everything i read/saw so far.

    d) Is it possible to drain the mana-shield of Lady Deathwhisper with Viper Sting / Manaburn e.a.?

    EDIT: e) The video says that both Adh. and Fanatics can be Empowered / Transformed. »This article however, says otherwise

    Sorry for my english, I'm not a native speaker and it's 7am where I live

    Thanks and merry xmas!
    Last edited by Panzerr; 12-23-2009 at 10:17 PM.

  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerr View Post
    a) Can the Adherent-Shield (Shroud of the Occult) be purged/stolen/whatever?

    b) One wipe, our tree claimed he was silenced for a while. The only thing I can imagine this could come from would be Dominate Mind. Did they insert this into the 10-man encounter with 3.3a?

    c) The 10-Man video suggests that all casters dps on the shield, while melee/hunters take care of the adds - unless they mutate (get empowered, transformed, resurrected and what not). So melee and tanks do the Adherents first and then the Fanatics (tanked)? I'm wondering because this differs from everything i read/saw so far.

    d) Is it possible to drain the mana-shield of Lady Deathwhisper with Viper Sting / Manaburn e.a.?

    EDIT: e) The video says that both Adh. and Fanatics can be Empowered / Transformed. »This article however, says otherwise
    A) No. The shield deflects all such spells as the description implies, and must be burned through by physical DPS. Goes down quite fast from single target, and also note you can stun-lock Adherents to prevent more.

    B) The only real "silence" from this fight is the Curse of Torpor that Adherents cast. It adds an additional 15 seconds to all ability cooldowns (Instant casts become 15 sec cooldowns, if the ability had a 6 sec cooldown it becomes 21, etc.) and must be decursed ASAP. There is no MC in 10-man.

    C) There are numerous ways to do the fight. One of which is to have melee zerg the adds while ranged (throw Hunters around with either) DPS her. Find whatever works for your guild and stick with it.

    D) Yes, but keep in mind that said abilities are capped at a percentage of the caster's mana pool. It's more effective to do a normal DPS rotation.

    E) While Adherents and Fanatics will both be called "Reanimated" when Deathwhisper ressurects them, Empowerment and Transformation are very specific. Cult Adherents will ALWAYS be the recipient of Dark Empowerment and become an "Empowered Adherent". Cult Fanatics will ALWAYS be the recipient of Dark Transformation and become a "Deformed Fanatic". It can misleading depending on how it is written and the way you interpret it, but this is what they mean by it. Regardless, the result is the same; the mobs become more deadly so you want them dead ASAP.
    "Upon an order we plead, with the lure of a song, a sacred song, to the moon and the stars. An illusionary light is here placed."

  14. #94
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    I apologize if someone has already mentioned this, but in this section from the first entry for 10 mans:
    "To handle this phase, have your tank and melee DPS take care of the adds. They will alternately spawn on the left and right side in sets of three, so make sure your tank is always ready to pick up a new set. The left side will always spawn two fanatics and one adherent and the right side will always spawn two adherents and one fanatic. Should a reanimated adherent pop up, have your casters handle it. Most times however caster DPS should be available to damage Deathwhisper herself to deplete her mana shield. Making sure you keep up with adds while continuously draining Deathwhisper's mana is the whole trick to phase 1. "

    Casters should DPS the reanimated fanatics, not the adherents. Its probably just a typo, but i would hate to see people confused.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerr View Post
    a) Can the Adherent-Shield (Shroud of the Occult) be purged/stolen/whatever?
    Quote Originally Posted by tuffmuffin View Post
    A) No. The shield deflects all such spells as the description implies, and must be burned through by physical DPS. Goes down quite fast from single target, and also note you can stun-lock Adherents to prevent more.
    I also believe Mass Dispell has no effect even though it is not a direct targeted spell, you could try it but DPS should be able to burn through the shield anyway provided you have a decent balance of physical and magic DPS. Spell reflect mechanics only work on directed spell effects, you can't reflect an AoE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerr View Post
    b) One wipe, our tree claimed he was silenced for a while. The only thing I can imagine this could come from would be Dominate Mind. Did they insert this into the 10-man encounter with 3.3a?
    Quote Originally Posted by tuffmuffin View Post
    B) The only real "silence" from this fight is the Curse of Torpor that Adherents cast. It adds an additional 15 seconds to all ability cooldowns (Instant casts become 15 sec cooldowns, if the ability had a 6 sec cooldown it becomes 21, etc.) and must be decursed ASAP. There is no MC in 10-man.
    Also note, DRUIDS CAN DECURSE. This should be their number one priority during phase 1. They likely need to invest in an addon like Decursive and learn to use it because there really is no excuse for a class that can decurse to not decurse themselves. This is a serious case of a player only performing part of their required raid function. I hate to say it but they either need to learn to play their role or be replaced. A raid has no chance of success if people can't perform the required duties.

    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerr View Post
    c) The 10-Man video suggests that all casters dps on the shield, while melee/hunters take care of the adds - unless they mutate (get empowered, transformed, resurrected and what not). So melee and tanks do the Adherents first and then the Fanatics (tanked)? I'm wondering because this differs from everything i read/saw so far.
    Quote Originally Posted by tuffmuffin View Post
    C) There are numerous ways to do the fight. One of which is to have melee zerg the adds while ranged (throw Hunters around with either) DPS her. Find whatever works for your guild and stick with it.
    Physical DPS has to be used on adherants because there is a chance at anytime for a spell reflect shield to show up that could easily kill a caster in combination with other damage done by the boss. Adherants are caster mobs which do not require a conventional tank. Just stun lock and burn it down with melee DPS. An actual tank only gets a minor mitigation bonus to spell damage (so instead of the spell hitting for 8k, it hits for 7k, not a huge difference). When adherants are reanimated they become 90% immune to magic damage. Fanatics are melee mobs that have to be tanked, they actually hit hard so tanking stats (armor, dodge, parry, block) all come into play. These adds can be killed by physical DPS after they have killed all the Adherants, though magic dps can be used on them as well. When Fanatics are Reanimated, they are 90% immune to physical damage and MUST be killed by magic damage. WHen Fanatics are Deformed, they must be killed by magic DPS and kited (they hit much harder when deformed and heal significantly). If you are having problems dealing with the adds, you likely should have ALL your DPS switch to them when they spawn, kill them fast, and then all switch to the boss waiting for the next wave to spawn.

    Quote Originally Posted by Panzerr View Post
    d) Is it possible to drain the mana-shield of Lady Deathwhisper with Viper Sting / Manaburn e.a.?
    Quote Originally Posted by tuffmuffin View Post
    D) Yes, but keep in mind that said abilities are capped at a percentage of the caster's mana pool. It's more effective to do a normal DPS rotation.
    Statically it is never worth while for a DPS to do this. A discipline priest running with like 30,000 mana and speced into Improved Mana burn would be doing the equivalent of 4500 DPS to the boss. You need a very large mana pool and have to be speced into Improved Mana Burn for it to be even considered. Generally though your DPS will be higher than the effect of Mana Burn, so a Shadow Priest would never consider it.

  16. #96
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    Thx guys, helped me a lot .

    Merry xmas!

  17. #97
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    Convictions, Lady deathwisper strat

    While messing around in ICC one day, I came up with the simple idea of tanking melee adds on top of lady deathwisper (done in ten man). This set up was extreamly simple and helped to get through this boss VERY fast. I suggest anyone attempting this in ten man version to give it a shot. I did this because of...
    1. When melee is killing casters the cleaving adds are way to far for them to get hit.
    2. When they become reanimated range can just switch to them fast since there in front of them and melee can attack her shield while they burn down the add.
    3. There is a tank ready to pick her up incase some one does not stop dpsing while adds are up =/

    Hope this idea works and that ppl use it. Really helps out my guild when attempting her =D

  18. #98
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    We almost got this sucker down today, with only 2 casters.. The most chaotic fight that I have been healing lately.. We managed to bring down the shield but with the number off adds up, we wiped soon after. Next time we will bring a whole new setup and we will get her
    | "Like bringing a knife, into a gunfight" |
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  19. #99
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    IMO the hardest part of this fight is simply finding the balance of proper dps on the boss to dps on the adds. I've only cleared it 10 man once by having all but one dps on the adds, killing them and getting a few shots on the boss then poping back to adds. we had a 5k+dps on the boss at all times. As long as you don't hit the enrage timer, usually the tanks and heals can handle an extra add phase or two before droping the mana shield so we timed the shield drop with only have 2 adds up and 15 secconds till next wave. unfortunatly we were soo focused on the first phase, suring phase 2 my OT died and had to be B'rez'd several times as no one was interupting the Frostbolts D:

  20. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by amilo View Post
    IMO the hardest part of this fight is simply finding the balance of proper dps on the boss to dps on the adds. I've only cleared it 10 man once by having all but one dps on the adds, killing them and getting a few shots on the boss then poping back to adds. we had a 5k+dps on the boss at all times. As long as you don't hit the enrage timer, usually the tanks and heals can handle an extra add phase or two before droping the mana shield so we timed the shield drop with only have 2 adds up and 15 secconds till next wave. unfortunatly we were soo focused on the first phase, suring phase 2 my OT died and had to be B'rez'd several times as no one was interupting the Frostbolts D:
    In 10 man it is likely wiser to simply have all the DPS kill the adds then switch back to the boss. Add control becomes easier when they are all dead. If you kill them 10 seconds faster, that's 10 less seconds you have to worry about controling them or them being buffed and health reset.

    25 man is where you have to do more micro management because there are a lot more mobs to deal with. In 10 man, it's easier to just have everyone kill them, then switch back to the boss until your boss mod tells you its time for the next wave of adds.

    Keep in mind however, if you assign less DPS to adds, the likelihood of an add that has taken damage being fully healed and transformed increases. If you did 75,000 damage to a mob, that went deformed, then you just wasted 75,000 damage because it was was all healed. If you apply more DPS to the target and it dies before getting buffed, granted you still have to watch for reanimated corpses, you don't have to worry about adds your currently working on being fully healed. The longer it takes you to kill the adds, the more damage that ends up wasted because it was healed.

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