+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 93

Thread: Icecrown Gated Progression

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Tacoma, Wa
    Posts
    8,766

    Icecrown Gated Progression

    Source: Daelo
    [blizzard]Icecrown Citadel testing has been progressing very well over the last few weeks, and this has been a huge help to the encounter design team. I want to thank everyone who has logged onto the PTR and tried the encounters there.

    As we're now getting closer to the release of 3.3.0, I wanted to talk about our plans for access progression within Icecrown Citadel. Icecrown Citadel is going to be broken up into four distinct sections: The Lower Spire, Plagueworks, Crimson Hall, and Frostwing Halls. We plan on releasing these four sections of Icecrown Citadel over time and not all immediately when patch 3.3.0 goes live. At this point I can't give precise dates for these release dates as they are determined by when patch 3.3.0 goes live. Once dates are known with more certainty, I'll update the community so they can plan appropriately. [/blizzard]

    [blizzard]The first section that opens will include the Lord Marrowgar, Lady Deathwhisper, Icecrown Gunship Battle, and Deathbringer Saurfang encounters. Progress beyond that point will be prevented for several weeks. Then the Plagueworks will open with Rotface, Festergut, and Professor Putricide becoming available. After another period of time, the Crimson Hall will open and you can then fight the Blood Princes and Blood-Queen Lana'thel. The final Frostwing Halls unlock then occurs after that, making Valithria Dreamwalker, Sindragosa, and the Lich King available. We believe a staggered release of the content will allow players to experience Icecrown Citadel at a sustainable, measured, and ultimately more enjoyable pace.

    There are other elements that gate access along the way. Players may not attempt any Heroic versions of 10 player encounters until they have defeated the Lich King in a 10 player raid. Similarly, players must defeat the Lich King in a 25 player raid before they can attempt a Heroic 25 player encounter. So players must master every normal difficulty encounter in Icecrown Citadel before attempting Heroic difficulty.

    The Lich King may not be attempted until Professor Putricide, Blood-Queen Lana'thel, and Sindragosa are defeated. Furthermore, the Heroic difficulty of The Lich King encounter may not be attempted in any week unless the three aforementioned encounters have been defeated in Heroic difficulty that week.

    The Ashen Verdict provides reinforcements and material for players to assault Icecrown Citadel, but this support is not endless. Raids will have a limited number of attempts total each week to defeat the four most difficult encounters in Icecrown Citadel: Professor Putricide, Blood-Queen Lana'thel, Sindragosa, and the Lich King. As these boss encounters are unlocked, the number of attempts available per week will increase. The initial number of attempts provided for defeating Professor Putricide is only five. When Blood-Queen Lana'thel unlocks, the amount of total attempts remaining will increase to 10. Then when Sindragosa and the Lich King unlock, 15 total attempts will be available to defeat all four bosses. After a raid has exhausted their attempts for the week, the Ashen Verdict must withdraw their support and the four most difficult bosses all despawn and become unavailable for the week. The limited attempt system is a feature of both Normal and Heroic difficulty.

    There will be no explicit rewards for defeating the Lich King with a specific number of attempts remaining as there was with Trial of the Grand Crusader. There will also not be an achievement to complete Icecrown Citadel without being defeated by a boss encounter, or letting a raid member die. (i.e. A Tribute to Insanity).

    In the weeks and months after all twelve encounters are unlocked, additional attempts against the final four boss encounters become available. This represents the Ashen Verdict growing more powerful and gaining a stronger foothold in Icecrown Citadel. To further help raids, Varian Wrynn and Garrosh Hellscream will begin to provide assistance by inspiring the armies attacking Icecrown Citadel. This is represented as an additional zone wide spell effect applied to all players that will increase their hit points, damage dealt, and healing done. This effect will also increase in effectiveness over time. Players may opt out of the spell's effect if they so wish.[/blizzard]

    Source

    My thoughts? Christmas has traditionally been a very difficult time for raiding guilds. Whether or not gated progression is good in general, it may just make the most sense for the seasonal release of this instance.

  2. #2
    Expected I guess.

    I felt like Ulduar was a good bit of progression to be non gated.

    Looking at a 100 US guild for Tier 8 ranking, it took them 7 months to clear Ulduar.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    375
    Hrm, unless non-heroic Icecrown is more difficult than non-heroic ToC, multiple-week stopgaps seems fairly excessive. From the blue commentary I'd seen, the intent was to balance Icecrown such that it was of comparable difficulty assuming the raid had advanced one full tier of equipment. I had been expecting one week delays.

    The irony is that there doesn't seem to be any intended gating for heroic once it's accessible at all, which means the weeks/months after Arthas non-heroic is unlocked are still going to be an insane progression push.

    -Splug

  4. #4
    I guess they really do intend for this to be the last major raid before Cataclysm?

    But yeah talking about the 2nd wing taking weeks to unlock? Kind of excessive.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    78
    There will be much QQ about this

  6. #6
    The first gating system will a blessing in disguise though if it is released that first week or so of december.

    We have some people that have finals then and then Christmas will be approaching.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    16,428
    this does concern me slightly in controlling the pace of progression, i know they don't want 24 hour clears like naxx but stopping multiple weeks between sections might be strange unless they justify it with some sort of player based contribution. I'm not saying sunwell or AQ style gating but fights feel more epic when you feel more involved.

    READ THIS: Posting & Chat Rules
    Quote Originally Posted by Turelliax View Post
    I will never be a kaz.. no one can reach the utter awesomeness of you.
    http://i.imgur.com/3vbQi.gif

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Sartell, MN
    Posts
    850
    I think the reason they are doing this is because they don't want top end guilds to be able to clearing the heroic version of the place by week 2, and spend the rest of the time until the expansion sitting on their hands farming gear while everyone else is still trying to clear normal mode. Blizzard seems to like the idea of having everyone be at pretty much the same playing feild when it comes to new content.

    In my opinion gating content like this destroys the competitive sprirt of the progression race. it used to be about which guild was consistantly the fastest at learning a boss, killing the boss and then repeating the process through the instance. These days it's who can get the lightbulb moment first for a solid strat on a boss and bam, you are now ranked in the top 30 US. raiding in BC/ulduar was like running a 5k, now it's like doing the 100 meter dash, and me being a distance runner IRL, I like 5k's more than the 100m.

    |TGM UI |Fury Warrior Guide | How To Use Landsoul's Spreadsheet| The Numbers Game |
    "I am an elitist; I will never accept mediocrity and I openly show no respect for stupidity"


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Marina del Rey, CA
    Posts
    3,142
    Gated progression is not a surprise...they obviously want this out before christmas, but at the same time it's exceptionally unlikely that they've polished the later encounters (Arthas in particular) to the point where they could even theoretically be released in that sort of timeframe.

    I expect that's 100% of the motivation behind the long gating, and not just "don't let them progress".

    But it would be cool if there were world events/dailies that phased in some stuff, even if it didn't actually effect when the gates went down (Sunwell-style).

    I must admit that I'm disappointed that it will become easier and easier as time progresses and "the Ashen Verdict gets stronger", however.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    70
    I agree with gating progression since it kinda give more time on hands however I would like to see gated progression done by server contribution i.e. Sunwell Dailies and the gradual progress on Quel'danas I thought that was extremely cool as a gating mechanic both lore wise function wise and visual wise
    sKsBlaster/Blasterion for Stim Kill Smile and Last Light on Stim Kill Smile and MedivhUS

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Near the mountains of Colorado
    Posts
    636
    The gated system is fine with me. It's a way to stretch it out over several months as they work on Cataclysm.

    I'm far more concerned about this concept of "Limited number of attempts" with regards to normal mode.
    Forth, and fear no darkness! Spears shall be shaken, shields shall be splintered! A sword day...a red day...ere the sun rises! Ride for ruin and the world's ending!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Orange Country, CA
    Posts
    609
    To me, it just seems like a way to keep people from playing 24/7 to learn the new encounters.
    Told you so.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    6

    Ashen verdict buff

    This sounds like the final Bosses will be very hard, maybe arthas heroic will be unbeatable without the buffs (or yogg0-like). I think this will be not as awful as it sounds at first.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    493
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazeyonoma View Post
    this does concern me slightly in controlling the pace of progression, i know they don't want 24 hour clears like naxx but stopping multiple weeks between sections might be strange unless they justify it with some sort of player based contribution. I'm not saying sunwell or AQ style gating but fights feel more epic when you feel more involved.
    Agreed, KZ. Great point. ToC style gating felt like a drive by. Less fun. Less immersive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ion View Post
    Gated progression is not a surprise...they obviously want this out before christmas, but at the same time it's exceptionally unlikely that they've polished the later encounters (Arthas in particular) to the point where they could even theoretically be released in that sort of timeframe.

    I expect that's 100% of the motivation behind the long gating, and not just "don't let them progress".

    But it would be cool if there were world events/dailies that phased in some stuff, even if it didn't actually effect when the gates went down (Sunwell-style).

    I must admit that I'm disappointed that it will become easier and easier as time progresses and "the Ashen Verdict gets stronger", however.
    I think the motivation is part of that. I think it's also a safety net for cataclysm release. Gating this severe (and this is more gating than ever before) could easily push cata to summer.

    I think the ashen verdict buff is a solution to nerfing encounters. Could be interesting change of pace. Time will tell.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    4,033
    Actually, sounds kind of fun and will keep Tuesdays as the best days of the week; and, if this is really the last big content patch (I have no reason to think it's not), they do need to keep interset until Cataclysm.

    They say you can refuse the buff, but I wonder if you get anything enhanced for such a refusal (extra emblems, lawyers, guns, money?).

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    493
    They're not even giving Arthas better loot. I don't see them giving reward for refusing the buff.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    68
    I'm sorry I don't understand the Christmas / Holiday "benefit" you guys are talking about. If you have people gone, they will be gone regardless of any gating done by Blizzard. And guilds without that problem will lose the option to continue on.

    I'm not seeing the benefit.
    Either play to win, or shut up and lose.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    4,033
    Quote Originally Posted by mistersix View Post
    They're not even giving Arthas better loot. I don't see them giving reward for refusing the buff.
    Yeah, guess just pride in doing it the old fashion way - kind of like when I was a kid, I walked to school 10 miles everyday in the snow up hill both ways.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    1,681
    Quote Originally Posted by laststand View Post
    This sounds like the final Bosses will be very hard, maybe arthas heroic will be unbeatable without the buffs (or yogg0-like). I think this will be not as awful as it sounds at first.
    They've made encounters easier over time in the past. Cider has a podcast where he speculates that encounters are overtuned at first for the hardcore progressions crowd, then gradually scaled back to accomodate the 'slower' guilds. Vezax's 25% hp nerf can be seen as the latest example (they left it as is for so long after all...)

    So basically the buff and gradual increase of tries can be seen as Blizzard stating from day 1 that yes, a small boost will be coming later for not-so hardcore guilds.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    493
    Quote Originally Posted by Njordus View Post
    I'm sorry I don't understand the Christmas / Holiday "benefit" you guys are talking about. If you have people gone, they will be gone regardless of any gating done by Blizzard. And guilds without that problem will lose the option to continue on.

    I'm not seeing the benefit.
    The benefit is that players/guilds that have the time commitment to other things won't suffer as much since they're not falling behind in gear.

+ Reply to Thread

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts