Last I checked they made JoL threatless.
Thought I might mention that divinity also increases YOUR healing done, which means more healing from judgment of light, which means more healing aggro generated by everyone attacking the boss.
Maybe theres no weight behind this but the one time i was MTing and judged wisdom instead of light I had major aggro problems.
Last I checked they made JoL threatless.
JoL is indeed threatless now.
Aggro problems? Either the damage (and therefore threat) output is low or talents are placed in ones not considered necessary.
Healing is the source of life. Without it, you're left with death.
JoL is a flat chance on hit 2% increase in health now, I believe it was 3.2 when the change hit correct me if I'm wrong. It use to be ret pallies not holy pallies who would judge light since healing was based off attack power. In today's day and age it doesnt matter what you judge just make sure wisdom and light are on the boss.
Yeah, you can have holy paladins use JoW if you want. It doesn't matter as long as one paladin is putting on each.
It also doesn't matter now if one paladin overwrites the judgement debuff. Both Protection and Ret paladins put it up faster than the duration of the judgement debuff, so there should be no loss of uptime.
As a personal pref, I tend to make sure the prot put on JoL and the rets put on JoW.
Strictly speaking, Divinity improves JoL's healing, so ret/holy paladins that have it should be judging Light.
Even then you're talking about making JoL heal a tank for maybe 40 more HP on a tank(others will see a much smaller gain), so what Jere says is all you need to know about who should judge what.
So JoL's heal has no threat??? O_o i am pretty sure the dps gets closer to me at the threat metter when i dont use JoL, but.. O_o?? didn't know that..
That being said, back to the OP
Divinity is a situational talent, there are stronger general talents. If survival is an issue, between your group's strength/skill/gear or if it's progression for your group, try speccing into it. It may help more, despite slight overheals. If healing is not an issue, then pick something else.
Your conclusions for Crusader are (generally) correct, in a black box sort of way.
Divine guardian is really good for the reason mentioned above, having 2 points in imp DG. This means you can keep up SS longer without having to drop something in your 969 to refresh it, extra threat. It's a moot point if you have a holy paladin healing you, you don't keep up SS on yourself (unless you count on putting your SS on your tanking buddy, who is presumably a non paladin).
The increase in health from JoL if you have maxxed out Divinity is laughable. If you do a 5% increase to a 2% heal you get a .1% increase to the heal. So instead of a 2% heal its a 2.1%. Divinity only really comes into play with direct heals.
To recap you have about 3 spare points that you can allocate depending on where you are in the content and what your role is. 1/1 Divine Sacrifice 2/2 Divine guardian if you are the OT. 3/5 Divinity if you are in progression and need the extra healing as MT. Or 3/5 Seals of the Pure if you feel healing is no longer an issue to bump your boss threat as an MT.
<sigh> even after I say that I am talking about a technicality and that I agree the difference is ridiculously small, you guys still maim at that statement. That's hopeless.
Not attacking you Synapse just pointing out how pathetic of an increase it is for 5 points. It's like throwing a grenade after a nuclear explosion.
While it rarely benefits yourself (only if there's no Holy Paladin, and then only fully if there's also no Retridin), if you include the benefit for another tank it's a good "tanking talent". Just not as direct.
A bit like runspeed for DPS, come to think of it. Sure helps DPS, but impossible to really quantify it's power.
-- (The Death of Rats, Terry Pratchett, Soul Music)
Speaking about divinity...
You also need to understand how healing works...
Why do Holy paladins don't go for Spell Power so their heals are bigger??
Because it doesn't matter if they heall 22k or 24k... most of the time their heal has at least a % of overhealing...
with divinity a geared Holy paladin will crit you for about 27k, without it.. 26k...
5 talent points for adding 1k to a Holy light its not really that useful...
I'd say Divinity is useful if you're being healed by a resto druid...
No, we gem for other things because some things are better then having bigger heals - like not going out of mana.Because it doesn't matter if they heall 22k or 24k... most of the time their heal has at least a % of overhealing...Yeah, but not all holy lights are crits.with divinity a geared Holy paladin will crit you for about 27k, without it.. 26k...It's quite good, but you get more bank for your buck if you spend the points elsewhere.5 talent points for adding 1k to a Holy light its not really that useful...Nah, not really needed there either.I'd say Divinity is useful if you're being healed by a resto druid...
Originally Posted by Kahmal
Haven't you heard "Enchant to improve an item's strengths, not cover weaknesses" ??
Divinity is like trying to cover "the weakness" of that holy palas dont gem for SP..
And well, i think i didn't express myself... obviously if you see an item with 30intellect and 60sp and another one with 29intellect and 90sp... you're going to go for the one with higher SP...
But you get enough SP from your gear, adding more is just going to be added to your overhealing, like Martie said, not going out of mana is more important, and since holy light is a mana burn......
But even if you had a huge mana pool, most of the good holy paladins will go for crit/haste instead of SP, since sp is mostly, like i already said (like 4 times), going to your overhealing...
Have it this way... a warrior doesn't has divinity... does that makes warriors harder to heal?? no...
Last edited by MudNova; 11-28-2009 at 11:42 PM.