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Thread: Thank you all

  1. #1
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    Thank you all

    So last night we went into ToGC 10 and downed the Beasts for the first time. We are officially a hard mode guild. So I wanted to thank all the folks here who have either given me advice directly, or indirectly through the advice they've given others. The help has been invaluable to me, and because I'm raid leader, indirectly to my guildmates.

    My next question is, what can I expect in terms of difficulty for the next few Hard mode bosses? Harder? Easier? And does anyone have any advice for them, from a warrior tank perspective, or from any other perspective which I can share with my guildmates?

  2. #2
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    in ToGC 10 -> Jaraxsus is way easier, FC kinda depends on the skill of your group, I'd put it on par with NRB. In 10 man I'd say twins is slightly easier than NRB and Anub is probably the hardest but still very doable.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  3. #3
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    Is Anub doable without an unhittable tank? I've still got about 25% to go on my unhittable set.

  4. #4
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    Yes, the unhitable tank was more a strategy for 25m heroic where you get 4 adds at once, you only get 2 in 10man so you take drastically less damage. However a block set is still very powerful against them due to how their modifiers work.

  5. #5
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    Jaraxxus is definitely easier - ask your DPS to set up /target macros for the portal and the volcano so they can switch easily but if you had the DPS to get Northrend Beasts down without them overlapping too much they you'll have enough DPS to get Jaraxxus down. The main mechanic change here is the portal / volcano spawning adds repeatedly until they're taken out - if you can keep it to only one Mistress and three infernals then the fight's more or less the same as on Normal. If you're struggling, try asking the DPS to use their own cooldowns on the first portal then use Bloodlust/Heroism on the second.

    Faction Champions is... well... Faction Champions. How hard it will be is largely luck of the draw (Resto Druid and Resto Shammy is... ungh). They're now completely taunt-immune and they do a bit more damage but if you downed Faction Champs on Normal before the nerf then there's no reason you can't do it on Heroic.

    Twins is again broadly the same and as long as people behave themselves with being in range of the healers and the balls you should be fine. There's also a debuff which is cleansed by switching portals so you may wish to have your DPS and Healers stacked on a portal so they can change quickly. Communication amongst healers is important so you don't have them all running off to cleanse the debuff at the same time. It's not too hard though once you get the hang of it.

    Anub either requires very high DPS, very good healers (so you can drop down to two) or very good kiting skills with use of things like Iceblock, Hand of Protection and other things to redirect him. You don't need an unhittable set here, but the closer you can get to it the better. Also, the add tank needs to watch like a hawk for them casting the Shadowstep thing - the cast time is quicker with each add in range of the others so if you leave all four up then you're in for a bumpy ride - imagine trying to do Less-Rabi but with your raid's lives at stake. It's not impossible but it's harder than the others by some degree so warrants some preparation and getting your raid to read up on tactics and watch videos etc.

    Good luck



  6. #6
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    When we first downed ToGC anub 10 I had like 90% unhittable so you don't need to be maxed; in 25 man (especially if you use one tank) you end up with up to 4 mobs stacking double attack speed so it's imperative you avoid any full hits getting through.

    Your 25% will need some work though IMO, you really want to be kept up with only hots and incidental raid healing, especially in phase 3. Anub is a big challenge compared to the rest of the instance (once you've overcome the beasts, ofc) but it will require quite a bit of time and effort in tweaking your strat, raid setup and getting those all-important upgrades.

  7. #7
    Note that if you have a holy paladin in the raid he can easily keep both tanks topped even if the add tank is using a non-gimmick set with his bacon spell.

  8. #8
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    Actually, the beasts didn't overlap at all last night, and we got Icehowl down despite him hitting a dps and enraging, depriving us of a burn phase.

  9. #9
    Then dps shouldn't be a problem for the rest of the instance really.

  10. #10
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    DPS isn't an issue if the dps is smart. DPS switching to volcanos and portals as quickly as possible is the key to the fight. Otherwise, you'll be up to your eyeballs in adds instead of having burntime on the boss.

    Still, as previous posters noted, its not nearly as tough as NRB. The next big challenge will be Heroic Faction Chumps.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reev View Post
    Is Anub doable without an unhittable tank? I've still got about 25% to go on my unhittable set.
    It's not really necessary but it's nice. When we did Tribute to Insanity 10m it we had a pally tank it in his normal gear and I tanked Anub.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  12. #12
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    Thanks for all the thoughts. Normally on Faction Champs I tank one of the melee classes, but without Taunt that could be tough. Any thoughts from the others in the tank corps?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reev View Post
    Thanks for all the thoughts. Normally on Faction Champs I tank one of the melee classes, but without Taunt that could be tough. Any thoughts from the others in the tank corps?
    I tank the rogue, between shockwave, conc blow, charge, intercept, hamstring, and intervene I'm typically okay.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
    Twitter @Aggathon || @Tankspot || Twitch.Tv/Aggathon

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reev View Post
    Thanks for all the thoughts. Normally on Faction Champs I tank one of the melee classes, but without Taunt that could be tough. Any thoughts from the others in the tank corps?
    Prot Warriors have a fantastic time in this fight due to their range of tools (as Aggathon mentions above) but other tanks do struggle without taunt. In my guild we'll typically have Death Knights use whichever spec has the most pseudo-CC (Frost is good here) with DPS gear on and Druids go Kitty.

    I play a Paladin and I usually stay in my Prot gear/spec but fulfil more of a "combat cleric" type role, using Avenger's Shield to silence, Hammer of Justice to stun and otherwise concentrating on cleansing the raid rather than healing.

    As I say, so much of it is luck of the draw (last week I think we got the Resto Druid, Resto Shammy, Warrior, Rogue, Warlock and Hunter... not fun!) but the damage is comparable to pre-nerf Normal Faction Champs so with a bit more CC and some high DPS to burn through the initial healing, you should be fine

    Don't forget - Heroism can be Spellstolen by your Mages which can help get through those tricky moments. Shattering Throw and Mass Dispel are your friends here if you draw any kind of Paladin too. Good luck and let us know how you get on



  15. #15
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    Thanks Mert. We did down the Champs before the nerf, but only once, so we'll see how well that translates. And yeah, the warrior toolbox is a lot of fun.

  16. #16
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    Another question, while I'm at it. Should I be looking to replace my Saronite Plated Legguards with the T9.5 legs? I'm really loathe to give up 700 armor, but I've really been missing hit rating. (I'm not having threat issues, but seeing that "miss" pop up really bothers me on a visceral level)

    My Armory:
    The World of Warcraft Armory

    And I know I need to replace my glyph of blocking, and that I probably should have gemmed a stam/dodge gem rather than a stam/parry gem.

  17. #17
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    I'm afraid to say it but for this tier of raiding a lack of Hit Rating is something you're probably just going to have to get used to. The 9.5 legs do have a boatload of Defense Rating on them but, in my opinion, contribute far better to an unhittable set (hello Anub adds) than your MT set. I'd personally keep the Saronite Plated until you get the Feverish Dedications drop from 25-man Jaraxxus.

    Don't forget - you can swap a Glyph of Taunt in and out for sensitive fights like Gormok and even with zero Hit Rating you should still be connecting 92% of your swings. The good news about Tier 9 is that it's dripping with Expertise so while you may not connect every time due to the lack of Hit, there's a far smaller chance those connections will be dodged or parried. Overall I've found that the effective switch from Hit to Expertise hasn't affected my threat at all and I'm a Paladin - I wouldn't have thought a Warrior would have many issues, since more of your rotation is affected by Expertise to begin with. Of course, your mileage may vary.

    One thing that might be worth considering is keeping Burnished Quel'Serrar with Blood Draining for scary tankdeath fights like Beasts and get your old Titanguard out with Accuracy on it (plus some tasty Snapper Extreme) for threat-sensitive fights like Twin Val'kyr?



  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mert View Post
    I'm afraid to say it but for this tier of raiding a lack of Hit Rating is something you're probably just going to have to get used to. The 9.5 legs do have a boatload of Defense Rating on them but, in my opinion, contribute far better to an unhittable set (hello Anub adds) than your MT set. I'd personally keep the Saronite Plated until you get the Feverish Dedications drop from 25-man Jaraxxus.

    Don't forget - you can swap a Glyph of Taunt in and out for sensitive fights like Gormok and even with zero Hit Rating you should still be connecting 92% of your swings. The good news about Tier 9 is that it's dripping with Expertise so while you may not connect every time due to the lack of Hit, there's a far smaller chance those connections will be dodged or parried. Overall I've found that the effective switch from Hit to Expertise hasn't affected my threat at all and I'm a Paladin - I wouldn't have thought a Warrior would have many issues, since more of your rotation is affected by Expertise to begin with. Of course, your mileage may vary.

    One thing that might be worth considering is keeping Burnished Quel'Serrar with Blood Draining for scary tankdeath fights like Beasts and get your old Titanguard out with Accuracy on it (plus some tasty Snapper Extreme) for threat-sensitive fights like Twin Val'kyr?
    I haven't had a threat problem on any fights yet. Even on Twin Valks I tend to do alright, due to a vigilance on my highest threat dps and the fact that I'm getting the damage boost myself.

    I have been trying to figure out what I'm going to do with my ilvl232 Ardent Defender, though, so that might be a viable option.

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