Just curious you both seem to be pretty good buddies and knowledgeable about bear tanking, but you have pretty different specs. I know in Darksend's case I believe he has said in the past some of the talents he passes up are made up from group composition and getting similar effects from other raid members. It seems like Felhoof groups would be similar anyway I was wondering some of the pros and cons, 1) IMP Mangle or not 2) Infected Wounds and 3) Feral Aggresssion.
Also for Felhoof on the bear gear ranking link on your main page at Think Tank the link that takes you to wowhead gear rankings where you put togehter a weight scale, would it be bad idea to move stamina to the highest and agility second? And maybe reducing the value of defense rating and putting a little more in agility? Just curious about your thoughts, I'm pretty ignorant to formulating weight scales. I've just been hearing a lot about STAMINA STAMINA lately
I've been designated for my group to be the person that does imp demo roar. Our ret pally doesn't spec into it, our prot warrior is doing more threat-based builds, and thus I'm the only one left. That's the 5/5 FA.
For infected wounds, it's actually likely I could skip it. I almost never do a 10 man or a 25 man without tclap or a DK around, and I could really use a boost in threat. The primary reason I wouldn't is because too often I'm solo-tanking something that's nowhere near the other people (worms, Twins) or I'm tanking something that a DK isn't hitting (worms/twins). But those situations don't tend to be particularly scary as far as tank damage goes, so I could probably get rid of it.
The bear weighing does weigh agility more, but this is more of a relic of how wowhead does their weights. Stamina and agility are weighed at exactly the same value per point regardless of itemization points, which means if you weigh them equally you get really odd things like polar gear showing up close to or better than T9 gear (since stamina is 50% cheaper itemization point wise). Basically, if you weigh them the same then 30 stamina (via gem) is always better than 20 agility and is better by absurd margins. I'd recommend trying it and seeing if what it does makes sense or is sane, and if it works better for you go with it. For ToC, at least, very little can change due to the relative lack of options, but that doesn't mean it's as good as something else.
If you're primarily doing 5-mans I'd pick up MSS. Nothing hits hard enough in 5-mans currently to warrant having the bestest mitigation spec ever - and in 5-mans some mobs were reported to be immune to IW anyway.
felhoof, wanted to pick your brain real quick if you'd humor me: (of course anyone else is welcome to chime in as well)
i MT for a pretty small guild of rl friends, stick mostly to 10mans and pug the occasional toc25. we just last week started working on ToGC10 and cleared up to anub only wiping once, which was a pleasant surprise. of course we wiped 30 times on anub before giving up for the week. anyway, heres my current spec:
i am considering giving up FA for MSS, mostly because i miss my extra dps and we have a lock that closes in fast on threat, even though i consider myself good at my rotation. our OT is a prot warrior without imp demo, hence FA for the moment.
just wanted to see if you had any advice about whats going to give better returns for the content we're running - FA, MSS, imp mangle and IW are the talents in question. i like bringing the mitigation, but i also realize we're not doing bleeding edge content or anything. thoughts?
Well, if you're doing (and wiping on) heroic Anub, I'd ask why you're wiping. If you think that you'd be better off doing more damage/threat, that's likely a good move. However, FA does help immensely with the damage dealt to you, especially in dangerous spots like the melee/slash/tick combo range.
If you're concerned about threat and want MSS, one option (since you have a warrior) is to dump IW and imp lotp, and get MSS that way. Or dump IW and get imp mangle, though that won't help that much on Anub'arak.
My gut feeling is that for the harder content in 10 mans now and in the future you're going to want to have one person be the imp demo roar/shout bitch; things are going to likely hit very, very hard. You'll want the slow up as well, but that's the easiest to get from someone else most of the time. How you figure out who does what really depends on your raid. I'm not a big fan of imp mangle; it relies too much on not doing things like demo roar or changing targets or anything to be ideal, whereas MSS simply makes you hit harder.
thanks for the quick response. as for why we're wiping (and keep in mind we've only attempted it for 1 week/lockout), it so far has not been due to tank damage. we were having a lot of trouble handling the burrow phases; embarrassingly enough, we only reached phase 3 once out of 25ish attempts. i'm not looking for answers in my spec, more looking to tweak and adjust.
i had imp mangle for all of wrath up until a few weeks ago, and i have to say its nice not to have it, just from a quality of life perspective. mangle and fff having identical cooldowns (or mostly, considering gcd difference) makes for easy decision making in rotations.
I like your new bear build Felhoof, it's funny sometimes you get used to taking some talents and until you see someone not drop points in them you almost forget what they exactly do and you read closer. In this case taking the 5 points from ferosity and putting in feral agression. And also sacrificing Omen of Clarity to be max master shape-shifter. When I saw your new spec it made me think the areas you took points out only really apply to rage and I haven't been that rage starved it's nicer for the way I like to play to have FA, IW, IMP Mang, and MSS.
I have a question a little off topic for KoralonI have around 45k hp with buffs (I'm not a TOC progression tank, just a little casual), should i go with The Black Heart - Item - World of Warcraft and Glyph of Indomitability - Item - World of Warcraft
I guess I mainly asking should I use the glyph trinket or one of the brewfest stam trinkets? I'm not sure if the use on the dodge trinket would be better than the stam. Gosh my druid is better geared than my warrior but it seems my warrior shined and I was able to take meteor fist just with shield block. I guess that begs the question what do you do in those cases, I've been trying to use a cd for each meteror fist round. One i'd use survivalist instincts, another a trinket, another frenzied regeneration. I've been able to get him down, but it always seems hectic on druid.
Well, if you are concerned about Meteor Fists, that baby hits for fire damage. So the best bet there is to just stack the stam and make sure you are standing on your OT. I wouldn't imagine armor would be very helpful. So definatly black heart, but Brewfest is not a bad idea.
That's just for Koralon and his Metoer fists, outside of that Black heart and Gylph are a real strong combo for .... whatever encounter you may be doing. I personally run with black heart / brewfest as my "default" trinkets. In my opinion Gyplh, while a great trinket, isn't the best choice for every fight. All things being equal, the fight not prefering one type of start over another, I would rather prefer the extra Stam over avoidence, but that is just my personal prefrence.