I'm new to the tanking business (Bear) and some forums say to use Massacre, but a buddy of mine says to use Mongoose. which would be the better enchantment?
Mongoose provides both threat (+crit) and mitigation(+armor, +SD) in the same enchant. +110 AP is just going to provide you a limited amount of threat. The Mongoose uptime is significant enough to make it a much better enchant.
If you are using the same weapon in your kitty duties, you've got to either prioritize cat dps or bearness. Massacre is going to be the better kitty enchant.
Mongoose, uptime is ridiculous. I've never seen a bear tank using Massacre.
Massacare would be pointless, definatly go with mongoose. It's basically a flat haste and agi bonus. It's threat, its mitagation AND it glows with blue lighting. What more could you want?
The only tanking enchant that I could see even being considred is Blood Draining, which I tried for a while. I was less then impressed, on paper its "okay" but in actual pratice it's even worse. I had trobule noticing the 2k it ever gave me.
Get mongoose.
Mongoose is in general better for most normal cases. Blood Draining is, however, better overall EH in some certain circumstances. The best situation for Blood Draining is that you're facing a boss that on regular, long intervals does massive burst damage; otherwise they're not threatening. There are actually a few like this; Vezax is one, Mimiron another.
But most of the time it doesn't work this way. Either you completely miss the effect because it's leapfrogged, or you go below 35% so often that it never stacks, meaning you're healing about 300 damage every 10 seconds. If that sounds miniscule, that's because it is.
Mongoose has another advantage in that all of the bear's aoe attacks are physical and each hit has a chance to proc mongoose. That means in practice that as long as you have 3 or more targets, mongoose is up 100% of the time. 120 agility and a bit of haste is much better overall.
Finally, Mongoose is also an exemplary DPS enchant, so if your weapon needs to pull double duty it's quite good. It is slightly better than massacre for almost all cats that do not have ridiculous amounts of crit (namely, Agility stackers + T10 levels of gear). The only better enchant is berserking, and even then only by about 10-15 DPS.
While I don't think Blood Draining is better than Mongoose for a bear, don't underestimate it. Just because you aren't noticing it doesn't mean it isn't helping.Originally Posted by Liquidska
I like to think of it this way... Blood Draining typically adds one stack every 8-12, and each stack heals an average of 400 HP.
Is the boss punting you below 17k HP more frequently than every 10 seconds? If not, the enchant has a virtually 100% uptime, for 400 HP. You can practically consider it a ~35 Stamina enchant. On bosses which aren't regularly punching the crude out of you, and are using a hard hitting ability that is on a longer timer, well heck, it maybe acting as over a 100 Stamina enchant.
Is there any tanking enchant available that I would turn down over a 35 Stamina enchant? Defintely not.
[Female Tauren Warrior]
zomg curb appeal! Mongoose! Mongoose!
Seriously, I prefer mongoose on my bear tank. I vote Mongoose.
I would and mine glows.
I am not saying Blood Draining is worthless, far from it, but for 95% of the boss fights you are going in to... it's sligthy use impared. I got Fordragon Blades done up with Mongoose and that serves for my standard go to weapon for almost everything. But for Vezax imparticular I whip out Origin of Nightmare with blood draining on it, for pretty much exactly the reasons Felhoof said.
I don't really follow the logic for doing that with mimiron, but I suppose P1 it would be nice. I still use Dragon blades for that though. Mimiron isn't that scary anymore at my guild gear level, so the extra agi / haste procs are worth more then the extra survaiblity that my healers already do fine with.
I don't totally follow your numbers, but I don't mind taking you at face for the +35 stam. There are more then a couple why Blood Draining (And any kinda of Proc Healing) is not the same as stam, but even if it was... I would STILL think Mongoose and its 120 Agi is king. That's just extra Armor and Extra Dodge with a great uptime.
Although, I would disagree with Felhoof about a DPS weapon enchant, I would never recommend a Beserk enchant, even on a kitty weapon. It may yield more deeps, but I have tanked more then a few fights (And my guilds first Vezax 25 kill) in total Cat gear just 'cause the other tanks got ROFL'd. Beserk takes off some armor when it procs, so just for the extra safety I would go with Massacare or Mongoose.
YES! I know that you can switch weapons in middile battle so no reason you shouldn't slap on something else.
YES! I know that the armor it takes off is not *whole* lot, but armor is armor.
But, in the heat of the moment of you shifting bear, taunting, and hoping that no DPS died in your reaction time. That's just one less thing to worry about.
Again.... It glows with friggin' blue lighting... srsly.... stop fighting it! That's worth price of admission alone!
Last edited by Liquidska; 10-15-2009 at 01:54 PM.
Don't deny the blue lightning.
The power of mongoose compels you!
My bear shift macro and my itemrack both switch to an appropriate bear weapon/idol when I do it. Same with cat. It is all done in the same GCD as the form switch.But, in the heat of the moment of you shifting bear, taunting, and hoping that no DPS died in your reaction time. That's just one less thing to worry about.
I don't have to think about it except when I get new weapons.
I'd really recommend this if you're at all worried about it.
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