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Thread: i245 tank trinkets

  1. #1
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    i245 tank trinkets

    Edit: Eitrigg's Oath is i232 -title is inaccurate...

    Looking for specific thoughts on which fights to use the two high iLevel tank trinkets (Eitrigg's Oath and Ony's Talisman) vs. swapping one (or both!) of them out for the brewfest stam trinks).

    With both avoidance trinks, my unbuffed EH is around 31K. My thinking is that this is sorta low for the content I run (Toc 10, Uld 25 - want to be able to do ToC 10 hard mode soon).

    Any other gear/enchant/gem thoughts are welcome, too, of course.

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  2. #2
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    Your effective health is only 31K? This must be an error. You must mean your health.

    And yes, I would say that is a bit to low for ToC10, so I'd stick with brewfest (at least one) until my gear improves.
    The box said: "Requires Windows 98 or better.", so I installed Linux.

  3. #3
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    Stam > avoidance for T9. The Eitriggs Oath "on use" is very weak because it requires you to actually get hit.

    The ony trinket is good if it means you can replace def enchants / gems on your gear and still be over 540.

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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by drae View Post
    Stam > avoidance for T9. The Eitriggs Oath "on use" is very weak because it requires you to actually get hit.

    The ony trinket is good if it means you can replace def enchants / gems on your gear and still be over 540.
    ^ This.
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  5. #5
    You can also add quite a bit of hp if you switched a few things up....
    18 stam to gloves and shield
    30 stam gems in that head and chest slot add a 10 to all stats prismatic to cover you meta
    gladiator chant for shoulders..I think it is 30stam
    Last edited by Dormungus; 10-15-2009 at 11:20 AM. Reason: missed something

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dormungus View Post
    18 stam to gloves

    add a 10 to all stats prismatic to cover you meta
    These 2 bits are not good advice. For max EHP you only need 1 red gem to get your meta requirements, therefor you gem an item that gives you either a 9 or 12 stam bonus for a red socket. For me it's my helm. Gem it with 15 stam/10 expertise (or dodge) and you have more stam than the prismatic gem, and its cheaper!

    Do not put 18 stam to gloves, go with armor to gloves. It is MUCH more EHP.

    The other advice is good, do what he said about the other things.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  7. #7
    Which armor chant? I plugged in the numbers...He'd need an armor chant that gave 230armor to equal 18 stam..right? He is not an engineer so no 800 armor chant...or can they do it on other people?

    Yeah i totally ass-ed up the gems :-)
    Last edited by Dormungus; 10-15-2009 at 01:07 PM.

  8. #8
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    Okay - so assuming that I drop one and replace it with a stam trink, which do I drop? Eitrigg's Oath? How I re-enchant/gem for more stam would depend on whether I keep the Ony trink as a main trink since I can only drop some of the def rating enchants if that's the case.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dormungus View Post
    Which armor chant? I plugged in the numbers...He'd need an armor chant that gave 230armor to equal 18 stam..right? He is not an engineer so no 800 armor chant...or can they do it on other people?

    Yeah i totally ass-ed up the gems :-)
    225 armor is about 500HPs... sooo your numbers are wrong.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    225 armor is about 500HPs... sooo your numbers are wrong.
    Where are you getting that from? It's completely bogus, even for pure physical fights. Throw in any degree of magical damage into the mixture and it's value will decrease more. I'm not saying armor isn't good, but statements like 225 armor = 500hp is ludicrous. If he could get the 800armor enchant he wouldn't want to pass it up, but at best 225 armor is about equal to around 225hp.

  11. #11
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    Ya with 40000 HP and 27k armor - 225 armor is worth ~600 EH.

    With 50k HP and 29k armor - 225 armor is worth ~750 EH.

    as per the EH calculator.

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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petninja View Post
    Where are you getting that from? It's completely bogus, even for pure physical fights. Throw in any degree of magical damage into the mixture and it's value will decrease more. I'm not saying armor isn't good, but statements like 225 armor = 500hp is ludicrous. If he could get the 800armor enchant he wouldn't want to pass it up, but at best 225 armor is about equal to around 225hp.
    EHP Calculator is this way:

    Raid buffed I'm at around 52000 hps and 31000 armor:

    This gives me an EHP of 165449.02

    If you increase my armor 31225 (enchant to cloak amount, I use the engineering enchant so I don't recall the exact amounts on the normal armor to glove enchant) my EHP is: 166230.50

    166230.5
    - 165449.0
    781.5

    Okay, so i was wrong, it's actually MORE EHP.


    Edit: side note about the Engineering enchant: Without it I'd be around 30100 armor buffed.

    EH = 162323.08
    with EH = 165449.02
    EH gain = 3125.94 EHP

    I'm pretty sure this makes Engineering the best tanking profession, booya!

    Edit 2: Glove Reinforcements - Item - World of Warcraft <- 240 armor, so even MORE EHP.
    Last edited by Aggathon; 10-15-2009 at 03:35 PM.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  13. #13
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    Glove Reinforcements are 240 armor, and a very decent glove enchant.

  14. #14
    Uhm, to those EH calculator users, you can't compare the EH increase of the armor to the hp of the other enchant.

    Current (unbuffed) EH of the poster: 86348
    EH with 240 armor to gloves: 86851
    EH with 18 Stamina enchant: 86845

    That makes for a 503 EH increase with the armor enchant and a 497 EH increase with the stamina enchant. Factoring in raid buffs would probably increase this a bit towards the armor enchant, but any kind of non physical damage (gormok bleed for example) would make me choose stamina for now.

  15. #15
    I was using the OP's numbers...not yours or mine...31k hp is far from 40 or 50k...His armor is way lower than mine also. At his gear level unbuffed they are equal.

    For the OP...18 stam is about 230 armor...I did not know there was a chant for it.

  16. #16
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    Whoa, I thought I was on the train about tanking trinkets. Must have passed out when it switched rails over to professions and EH.

    Assholery aside, you do want the most EH as you possibly can for ToC 10/25 due to the nature of the fights. As previously stated, the dodge trinket out of ToC 10 is generally regarded as trash due to its bad on use effect. Even Ony's trinket is pretty useless in ToC 10/25 (that is, if you're not add tanking in Anub). If you have both brewfest trinkets, equip them both and hopefully you can get into a ToC 25 for the stam trinket out of there. If you only have one, then run reg ToC until you find yourself The Black Heart. It has a decent amount of stam and the proc itself is useful (though unpredictable).

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eternal Dragon View Post
    Uhm, to those EH calculator users, you can't compare the EH increase of the armor to the hp of the other enchant.

    Current (unbuffed) EH of the poster: 86348
    EH with 240 armor to gloves: 86851
    EH with 18 Stamina enchant: 86845

    That makes for a 503 EH increase with the armor enchant and a 497 EH increase with the stamina enchant. Factoring in raid buffs would probably increase this a bit towards the armor enchant, but any kind of non physical damage (gormok bleed for example) would make me choose stamina for now.
    It would more likely favor the Stam enchant, since Kings/Sanc gives a scaling stam buff and there are no scaling armor buffs.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aggathon View Post
    EHP Calculator is this way:

    Raid buffed I'm at around 52000 hps and 31000 armor:

    This gives me an EHP of 165449.02

    If you increase my armor 31225 (enchant to cloak amount, I use the engineering enchant so I don't recall the exact amounts on the normal armor to glove enchant) my EHP is: 166230.50

    166230.5
    - 165449.0
    781.5

    Okay, so i was wrong, it's actually MORE EHP.


    Edit: side note about the Engineering enchant: Without it I'd be around 30100 armor buffed.

    EH = 162323.08
    with EH = 165449.02
    EH gain = 3125.94 EHP

    I'm pretty sure this makes Engineering the best tanking profession, booya!

    Edit 2: Glove Reinforcements - Item - World of Warcraft <- 240 armor, so even MORE EHP.
    I wasn't arguing that 225 armor would give you more than 225 EHP. I was arguing that 225 armor wasn't equal to or greater than 500hp (~50stam), which was the statement you made. Your terms were wrong, so I think I took your statement the wrong way .

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petninja View Post
    I wasn't arguing that 225 armor would give you more than 225 EHP. I was arguing that 225 armor wasn't equal to or greater than 500hp (~50stam), which was the statement you made. Your terms were wrong, so I think I took your statement the wrong way .
    At my current gear levels 18 stam (calculated out to be roughly 200 hps with kings, I rounded, w/e) would equate to about 550 EHP, and 240 Armor is about 750, seems to me like armor is scaling better here. Also: in order for 18 stam to be better this means that roughly 33% of the incoming damage would have to be magic for 18 stam to be better. So at his gear levels they're about the same, but his armor is really low as it is and the more gear he gets the better armor will be over stam.
    [Today 09:38 AM] Reev: The older I get, the more I think those Greek philosophers were just annoying hipsters.
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  20. #20
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    Also note that stamina increases your EH in a linear fashion and armor increases it in an inverse logarithmic fashion (the more you have the less benefit you get from it). This makes the non-engineering armor enchant diminish relative to the stamina enchant as your gear level increases (ie you get more armor from the gear, which makes the 240 armor from the enchant mitigate less damage). This is also applicable in the discussion of the ilvl 245 armor trinket from badges versus a pure stamina trinket like Satrina/Juggernaut and Brewmasters. The Glyph (Glyph of Indomitability - Item - World of Warcraft) is likely amazing for him at ToC10 normal gear levels, but at my gear level (farming 25 hard up to anub) it cannot compare to even Brewmasters.

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