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Thread: Coliseum Anub'arak (Hard Mode)

  1. #41
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    Added the full transcript for the 25-man guide and added an additional preparation section that Splug wrote up!

  2. #42
    I have a doubt about the 101.6% block+avoidance. I tougth the character screen shows values pre-DR, so if you sum your block + miss + dodge + parry is more than you really have.

    I'm wrong?
    Follow the Moeko Principle.

  3. #43
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    Yes and no. The actual values of dodge and parry are after DR. Miss does not have its own slot like the others so the only way to get miss is with a macro. See below
    139x.04=5.56%. Where it says at the bottom "before diminish returns" simply means that you do not take 5.56% and add it to your dodge and parry straight up. Once it is added however the actual numbers displayed are indeed after DR. Likewise when you mouse over your dodge and parry, that amount of rating will always give that amount of dodge, that number is then subject to DR and added to your total to get the number you see when you are not mousing over.

    Like I said however since this is the only place miss appears it is impossible to know your exact chance to be missed without a macro.

    Block does not have DR.



  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by fr0d0b0ls0n View Post
    I have a doubt about the 101.6% block+avoidance. I tougth the character screen shows values pre-DR, so if you sum your block + miss + dodge + parry is more than you really have.

    I'm wrong?
    As Darksend has already stated, the values shown on your character screen for block/dodge/parry % are post-DR. If you mouse over them, the tooltip will state how much avoidance % you would have gotten from rating alone without DR.

    There's a macro I've been using to pull the numbers up, I believe I took it from the forums here at some point so it should be around here somewhere... I'll try to remember to copy/paste it from my macro window when I get home.

    -Splug

  5. #45
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    Assuming the off-tank is a paladin tank, I'm not sure of the benefit of using an unhittable set, as opposed to a block value set. I have nearly every BV piece available, and I find that at 4700 or so BV, I'm taking virtually no damage, and holy shield rarely gets removed. (only if they pick up the haste from the opposite side's tank) There are attempts where I will take 10k-20k damage while the adds are up. I can gain passive unhittable, but I lose BV and take more damage overall.

  6. #46
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    the unhittable set is for a 1 add tank strategy, if you're using 2 add tanks, you're already not needing an unhittable set strategy.

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  7. #47
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    The video is showing the 2 offtank method and recomending that the offtanks maintain passive unhittability.

    "Offtanks should strive to reach 101.6 percent combined avoidance and block chance on their character sheet, to ensure the level eighty-two crypt fiends will not inflict unblocked hits. This ensures damage is consistently reduced, rather than risking sudden surges of drastically increased damage."

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Contrite View Post
    Assuming the off-tank is a paladin tank, I'm not sure of the benefit of using an unhittable set, as opposed to a block value set. I have nearly every BV piece available, and I find that at 4700 or so BV, I'm taking virtually no damage, and holy shield rarely gets removed. (only if they pick up the haste from the opposite side's tank) There are attempts where I will take 10k-20k damage while the adds are up. I can gain passive unhittable, but I lose BV and take more damage overall.
    If you're only tanking two adds, you can safely include Holy Shield in your calculation as normal, meaning your block set is very likely well over 101.6% - the comment is still accurate, it's just stating a condition that's somewhat trivial. If you are tanking all four adds, they will attack quickly enough to chew through holy shield, and you should not count it as reliable mitigation. You may only have a small chance of taking 2-3 unblocked hits at a time, but four adds attacking more than once per second each can roll dice very, very quickly.

    The result is what Kazeyonoma said: if you run one tank, you'll need a passively unhittable set. If you run two, it's not essential at all. You're still better off ensuring you never take full hits - though you should safely include Holy Shield at that point. Remember: you aren't playing with a full health bar in phase 3, as the lower the healers can let the offtanks slide safely, the better off the damage pace will be. They can only let the tanks sit at a point where the worst-case damage spike won't kill them, and if that's two unblocked attacks plus a leeching swarm tick, you need to sit at >30k health (almost full). If it's two blocked hits for 4k (~2250 BV) and a leeching swarm tick, 15k is relatively safe. Worst-case analysis will drive how you handle healing each offtank in that phase, and thus the boss' regeneration.

    That said, I forgot to comment that you probably want to get the tanks to nearly full right as a new wave of adds comes in - it gives the tanks time to position them in case something bites them in the back while slogging through the permafrost.

    -Splug

  9. #49
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    Just watched the 25-man video. Although the information is basically useless to me since i doubt i'll ever see that fight i'd just thought i'd say how good the video is in terms of content and production.

    Very nice splug.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by joandarc View Post
    Hello Aliena, may I ask you which addonn you use for seeing the trash hp (as you can see at the 41th second of the video)? Using key V also shows players hp, but you use an addonn for seeing only trash hp, may I ask which addonn is it? Thanks.
    We just did our first attempts on Anub25 H yesterday and as an OT (1tank strategy) i have got some trouble about targeting adds. This is the second time i'm seeing that kind of nameplates and it's pretty nice. So if Aliena or someone could tell us the name of this addon, it would be really helpful


    Thanks for the guide btw!

    edit: seems to be Aloft
    Last edited by Fizčne; 10-31-2009 at 10:58 AM.

  11. #51
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    We are using a Paladin on Anub'arak and Warrior on adds for ToGC10. It could be plausible for the end of phase 3 to have all DPS, including the previous interrupter, on Anub'arak for a burn (we're using the 6 dps, 2 tanks, 2 healers strategy). We'd let the Pally Holy Wrath-stun (and interrupt if necessary) the adds, then warrior tank uses shockwave, and pally again if possible. The designated interrupter will still interrupt at the beginning and throughout Phase 3. We'd get Anub to phase 3, then burn the two adds which are already low from incidental AoE. The warrior-pally rotation of relying on stuns starts at the end of Phase 3 when/if the warrior gets 4 adds, at which point the designated interrupter switches to Anub'arak full-time (that's about 15 seconds worth of stuns - 4 for shockwave, and 10 for holy wrath).

    Question is if we should save hero for Phase 3 right after we kill the set of adds, or should we pop it around 40% in Phase 1 to ensure we do not get another Phase 2, based on your experience?

    Also, from your experience, how low is the first set (how long has it taken you on average to kill) of adds usually when you switch to kill them? I'm thinking everyone switches to the first set of adds in Phase 1 about 5 seconds before 2nd set spawns. When Phase 3 starts, we kill off the set of adds from Phase 1 so the warrior can start fresh with 2 adds, and work his way up to 4 instead of a possible 5 or 6.

    Edit: I made a mistake regarding the cooldown for Shockwave so nevermind that. Can still save Holy Wrath followed by Shockwave for an AoE stun if there are 4 adds on the OT, giving you ~14 seconds to uninterrupted DPS time on boss.
    Last edited by keebz; 10-31-2009 at 06:40 PM.
    Keebzz - Blood Tank | Frost DPS
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  12. #52
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    DK Add Tank

    The 25 man hard-mode video is extremely informative, thank you very much tank spot!

    I noticed that in the video it was mentioned that the encounter has been completed with a DK off tank. With higher mitigation, avoidance, longer IBF and a decent cooldown (unbreakable armor) in addition to acclimation it seems reasonable to consider a DK as an add tank, at least in the 2-add tank situation.

    Is this a viable option at all?

  13. #53
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    I'm wondering the same thing. We have a lack of deathknights in our roster at the moment, with just 1 who is generally an offtank... meaning that if I want him free to deathgrip down a frost ball, he can't be the main tank, he either needs to be dps or an add tank.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by thefiddle View Post
    I noticed that in the video it was mentioned that the encounter has been completed with a DK off tank. With higher mitigation, avoidance, longer IBF and a decent cooldown (unbreakable armor) in addition to acclimation it seems reasonable to consider a DK as an add tank, at least in the 2-add tank situation.

    Is this a viable option at all?
    It's not realistic. It's doable, but the parses we found on worldoflogs for Irae AoD's first completion of the encounter indicate the offtanks taking roughly 550% more autoattack damage than the Premonition offtank. The highest-point spike of damage intake in P3 was roughly 14k dps on the deathknight, compared to about half that on warriors. Individual hits jump from 2k-4k into the 11k-15k range; even if icebound fortitude was permanently active, you'd still be at a disadvantage.

    It's also worth mentioning Irae AoD's later logs all occur using shield-based offtanks, and that the clip shown in the video is using my warrior alt, not my deathknight main (which still does not have credit for the encounter). Consolation prize: unholy deathknights are the highest source of AE damage on the encounter by a fairly high margin.

    -Splug

  15. #55
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    2 Healing p3

    I'm hoping to find a solution to my group's healing problem on p3.

    We are attempting to 2 heal it because our DPS is pretty good, we easily get him to p3 before the 4th burrowers spawn.

    However we keep dying in p3 with only 2 healers, and with 3 healers it jsut seems to take too long and be too messy with adds.

    With 2 healers, how important is it for one to be a paladin? We have an awesome pally healer but were using a disc and druid this time.
    Either play to win, or shut up and lose.

  16. #56
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    so far I've had the pally in my lineup, the ability to big heal and beacon both tanks is pretty amazing. I don't want to say it's a necessity, but pallies make pretty amazing MT healers. if you have the right comp, what you can do is use healing stream totems and vampiric embrace and other small heal effects to make sure players never die to leeching swarm and essentially let everyone except the tanks go to the smallest hp possible, then making sure your healers are very fast at picking up whoever gets hit by penetrating cold.

    Also when you say "we keep dying" who's dying. DPS? if so then it's lack of penetrating cold reaction most likely. Tanks? Then doing the above strategy (if viable) will allow your healers to focus on the tanks more. Healers? I dunno what to say about this one lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Turelliax View Post
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  17. #57
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    I'm not sure I'd let the whole raid drift down to auto-heal range on 10-man, especially if you have two healers. Remember you've got a very short window to counter both penetrating colds, so unless your MT healer can drop off the tanks and save the second penetrating cold victim, you need to keep the raid at ~6k-7k health to buy that extra tick for the raid healer to attend to both PC's. It's a bit easier with a paladin, who can take a GCD to holy shock or holy light one of the PC's when a new set is cast (while still beacon healing the MT), allowing the raid healer to catch up later.

    If you have three healers, then certainly drift down to the totem/VE autoheal range and split the PC's between the two raid healers.

    -Splug

  18. #58
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    Yeah it's definately the penetrating cold that was killing us, and I think our healers just weren't reacting well enough.


    while I have a few knowledgeable people's attention, I am also curious about the burrower strat for p3 when you 1 burrow / 2 heal it.

    We are hitting p3 just when the 4th burrower pair of the fight spawns (getting to 55% or so before the 1st submerge, no bloodlust). Our current strat is to kill those then let the 5th spawn burrow, hoping to kill him before a 6th.

    is this realistic or should we kill each wave of burrowers throughout p3.
    Either play to win, or shut up and lose.

  19. #59
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    is there really only 6 Frost sphere during the fight ? O.o

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cowas View Post
    is there really only 6 Frost sphere during the fight ? O.o
    yes



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