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Thread: Dead while tanking Impaler Heroic TOC10 man

  1. #1
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    Dead while tanking Impaler Heroic TOC10 man

    I'm a t8/t9 warrior tank. My guild was doing Northrend Beast on Heroic mode and I always dies while tanking the Impaler. It seems like I always die due to Staggering Stomp + Impale+ hit. On the other hand, the paladin tank is doing much better.

    Any warrior tanks encountered this?
    Any advice on how to survive P1?

    Here is my armory.
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    Here is my combatlog report shown in worldoflogs.
    World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

  2. #2
    At what number of stacks do you swap tanks? Maybe you need to change it to 2 stacks.

    You can always ask for a shield 1 second before impale. And be sure you have Inspiration up all the fight, and demo/thunder on the boss.
    Follow the Moeko Principle.

  3. #3
    The problem with heroics is the stacking bleed effect lasts longer. You'll reach at least 3 stacks before the stacks on the previous tank falls off.

    Healers need to keep in mind that while a tank is holding a boss getting large hits, they have to sustain both tanks as well as they will have 3 stacks on them almost all of the time.

  4. #4
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    You can swap in such a way that you only have 2 stacks. I was the first tank so I'm not sure on the timing of the first tank swap.

    But after wards taunt when you have under 8 seconds left on impale. And you'll have a brief window where it will drop off before he applies a new stack.

    You'll basically be bleeding the entire time.

    Also, PK after running it, virtually every time I died was to the same combination of stomp/impale application.

    I don't think this was range getting me either, but rather after a while the timer on stomp and impale will sync up. So I started to watch for it and popped a cooldown when he cast stomp around the time for a new impale came.

    In my combat log I saw a 18k stomp followed by a 24k impale within a second. There's not really any way a healer can time a heal inbetween.

    We got past gormok two or three times and worms once with about a 10 second overalap on icehowl's introduction. And we still missed the enrage timer with 23% remaining. This is an increadibly tightly tuned fight.

  5. #5
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    We just used 2 tanks swapping at 4 stacks. The damage is very, very high but you can use pain sup. or GS when u reach 3-4 stacks and use your cooldowns before impales hit (i use my last stand just before the 2nd one hits, then I get pain sup'd after the 3rd and GS once the 4th is applied - both used during the second time i start taking stacks). This is how we finally beat the encounter (using 3 tanks really hurts your chances of killing icehowl before the enrage). I am very well-geared (~51k buffed), and I still got gibbed on a couple attempts while tanking Gormok. Only thing that will help you is using your cooldowns before an impale later in the fight when he's hitting harder. RNG can be nasty on this fight.

    Edit: sry, was talking about 25man
    Last edited by Dragaan; 09-04-2009 at 05:04 AM.

  6. #6
    You can also use 2 tanks with 4 stacks, and in the last minute of the fight, use a couple BOP and you can tank swap at 2 bleeds easily instead of blowing CDs (you can do both tought). That way you don't need to be lucky with the RNG.
    Follow the Moeko Principle.

  7. #7
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    Your paladin is probably being saved by ardent defender. The spike damage is very, very high on Gormok.

  8. #8
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    Are you chaining two armor potions? this can really help with the normal damage intake (I don't know if bleeds are reduced by armor).

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by hamburglar View Post
    your paladin is probably being saved by ardent defender. The spike damage is very, very high on gormok.
    ftw

  10. #10
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    Tried using a more defensive spec 5/10/56 helps alot I think.
    I believe rotating CDs(Shieldwall->Last Stand+Regen->Trinket) helps a lot too. The number of impale is 2 before the OT taunts off. I manage to stay alive in P1 for most of the tries.

    Now comes the problem in P3.......
    Its pretty difficult to run clear of the charge ........
    The boss enarge and 1 shot me

    Any good suggestions?

  11. #11
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    for implae if u have a pally have the Hand of Protection one of the tanks that aren't tanking at the moment to wipe stacks.

    for phase 3... Tank the boss in the middle with every one spread evenly around him.. when he knocks everyone back you should all be spread out and it will be easy to get away,

  12. #12
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    I had the joy of healing this on 10 man heroic last night on my disc priest. We did disc priest holy pally on tanks and a shaman on the raid. For some reason our warrior just got rolled compared to our druid. One attempt he died within 2 seconds from full life.... The BoP thing is very helpful, we generally did this on whomever had the most stacks when worms came out.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by dagimp007 View Post
    for implae if u have a pally have the Hand of Protection one of the tanks that aren't tanking at the moment to wipe stacks.

    for phase 3... Tank the boss in the middle with every one spread evenly around him.. when he knocks everyone back you should all be spread out and it will be easy to get away,
    Thing is, it was rarely the bleed that was killing me. It was the 24k+ impale application immediately after a 18k stomp. I'm wondering if there's some EH minimum that I still need to meet here.

    I buff up to 42k hp, so you can see that basically wipes me out when it happens back to back. I'm currently juggling gear to try to get higher... but I'm just not sure if I can. I ran this with a druid and he was getting smacked pretty hard too, getting instabigged a few times too.

  14. #14
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    I haven't tried this on heroic, so my apologies if this has already been tried and failed.

    I regularly use disarm on this fight to prevent the impales/DoT applications temporarily. If you can time the before the expected 'fatal' stomp, It's like another cooldown.

    I usually use it to be able to taunt off an OT a little early without risking my DoT being re-applied before it falls off.

  15. #15
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    Looking at ur healing line-up i would suggest throwing in a disc/holy priest as they have a few spells that are pure gold in this scenario, shields and a pom bouncing between the tanks can be a life saver.

    The healers you are using from world of logs are primarily reactive healers, ie you lose health they heal you up, whereas this fight is simplified with damage prevention(shields) aswell as instant heals(pom etc).

    But hey im a priest and im biased :P

    and on that point why no priest in ur group ><

  16. #16
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    i've been tanking this along with a pally - or i should say working on it. our best attempt has been 24% on icehowl.

    incoming damage is definitely insane. i have about 47k buffed, and i've died a few times in phase 1 - certainly more often than the pally seems to. i have switched to all of my max stam/armor gear for sure.

    we have a ret pally as well in the group, and our rotation goes like this:
    i pick him up initially, let it stack to 3
    pally tank taunts, ret pally gives me a bubble
    pally tank stacks to three, and i taunt
    pally tank bubbles himself
    i get 2 stacks, pally taunts
    when i have 3 seconds left, i taunt (pally is stacked only to 2)
    repeat that last step until he's dead.

    the bleeds might not be what's killing you, but the 10k ticks sure don't help. btw, don't be afraid to blow your trinkets/last stand/shieldwall in phase 1 if you need it - you don't need them much after he's dead.

  17. #17
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    The Snobolds will happily jump on the tank on Heroic, which I've not seen them do on Normal before. First time we tried on Heroic it was myself and our Warrior and he did, indeed, go down a bit quicker. We taunt on 2 stacks and on the odd occasion it gets higher than two I'll bubble myself or DP the other tank to clear it off. Of course that can only be once each per fight, but it certainly helps.

    We were getting to Not One But Two regularly last night with two Paladins, but by that point the raid seemed to be beginning to struggle and we didn't get much further.

    We tried putting ranged on Snobolds at first but they kept getting interrupted, so we put Melee and the Hunter on the Snobolds which worked slightly better than having everyone on them, but we consistently had the Worms spawn 15 seconds or so before Gordok went down - how are others handling the snobolds? Are you nuking them on sight with everyone, splitting the group, ignoring them or what?



  18. #18
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    We did the first four bosses on heroic 10 man last night -- it was definitely fun. For Northrend Beasts, our two tanks were myself (Prot warrior) and a feral druid. We had one ret pally for emergency BOPs (tried to save it for whichever tank had the highest stacks going into the Jormungars).

    Each tank wound up tanking twice, with the feral druid tanking first. Sometimes he'd have to taunt for the last 5% or so, but mostly it was two full rotations. Remember that he gets a stacking buff that increases his damage as the fight goes on, so whoever is going to be the fourth tank needs to save their big CD (shield wall, in our case).

    We were taking 3stacks, and then taunting around 5 seconds before the next impale. From the tank POV, the major threat is the third impale. Before each impale, I watch my health. As long as I'm 75% or more (or being topped quickly after a hit), I know I will survive an impale / hit combo. Pop shield wall on one, armor trinket on the next, and for the third impale I would always pop a "big" CD -- first time I am tanking, I do last stand + regen just before the impale. The second time I'm tanking (fourth tank), I shield wall the third impale.

    I try not to blow any big CDs on any impale except the third impale in each rotation. If due to some bad luck or slow healing you're at 50% on a first or second incoming impale and have to blow shield wall, you'll have to coordinate with someone in your raid to get you a CD for the third impale (Guardian Spirit, Hand of Sacrifice, Pain Suppression, Divine Sacrifice, whatever you have).

    One thing, from looking at your armory, do you have any Stam / armor / CD trinkets to use for this fight? That can make a big difference.

  19. #19
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    We're having this same problem now. Our problem is that we have 2 resto and 1 disc priest. So only one heal to deal with spike damage. We have also found that the snobolds do not attach themselves to druids in shapeshift form and will not go on the main tank. This means that the disc priest is almost guaranteed to get a snobold lockout.
    "I'm a rage-a-holic! I'm addicted to rageahol!" -Homer Simpson

  20. #20
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    16 wipes tonight and all we got was Icehowl to 16%.

    Gormok's impale lasts 30 secs and he applies it every 10 secs. We rotated (two prot warriors with vigilance on each other) at 2 stacks. The other tank started taunting when my 2nd stack has 22 secs left. I taunted back as soon as mine ran out. This regularly kept a max of 2 stacks on each of us. The timing on this is pretty tight though and we regularly got a 3rd one due to lagspikes. Just keep on with the idea and you'll go back down to 2 stacks.

    Jormungar proved a little more problematic. The acid & fire spews do insane damage. With 60% of the time burning bile & paralytic poison going to tanks, we either ended up tanking them side by side which meant even the slightest mistake in positioning meant both tanks got both spews and melee got owned by the poison cloud (but dps was higher) or we tanked them seperate and ran into the enrage timer.

    Once you get to icehowl the fight becomes simple. Except for the very short enrage timer. With no runspeed boost on daze, the dps window while stunned is really short.

    I guess we need to pull out more dps even though we went in with our best and while they're not world top-10, they can & do regularly put out 5-6K on ulduar10 hardmodes. I'm really at a loss to where to look for more dps.

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