Holding Threat as Warrior!

[WestTi7an]

I've been raiding prot since Burning Crusade, and i've never run into threat problems. For wotlk Ive been in a casual raiding guild trying to progress through Ulduar, and either the dps was low, or smart with omen, because i never had any problems about threat, ever. Recently i got invited as a trial to a very high end raiding guild clearing 25 man Ulduar hard modes. I thought id do fine besides the point Im pretty undergeared for 25 man hard modes, let alone 25 man Ulduar in general.

So i start my first raid, and it goes pretty bad. Dps is pushing the max dps ive ever seen in a raid. Im barely pushing enough threat to get above dps, and usually not even enough without constant taunts. I figured my TPS just plain out sucked, either because of my current gear/spec, or because of how well geared the dps was. They usually have a paladin main tank who is pretty much the best there is. Not only is he skilled, but hes a paladin, so his TPS is easily double the dps'. So I come in and I look like garbage.

Now my question is basically how do i fix this. Its most likely my gear/spec. I have always geared for mitigation so my hp has been low, but recently ive gemmed alot of stamina and enchanted stam enchants, so I could get enough to survive longer. I dont know if its just the whole warrior rage starvation thing, but even when i have max rage and Im spamming every top TPS move in a perfect rotation, I cant do that much.

Ive researched some and have looked at top guilds on other servers (Ensidia, Method, Exodus, etc) and looked at their warrior tanks. I noticed almost all of them is using 2/5 shield specilization. that struck me odd. There missing out on 3% more block, and most of them didnt even have above 16% block, and I always figured below 20% of any mitigation kind of..sucks. But im starting to think ive got this all wrong. I know 3.2 will really boost my dps/tps, but even then If im having problems now, ill have problems in 3.2 and my tps still wont be as good as It could be.

So what im asking you is to maybe give some suggestions. Either straight up tell me your techniques, or armory me and tell me maybe im gemming/enchanting/speccing wrong, because im doign SOMETHING wrong. This wouldnt be such a big deal if it werent for the fact that staying in this top end raiding guild relies on how good my tps is going to be, and if I can show them a large increase in my tps, I think even if its low they will still understand how dedicated I am, and that im not just sitting ignoring the fact that I need to ask for some help.

Right now I can already gaurantee my spec is not the best it could be. I have also never stam stacked, but it seems like Im resorting to it now, and I want it to end. Im also sure part of this tps issue is due to the fact im still in 25 man naxx gear/t7 while the dps is in conquerors and 25m ulduar gear.

[Tankueray]

Block is pretty useless in Uld, especially when going for hardmodes. Bosses are hitting for a better part of a tanks health and the gain from 3% isn't worth the 3 points. You could also use some expertise and hit. Grab the 19 Conquest neck, that'll be a huge upgrade over the one you are wearing on armory. Maybe even grab yourself a Northern Barrier.

Also, imp spell reflect is pretty much useless. Would be better spent on Deep Wounds. The two points "extra" in Shield Special could be tossed into Improved Disciplines, not that that will increase your threat, but your healers will love you for it.

For glyphs, I'd take Cleave over Sunder any day. And perhaps even Shield Wall over Devastate for extra healer lovin'.

There are a few good threads on this site about the priority of ability use.

Sorry if I was vague at any point, a bit tired from work today.

[WestTi7an]

Awesome thanks, ill try and check that out, but im still wondering more about max threat not much about healers liking me

[pright]

First thing I've noticed is you've gone down to Impale in the arms tree but haven't picked up Deep Wounds? This will add a fair bit of threat alone. As mentioned, remove points from spell reflect and 3 from shield spec, fill out Deep Wounds and use the other 2 points in something you'll benefit from more (imp disciplines or even 2/5 cruelty for more threat). Shield Block is undesirable in Ulduar due to the incredibly large hits, which is one of the reasons it's being changed in 3.2.

If your guild runs WWS or similar, have a look at the logs where you are tanking, you may find that you're missing a fair bit due to low expertise/hit which will cause some spikes in threat. Try pick up a bit of expertise/hit gear, I'd start with the helm if you can (for a meta as well), 25man Gothik or 10man Freya drop nice expertise helms.

Make sure that you're using Vigilance on one of the players who ride your arse on the threat meter. Try and use Conc Blow and Shockwave every cooldown as well. For more info on the ideal threat rotation you can check out http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f14/4...-rotation.html

Remove that Sunder Armor glyph, it won't help single target threat in the slightest. Try Vigilance or Shockwave. Devastate and Blocking are fine.

You'll find with Ulduar that you'll want to gear for more Effective Health than ever before, everything hits really hard, and then some, so the more you have the better on most fights. I definitely think your threat will pick up a bit when you get a few more pieces of gear.

[WestTi7an]

Wow thanks a ton pright that makes a lot more sense now. Thank you too Tankueray also. Really glad to see some people helping, ill be trying out the new glyphs/gear/spec and repost in this thread maybe later on this week or so whenever I can determine the change.

[Fayre]

Another big point is to make sure you're absolutely spamming Heroic Strike as much as you can when you're tanking a boss. Take a look at Recount and WWS and try to maximise the strikes that are HS rather than just melee hits. It helps more than you'd think.

[Moosifer]

I have read the comments and advice posted here by everyone, and now i am wondering whether its right to take out the 3 points from shield specs and go for the imp. disciplines. Cause i dont know whether i'll be able to tank naxx25 if i do. I am mainly naxx10 geared and have just started pugging naxx25's ( even though its bloody hard without the HC achie or the Epic achie ). So i dont know whether it'll be worth losing the extra block atm or not. I am asking becasue i dont wanna spend money respeccing all the time, since i will be an OT for uld 10 guild runs (2nd group).

My warrior stats atm are Def = 696 rating
Dodge = 22.56%
Parry = 18.15%
Block = 26.07%
Hit = 65
Exp = 23.
Hp = 28847

I would really appreciate any help with this, because i still NEED to gear up from Naxx25 but dont wanna hamper my progress in Uld.

[Doormat]

Block rating is a very weak stat. 3% of the time you will reduce a hit by about 1.5k? Is that really worth 3 talent points? With those 3 you can greatly increase the threat you output or take better defensive talents. Most warriors stay away from block rating because there are much better stats available