Reply With QuoteTry to NOT charge in. You might just be out of range.
Any particular pulls you are dieing on, the packs of 6 (3 in 10man) after XT can seemingly "oneshot" a tank if you get agro on them all before banishes etc for example.
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Try to NOT charge in. You might just be out of range.
we usually do that pull with a rogue doing tricks + FoK while the tank stands out of LoS.
Heres a quick guide how to pull a boss that way :
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5X-qVvxtMEY&feature=channel_page]YouTube - Boss pull guide[/ame]
As my main is a healer now, I have to agree with this. I know charge has it's benefits, stun, gives rage etc...but I have a warrior tank who doesn't quite understand when and how to use charge. At one point I told him to take it off his hotbar or he was going to die more and more and wipe more groups. He started using the ranged attack, strafe back and charge closer to the group and has been fine ever since.Originally Posted by Aethelas
got to love the safety of death gripAlways in range of healers ^^
Regarding the comments about charging in, I've tanked as a warrior and I've healed main tanks who like to charge and it's never been an issue because the healers know about the charge, so they stand relatively close to the tank before the pull so the tank never leaves the healer's range, and the tank never charges unless he sees a healer positioned correctly for it.
For healers, it takes some getting used to it. In my guild healers were used to my charging, and when I switched to tanking with my DK I started using Death Grip instead of charging, and my healers were all "WTF stop tanking right on top of us" because they were used to my charging. It all boils down to communication: make sure your healers know you're charging in, and make sure they are prepared before you do it.
@ OP
I just ran through your achievements, I'm guessing you're the Steelbreaker tank.
Yes, he hits *that* hard.
Or the usual Steelbreaker tank is a pally who cleanses himself after Fusion Punch... and the healers don't realize you can't do that yourself?
How much over 40k? from my experience if you're tanking UD25 and you've got 40k health or less thats a major problem right there.
Health in UD is just as important as avoidance, because chances are on a fight you won't avoid two or three hits in a row, this means pressure on healers that you can help alleviate this by pushing your health higher.
Think about this, we run a number of tanks on our runs and the ones with less than 40k health die quickly and often. Those around the 45k+ mark are usually the ones left fighting the boss because they give healers a 2-3 sec worth of healing headroom.
Boss hits for 20k twice on a tank with 40k or less in a time space of no longer than 4 to 6 secs (thats pretty normal in UD25, they may hit less because of block but then you're back to RNG.. much like avoidance) and that tank will die because his survivability is 6 secs max without heals.
A tank with 40k+ will need to be hit three times to die, giving the healers 6-9 secs to land their big 2.5 - 3 sec heals (most will be spamming their biggest because they know the boss hits hard).. by adding more health they have more space to make timing mistakes.. which happens.
My tank is a DK so while I don't have block as an extra mitigation stat and learnt about health the hard way.
One way to push hit points is to take up mining/JC to get those stats up.
I have some room to add more HP.
IF/When I use charge, I'll use Heroic Throw to pull, back up, THEN charge. Two of the deaths were on Razorscale (no data ..I'll get it next weekend if needed), as soon as she broke free I taunted and immediately went into my rotation, SB/SS/TC..etc, I don't think I even got the TC off before i was down.
Edit: found out what steelbreaker is...we haven't done iron council on 25m yet but yes, I'm normally the SB tank in 10m..he's a cakewalk...
Last edited by Sasha; 05-12-2009 at 07:29 AM. Reason: realized what steelbreak was.. :)
Be warned, he does A LOT more damage in 25 man.
Typically before charging in, I'll have healers HoT me up, this usually helps with damage. But I can't say that I've ever had a problem getting 1-2 shotted. However, the trash before Ignis & Hodir... *shudder* They can be nasty if your healers aren't prepared.
Steelbreaker won't be a problem for you if your cleansers are onto it, the real fun pull is crazy cat lady.. it's alot easier now but we had real fun pre-nerf, basically sacrificing a pally just to get the adds onto their tanks was the easiest way to do it.
Now the adds can be tanked 2 at a time at least.
Having a healer as my main and a war tank as our MT for the most part in our guild I would say that usally the reason he dies is he out ranges us. We are really good about making sure he is bubled and hotted with a POM and everything, but he doesnt communicate well and likes to charge head long into stuff with out back-up. Communication is the key for any end game raids trust me
From the sounds of it you have a guild full of reactive healers. They wait to see damage...like they did in naxx..... then they cast a heal to heal it. Unfortunately for you, you've already taken the next hit and are now dead.
I had the same problems with my guild when we first went into UD25. It got to the point where I had to read out from the combat log after each death so everyone in the raid could see how much damage I was taking and how little healing I was getting before I'd die.
Once they got used to how much damage a tank can take we've had no problems with the tanks dieing unless something weird happens..... now if we could only get the dps to stop standing in things
So next time make sure you have time stamps on and check your combat log after each death. If the heals aren't there then nothing you do will help.
I would guess it is one of two things going on. From my personal exp. in 25m Ulduar, even with 40k buffed health, and around 28k buffed armor I still take 20K+ hits from every boss I have tanked thus far. So unless my healers are on top of their game I have gone down in a matter of sec's. after a pull. This is not due to a range problem so much as my lower healh is making me less viable then some of the other tanks. Which may be the case for you. Also the other thing could be your healers as was mentioned dont heal till they see dmg. Which is bad in Ulduar. By the time they see dmg and react the tank is useally down. Other then that and without a raid log or such it is hard to say much more.
Heh, we were having the same problem but on Ignas the Furnace Master with our protection paladin (first person who picked him up as soon as he landed), he's rocking around 38k health, full soft defense cap, pretty nice gear, one shotted after the 1st stack of his debuff. Sadly, it was kind of funny because our furry (with a lack of a tank) was holding off with 4 stacks for over 20 seconds.
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