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Thread: Warrior vs. Rogue

  1. #1
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    Warrior vs. Rogue

    Pre-WotLK rogues were free HKs.

    Now I almost always die before I regain control of my character, assuming the rogue is equally geared.

    When should I trinket, and what should I generally be doing in a 1v1 assuming the rogue gets the jump on me?

  2. #2
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    Are rogues stunlocking you?

    Thanks to Glyph of Cloak of Shadows + Feint we reduce Bladestorms damage by 90% but I'm still very unlucky with the MS crits even with Evasion up.

  3. #3
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    save trinket for the blind don't want them to restealth do you? try using a fear+disarm combo if he got evasion up after kidney fades, get rend and harmstring up. shield block is awsome to reduce damage and prevent rapture a new kidney for example.
    Although prepared for martyrdom, I preferred that it be postponed.
    Sir Winston Churchill

  4. #4
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    I usually don't blind a warrior in a duel. A Vanish > Cheap Shot does the trick.

    A blind would most likely be wasted as you put Rupture on a warrior so with the bleeding effect on my target the blind would break immediately.

  5. #5
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    If you know a rogue is coming go 1h and shield to help mitigate the opener. Also you can try and get a demo shout to unstealth them. As if you spec for it, you can get a pretty big AoE Demo Shout. But 1v1 you gotta survive the opener and try and get a disarm up and bleed up on him at all times. Also I like try force their cooldowns early so I try and get a bladestorm up soon, then after follow up with my WG AP on use trinket into a Charge MS crit to really get him scared. But either way a good rogue is very hard to beat.

  6. #6
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    Your 5 minute CD's are also very useful.

  7. #7
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    I'm very curious to know the secret here too. It seems impossible to me, IF and I mean IF I'm lucky enough to survive the opener, I get dismantled. GG can't really do anything so I blow my fear, they trinket, and dominate me.

    How am I honestly supposed to counter that?

    25k hp unbuffed
    600 res

  8. #8
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    I just smack up my shield and use shield block with 5K crits on shield slam and revenge: D

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucinam View Post
    I'm very curious to know the secret here too. It seems impossible to me, IF and I mean IF I'm lucky enough to survive the opener, I get dismantled. GG can't really do anything so I blow my fear, they trinket, and dominate me.

    How am I honestly supposed to counter that?

    25k hp unbuffed
    600 res
    The following is based off of an arms spec, and not a prot spec just to be clear

    To be perfectly honest a good rogue will not lose to you. They have the abilities and assuming equal gear, everything they need to tear you in half. With that being said there are a FEW things you can do to help against one.

    If you know he is coming, try to demo shout him out, just getting an eye on that sucker and a charge before he can open you up with make a HUGE difference. Just so you know... a good rogue wont let this happen to him.

    Start off with your sword and board equipped in defensive stance. When he opens on you start spamming your shield block and fear asap. He wont be affected by the fear if he is worth his weight and it wont slow him down for a minute, but it will force him to use SOME kind of cooldown, and that is a start.

    When the stuns start wearing down, try to face him and pop your enraged regen. With your front towards him you can immediately reduce damage incoming and a shield wall here will help alot if it is up.

    He is going to tailor off on his damage so you want to get a bleed up on him, preferably a rend for the duration and the overpower proc, and then switch back to battle. You cant stay turtled the entire encounter or he will out damage you.

    In battle stance, overpower is your best friend. It will force the pressure off of you and hitting your Retaliation will also come in very handy. I strongly recommend you do not use your bladestorm here as he will completely tank it while killing you. You want to move back from him and have him move back from you so you can charge, this gets you a quick stun on him and a possible MS crit.

    With this in place, you are DANGEROUSLY low on health, but he is on the back foot. If he blinds, trinket now, if he trys to run, swap stances and intercept. What you ultimately want to do is get him to burn his cooldowns and get his back to you so you can bladestorm him unexpectedly.

    If you manage to get a peircing howl off or a hamstring even, then a bladestorm to his back after you charge stun him will definitely do damage and perhaps kill him. Realistically however, you wont get past the first 2 paragraphs of this, because your face will be thrown against the wall and spit on. Rogues hurt, bring friends.
    "If I'm doing a fight and I need more threat... I try harder. If I'm doing a fight and I need my taunts not to miss, then I wear hit." -Veneretio

  10. #10
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    So basically you need your 5min CDs to kill a rogue, assuming you even get to use them.

    Argh.

  11. #11
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    No one said PvP would be easy. You have to use what you have available to get through the situation. We have those CDs so we can face a rogue so don't look at it as a bad thing. A good rogue has to do a lot to keep people in CC and keeping the momentum in their favor.

  12. #12
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    if you know you're up against a rogue put on your shield and go into defensive stance. there's no reason not to. You become immensely harder to kill and if you're arm spec'd everytime you dodge/parry/block one of his hits, you're gonna revenge his day-lights out. debuff him with tclap/demo shout to further your survivability. and trinket out of his 2nd stun. if he blinds you and you don't have a trinket, no big deal unless he did it to survive a hit. keep him rended, and profit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Turelliax View Post
    I will never be a kaz.. no one can reach the utter awesomeness of you.
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  13. #13
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    Kaz said to trinket the second stun - is this something you do only 1v1? What is the significance of the second stun (as opposed to the first or third?) I realize that blind breaks on damage but in 2v2 eating a 10 second blind = GG.

    Don't rogue stuns vary in length based on how many combo points they had when they used it? I need to figure out a way to make your stun timer big and obvious - trinketing a 1-2 second stun would be a waste.

  14. #14
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    It doesn't really matter which one you break out of really, it's just the second one I like to break out of because by then he's gained more combo points on me, and if i break out and spin around and dodge his finishing move, i've just wasted a ton of his time, as opposed to breaking the first one and not having him waste a lot of energy/combo points on me yet. I will admit in arenas with my healing partner I never trinket out of those unless i'm really on the brink of death, I always try to save it for blind because if he blinds me and then goes to town on my healer for 10 straight seconds, followed by a sap becuase i'm not out of combat, it's gg for us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Turelliax View Post
    I will never be a kaz.. no one can reach the utter awesomeness of you.
    http://i.imgur.com/3vbQi.gif

  15. #15
    Unfortunately, a half decent rogue will not lose to a warrior unless you're lucky enough to break him from stealth. It's as simple as that.

  16. #16
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    I dueld a rogue last night. i have 28k unbuff. We dueld about 3 times.. What a warrior needs to do.. is once ur able to use a Shockwave, or some other stun attack. then when that is about over you need to hit him with shield bash... Then you just make sure ur hitting the rouge.. I only killed the rouge "1" time so thats not bad.. 33% chance ha..

  17. #17
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    Next time I see a rogue I'll just respec prot :P

  18. #18
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    Unfortunately, a half decent rogue will not lose to a warrior unless you're lucky enough to break him from stealth. It's as simple as that.
    and
    Next time I see a rogue I'll just respec prot :P
    unless the rogue is REALLY REALLY good they can't beat a prot warrior with decent gear.
    I was in Wintergrasp fishing last night and got jumped by 2 belf rogues. long story short....The rogues didnt make it. and I had my cloth fishing hat on.

  19. #19
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    Ok, if I see a rogue coming and I'm arms, pop my shield and 1h on and switch to defensive stance, no problem. Question - would THIS be an appropriate place to use Broken Promise? As Kaz mentioned, revenges should be coming fast and furious, and with Broken Promise's higher top end you'd likely hurt more than putting on Last Laugh. Rage generation probably isn't an issue considering the incoming damage the rogue is dealing, so...

    TL;DR version: Broken Promise vs Last Laugh for shield macro as arms?

    Quote Originally Posted by Turelliax View Post
    people don't know how to keep it in their pants for a little bit before exploding all over my face.

  20. #20
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    /agree

    Being prot will ruin a rogue's day. Damage Shield will still hit him, even if you're stunned and he is behind you. Warbringer also helps so you can charge him in D stance. I usually reciprocate his stunlock with a Concussion Blow, some sort of bleed, then a shockwave. Once he's back to running around, keeping sheild block up will keep the revenges coming. I just blast on rogues as if they were bosses: Devastates, TCs, stuns whenever they are up. The good thing about being prot is the rogue does most of the damage to himself. Never tried retaliation, but that's an awesome idea =)

    Now, besting a rogue when arms spec... I have no solution there =)

    - Ty

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