Frost Build Advice

[Tav]

Hey all,

I'm a loooongggg time warrior tank, but to give our guild some tank diversity, have been working (slowly) on a DK tank. He hit 80 a few days ago and has some decent gear. All epics are welfare, now...

I'm curious as to this frost build. I know things will change a lot in 3.1, but what do you think of the build below? I'd like to be a tank able to do basic aoe threat and still do decent single-target threat. I realize Runic Strike is a key to the single target threat, but what about the below build?

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Thanks for the help!

Tav

[Satorri]

Looks quite solid to me. I'd recommend dropping Merciless Combat and Hungering Cold for Acclimation, though. I've enumerated in other posts, I generally find Merciless Combat a little weak for buffing tanking (small boost of threat in the end of a boss fights, trash dies to quickly you won't notice), and Hungering Cold is nice, though it's applications tend to be limited with the amount of aoe that gets thrown around. Acclimation for 3 pts can be very nice in any situation with spell dmg and huge value on fights with constant spell dmg like Sapph.

You could just as easily spend the pts elsewhere as well, like finishing Virulence which is nice for Frost threat for sure.

You're dead on, on all counts above. RS is great single target threat, and your spec should be quite solid on single target threat with better than baseline AoE threat. Also, with 3.1 this build will change significantly. I think Frost is really fairing quite well with the changes though. It's keeping the heaviest survival ability and the new talent positions work well for sharp specs with fun toys.

[Tav]

Thanks, Satorri; I appreciate the help. When I actually spec'd, I didn't take hungering cold, and I took the point there and a point from Virulence and went with 2/2 Epidemic. I'm not sure if the points would have been better spend in Virulence, though. I'm thinking a lot about dropping the points entirely, and MC, and going for Acclimation. Any thoughts on Virulence vs. Epidemic?

Either way, the spec is great. I have reliable aoe threat, nice single target threat, and I'm really enjoying the DK. Having abilities like Rune Strike macro'd into everything is nice, although a drastic change from warrior tanking. I used to chide the warriors in my guild that would macro HS into their abilities; whole new world with DK tanking.

Thanks, again. The spec/running is going great.

Tav

[Satorri]

Virulence vs Epidemic is not entirely fair, since they aren't the same application, but...

For Frost I tend to give Epidemic a lesser value since I reapply diseases more frequently, IT is a solid hit as frost. For Unholy I wouldn't spec without it, and for Blood I usually feel the same. Even with the upcoming duration changes...

Virulence is good, to be sure, though I tend to put it lower on importance in my tanking builds. We have a double standard on hit. The 8% softcap is only half the picture for us, since our spells have the higher miss chance. That said, the spells that really feel that are IT, HB, DC, and BB. Really, what this says to me is it's more valuable for Frost, but not 100% essential. The other thing is, soft-capping hit for raid bosses puts you completely hit capped on everything but raid bosses for spells as well (6%), the miss chance only jumps on bosses and IFF/Misery help cut that miss chance by 3% further. I take it for threat improvement, but I often trade it for a more universal tanking buff/mechanic.

[NexsusTheFrostDeathKnight]

Seems like a basic build. however in my opinion:
I don't think annihilation is worth it, you have howling blast, which from my perspective is obliterates replacement, and then some.

Frost strike/rune strike I find is the main tab target attack I use, as I wait for killing machine to proc and let loose another howling blast.
You didn't pick up icy talons either...so I don't know how long you intend to wait for killing machine to proc.
I'd reccomend getting virulence 3/3, or points into extra disease time, get icy talons so you can see killing machine and ditch obliterate.

[Satorri]

Oblit is not replaced by Howling Blast, doubly so in 3.1, unless you're dual wielding. Beyond that the 3% melee crit is a small but pleasant buff for RS/FS/BS/OB and even PS, moreso again next patch.


And Icy Talons/Imp Icy Talons is a matter of whether or not you have a shaman in your group dropping Windfury (imp Windfury is actually better).

[Kazeyonoma]

Please read the posting rules located in my signature and at the top of every forum, or just the descriptions of each forum before posting new threads in the future.

Anything that includes an armory link or talent suggestions belong in the HALP! Armory ... forum.

Moved.

[Omoh]

Thanks, Satorri; I appreciate the help. When I actually spec'd, I didn't take hungering cold, and I took the point there and a point from Virulence and went with 2/2 Epidemic. I'm not sure if the points would have been better spend in Virulence, though. I'm thinking a lot about dropping the points entirely, and MC, and going for Acclimation. Any thoughts on Virulence vs. Epidemic?

Either way, the spec is great. I have reliable aoe threat, nice single target threat, and I'm really enjoying the DK. Having abilities like Rune Strike macro'd into everything is nice, although a drastic change from warrior tanking. I used to chide the warriors in my guild that would macro HS into their abilities; whole new world with DK tanking.

Thanks, again. The spec/running is going great.

Tav

Acclimation is probably one of the worst ways you can spend those talents my friend. The person who suggested it probably doesn't know what they're talking about.

Annihilation is also useless. The only time Oblit will replace HB currently, is when the target is immune to frost damage. My HB trumps my Oblit all the time, and i've got Jawbone.

Merciless Combat is probably one of the more desirable talents. Why? Staying ahead on threat when the warriors start to spam execute is a very good thing.

Virulence is nice, but not really needed, the talents can be better spend elsewhere. The only thing I agree with is epidemic being rather useless as well. You're constantly putting your diseases back up, so unless it's an AoE sort've thing, it's not going to matter much.

See my spec for a good frost build.

[Grifieth]

actually, if u read all the forums here, pretty much alot of talents are more to the style of the person who plays. that said, i just wanted to throw in there as some advice, that with my spec Ob actually dosent do as much dmg as HB but does more threat ,idk i have been watching my threat meters on that, but i got the spec and glyphs and so forth a lil crazy when i realized it. another thing, alot of people put down hungering cold, but its actually very helpful in quite a few situations, ex. goth adds, noth's adds, grand widow adds, just to name a few of the situations. Its very helpful as a OT, but as a MT its mroe along the lines of Eh if ur alrdy done with heroics. but other than that looks like a good build, hope it works out for ya =].