Suggestion for tanking topic #5 ??

[Xav]

Now you know why we don't have the forum public.

[Kalbitang]

When I say that Xav and Co caused a great deal of these Deathknight nerfs, I mean it. Look at the tanking topics. None of them deal with how to make the tanks seperate but equal.

I think the original thread on the PTR forums had a DK from Xav's guild posting. They were just trying to put unbiased info out there. They had good players from each tanking class give their feedback. I think the Pally even admitted to missing a cooldown or something. They could have done more testing, etc, but they are players after all, not QA.

Certainly there are people out there trying to nerf other classes, but there are also lots of players out there trying to be genuinely helpful.

[Tonylicious]

It was the slanted posts by Xav and Co that caused Deathknights to have every single one of their tanking cooldowns nerfed. It also caused every single tanking specific talent, with the exception of one, to be nerfed as well.

For the sake of balance, would Xav re-run those tests to see how those changes have affected the classes?
Edit: I'm not saying DK's didn't need to be nerfed. They did, but, these changes I feel were a bit overboard.

I'm gonna go ahead and say that it seems unlikely that they would. It takes a great deal of effort, Xav wasn't sure after his first test if he could even convince them to go back for the second round of testing his guild did.

[Roana]

There were several changes made in the PTR, which, were quickly changed again. To say that Vivendi is unwilling or unable to make quick code changes is not true. They have done it in the past, and will continue to do so in the future. They listen to whine posts as well. How else do you think Brew of the Year, The Love Fool, Gheto-hearthing, 30m Hearthstones were changed? It wasn't because Blizzard has simply been working on the code. All of those changes came as the result of whine-fest posts on Blizzards forums.

No, not really.

Nobody is saying that Blizzard doesn't listen to what players say. However, they will not change anything unless and until they convince themselves that there is indeed a problem in need of fixing (and of a high enough priority to set resources aside for) and that their solution is indeed an improvement. Loud and excessive whining does not buy you anything: if anything, it will predispose Blizzard developers against your position, because chances are (as Ghostcrawler put it repeatedly) is that you are doing it for ulterior motives and not because you're interested in making the game better.

In short, you can bring a problem to Blizzard's attention; you cannot force them to actually make a corresponding change, and constant whining is the least effective tool to get anything accomplished and may actually hurt your chances of getting the change implemented. Blizzard isn't stupid: they can tell the difference between lobbying and rational analysis. They know that people are just trying to "work the refs".

[brain9h]

I think this thread is a fail. Started with a hijack attempt on topic #5 and has turned into people washing clothes about latest changes

[jere]

There were several changes made in the PTR, which, were quickly changed again. To say that Vivendi is unwilling or unable to make quick code changes is not true. They have done it in the past, and will continue to do so in the future. They listen to whine posts as well. How else do you think Brew of the Year, The Love Fool, Gheto-hearthing, 30m Hearthstones were changed? It wasn't because Blizzard has simply been working on the code. All of those changes came as the result of whine-fest posts on Blizzards forums.

Think about the time frame of those changes you listed. None of those were 2 day period changes. No one said they weren't willing or unable to make quick code changes, but you have to understand that "quick" means something a lot different in their world than it does ours. They couldn't possibly get all of those changes made, internally tested, packaged, and then go through the normal business checks in two days. The red tape alone takes forever, much less the actual development and testing time. Also, GC and the crew have always said that they don't only listen to player posts, because they could be biased, so they take them with a grain of salt. In otherwords, regardless if Xav had posted that topic, those nerfs would have happened.

[Hengist]

I am definitely sure that Premonition's druids and death knights were scheming with Xav to make warrior the supreme tank. That makes perfect sense.

[Ciderhelm]

People are welcome to believe what they want. However, if you want to continue this discussion, please do so on the World of Warcraft forums where we don't have to see it.