An OT/MT needs som advice!
Im the ot/mt in my guild even the GM RL and ML so i have a lot on my plate. To day some ppl started to talk bout different stats such as hit crit expertise etc and one dps warrior lol:ed at me when i said expertise was a rather importend stat to stack at least for me as tank. He lol:ed agian and said expertise was useless for both tanks and dps. Now here´s the deal. I been checking my toon at that be.imba site and it allways stated that i lacked both hit and expertise. So i regemed and re enchanted my gear to get more hit and expertise. So my question is basicly should i contine to stack expertise?
Pls check my armory to c what gear etc I have and let me know if i have gemed wrong etc.
The World of Warcraft Armory
I wouldn't. Not sure about warriors specifically, but Expertise reduces the targets chance to dodge/parry, and hit reduces the chance you will miss your target.
Paladin tanks don't need much hit as we do a lot of spell damage. I don't think you should really have to worry about either stat unless you find yourself having issues generating rage or threat. It would probably be more useful to gem and enchant for more avoidence or mitigation stats over those two.
Worst thing you could do is listen to a DPS warr who does not know how to play his role. He's a Melee DPS, he should know better!!! As are Warrior Tanks, so YES Hit and Expertise are very important aggro stats!
So, in essence you are on the right track. But there are the soft caps to consider. Dodge soft cap for expertise is around 25-26 (last I read), which you are at currently. Your next concern should be your Hit. Go for the 8% (260ish). Then your looking good, then back to expertise where you can get it. You will notice it in your Threat and Dps. Of Course, this is all good as long as your not sacrificing your EH and other tanking stats.
Pally's should stick to Pally related questions as I will stick with warrior related questions :P
Please read the posting rules in my sig and at the top of every forum before you make a new thread.
Any thread that has your Armory linked with very few exceptions, should probably belong in the armory and talents suggestion forum.
You need spell hit, which has a higher cap than melee hit. Not sure what glyphs/talents pallies have to increase their hit. But they definitely need it.
Originally Posted by solocommand
Any melee dps who doesn't know what expertise is for doesn't know his class plain and simple. On a raid boss the dodge change is ~6.5% the miss chance is 8%. If you cap hit you've only gone about half way in your quest to land all your hits. For tanks, there's also the parry chance which you want to avoid.
Once you meet the survivability requirements of an encounter it's appropriate to focus on hit/expertise. These two stats will do *more* than any other to raise your threat. It might even be the case where you can't do enough threat to allow dps to beat a really tough enrage timer and you'll have to focus on threat before you're fulling comfortable with your survivability. But that's a big part of tanking, balancing your stats to get the job done.
Looking at your toon, you've got plenty of hit but are still under the expertise soft cap (26). That should be your first priority. After you get 26 expertise, do some research on the benefits of expertise and hit and decide for yourself which stat to stack (some will say exp, some will say hit, some will say just balance them out).
As stated above, this person who thinks expertise is uselss for melee DPS and tanks is an idiot, plain and simple. You're doing fine with the amount of hit and expertise you have - it could be higher but you have a nice balance which is good.
The other thing worth mentioning is that, while yes Hit and Expertise have great value as TPS talents (and in this light their value can easily be underestimated given how few fights these days present TPS issues), their value in burst threat simply cannot be overstated.
That's threat resets, add spawns, all those times when you need threat and you need it NOW, a bit more expertise/hit can mean the difference between the mob sticking to you like glue or wondering what those whoosing sounds are while munching on your healer's limbs.
Hit and Expertise certainly have their place. While I wouldn't gimp your other stats stacking them they're certainly an important stat. Hit helps you... well... hit. Expertise prevents parry and dodge from bosses. This increases your DPS by making more attacks hit, and reduces parry-haste attacks, reducing your damage accordingly.
As a tank both of these are useful. More DPS is more TPS, and missing shield slams, taunts, mocking blows, etc, can be... unfortunate. I wouldn't ever massively stack hit or expertise, but as your gear improves so should your hit/expertise. Capping it is good, but probably not a priority.
That's as a tank.
As a DPS, your "friend" is an idiot. Every miss is DPS wasted, rage lost. Parry isn't a factor as fury warrior would most likely be behind, but dodge certainly is. Capping hit and expertise should be very high on a dps warrior's priorities. The difference between "lolwhatever" and capped Hit Rating can be as much as a 30% improvement in DPS. Or so I've read. It's been a long time since I DPSed as Fury.
be.imba.hu is certainly a useful site, but it assumes you have infinite stats to just pour into any of its defined holes.
Upgrade what you can and when you can, Hit and Expertise will come with time. Maybe throw the enchant on your gloves, grab a gem when you've got a free slot, etc.
You should not stack for hit/expertise, however with current gear in game you can get close enough to where an enchant or two and a gem or two can get you to the caps which means both more dps and tps
Honestly looking at your toon I'd say you almost went a little overboard with the hit/exp..
You lack hit points in a big way.
In a red slot you could put exp/stam but in all other slots I'd almost put strait up stam gems.
Toss stam on your bracers
All in all I guess its not horrible but you wont be a OT on patch and personaly I'd think it would be a little scary.. you have good avoidence but lower hps for your gear level.
Would also try and pickup Essence of Gossamer from heroic Azjol and replace your dodge trinket with it.
But ya that warrior who told you hit/exp is useless for tanks is a terd and knows nothing about threat generation.
IMO, this is just plain wrong. I have 100 HR (3.05%), 0 from gear. I have yet to have a problem with missing. I say this from a threat standpoint, not a DPS standpoint. I am also expertise softcapped from gear, I don't consider anything beyond this a useful stat to stack.
Originally Posted by Muffin Man
This is the point I was trying to make, and perhaps I went about it the wrong way. Hit and Expertise both have their benefits, but not to the extent that you should sacrifice other needed stats to cap them out. Someone posted somewhere that the biggest part of being a tank is finding what works for you, and balancing your character to work best for yourself and for your raid. So, feel free to ignore me if you like, just trying to help
Originally Posted by Whitegold
Originally Posted by Salloman
Okay.. thank you all for your thoughts and inputs.. my guild have just died so soon im in need of a new guild so atm I cba with dealing with my gems etc.. but when I do ill take ur inputs in consideration when i regem and/or reenchants my gear... Thx agian all!