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Thread: Good raid leading: knowledge of other classes

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
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    Houston, TX
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    Dear gods this is going to be massive. I do pride myself in being conversant in all classes and specs so let me just throw out some things from different classes that we use to be successful at raiding that may not be used as often as it should be.

    mages: Spellsteal is huge, it is amazing how many buffs they can ninja.
    Shamans: grounding totem on caster bosses can make a huge difference.
    warlocks: for affliction, using the doomguard and infernal on high dps encounters is very important.
    rogues: tricks of the trade can be used on the DPS as well, just make sure the tank has a good aggro lead.
    paladins: hand of salvation, hand of sacrifice. Both are very awesome.

  2. #22
    Got unexpectedly busy at work so the prot section is not even finished, will polish off prot and some quick outlines for you on holy/ret tonight. Figured iw ould save you some research as i really liek the direction this thread could take!
    Paladins


    Retribution


    (Detailed description coming soon.)


    Holy


    (Detailed description coming soon.)


    Protection


    Making pulls:
    • Avenger's Shield-Ranged attack that causes a high amount of threat, can bounce and hit up to 2 additioal targets
    • Exocism- Ranged attack currently only usable against undead or demons (come 3.1 usuable against all, but automatically crits undead/demons)
    • Judgement-Juding places a buff or debuff on the target (not going to go into each and every one)
    • Consecration- the run in method when pulling quickly you may not have another way to pull other than run in consecrate then use Hammer of the Righteous which can hit up to 3 targets
    Buffs:
    • Blessing of Sanctuary-Reduces incoming damage by 3% and you generate runic power, rage, or mana anyt iem to block, parry or dodge an attack (currently being changed for 3.1)
    • Blessing of Kings- must be spec'd into, generally have a ret paladin do so as they have quite a few more points to "dump" than we do. Increases all stats by 10% however without a reliable ret pally this is a must have raid buff
    • Wisdom/Might-prot pally should never do, Sanctuary/kings are much more important
    Interrupts:
    • Hammer of Justice-stuns the target and interrupts spell casting, usable evn on bosses will not stun but can interrupt 60 sec CD unless spec'd into
    Immunity/related:

    • Divine Shield-makes you invulnerable for 12 secs (15 with 4 pc) aggro drop. Situational usefullness, if spec'd into Divine Gaurdian it can transfer 30% of the raids damage to you.
    Regaining aggro:
    • Rigtheous Defense-must target the friendly player, will redirect up to 3 targets to you
    • Hand of Reckoning- Causes the target to attack you and causes holy damage 8 seconds CD
    • Hand of Salvation-not so much to regain aggro but reduces targets threat by 2% every seconds for 10 seconds, situationally useful as a proactive taunt (i.e. warlocks on maly vortex)
    Debuffs/reducing damage taken by the tank:
    • Judgements of the Just- 2 point talent, must have your judgements reduce the melee attack speed of the target by 10/20%
    • Holy Shield-Increases chance to block by 30% 10 second duration 8 seconds CD should have 100% uptime
    • Libram of Obstruction-your judgements increase your block value by 352 for 5 seconds (15 emblem of heroism)
    • Ardent Defender-when under 35% health reduces dmg taken by 5/12/18/24/30%
    Self-healing
    • Lay on Hands- heals a target to an amount equal to the paladins maximum health
    • Flash of Light
    • Holy Light
    Survivability/cooldowns:
    • Divine Protection-Reduces damage taken by 50% for 12 secs, with the 4 pc t7 bonus increase it by another 3 seconds. Causes forbearance
    Multiple mob tanking:
    • Avenger's Shield- can bounce to 2 additional targets
    • Hammer of the Righteous- Will strike your target and 2 additional nearby targets causing 4x your weapons DPS as holy damage
    • Consecration-Aoe dot effect cause hoyl damage to any who enter the area
    Last edited by Exiledknight; 03-30-2009 at 04:29 PM.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
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    14
    Thanks for the responses, and apologies for the lack of updates. I've been fairly busy with RL stuff but I intend to update the relevant sections during the week - and also research some more stuff to put up.

    Big thanks to Exiledknight for the Paladin info!

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
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    10
    Quote Originally Posted by Juzh View Post
    Hi all,


    So, what I want to know is: what are some of the things that an exceptional raid leader might know about each class?
    It takes time to absorb it all, especially if you are just started out, but quite frankly the answer is everything.

  5. #25
    Juzh, you are easily my new hero :P

    I've had my guild for almost 7 months now and I've been slowly converting it from a leveling guild to a raiding guild with many bumps and false starts. The guildies have always been my main source of information regarding their classes and due to my lack of knowledge of classes (other than holy priest!) I feel incompetent to lead the raids, even though I've really enjoyed the bits that I do. Currently I depend on 2 officers to provide me with information about classes and related gear. While I'll continue to deligate raid captain duties to them, I will always strive to obtain more knowledge on classes and their abilities in raids and how best to apply certains roles to certain classes in certain situations.

    And what better place to find a brief summary of abilities in one place than right here.

    Thank you for this.

  6. #26
    Juzh, can I have your permission to use your content here on my own forum? I will add a link referring back to this thread.

    I find people like to read most things in one place and not need to have to jump between different forums. Anything to keep the guys reading at least SOMETHING of use.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    24
    I don't think it's necessary for you as a guild/raid leader to know everything about another class, but if you know you don't know very much about other classes, surround yourself with officers who do know, that's what class leaders are for.

    If you don't know who's the best for the job, you could probably have a meeting with the members of a particular class and talk about it with them, they could probably tell you who they think is the most knowledgeable amongst them.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
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    Mages:



    Buff / Debuff:

    Arcane Intellect (Buff): Inreases the target Intellect by 60 points. The raid wide version it's called Arcane Brillance and requires Arcane Powder. This does not stack with Fel Intelligence even that it provides les intellect (because of the spirit buff)

    Focus Magic (Buff): Increases the target's chance to critically hit with spells by 3%. When the target critically hits the caster's chance to critically hit with spells is increased. You need to invest 11p in the Arcane tree to obtain this. If you have 2 mages with this is is DPS wise to exchange Focus Magic between them. This only affects Casters!

    Enduring Winter (Buff): Requires 40 points in the frost tree and having the talent "Summon Water Elemental". It haves 3 ranks. your Frostbolt spell has a 33/66/100% chance to grant the Replenishment effect to up to 10 party or raid members mana regeneration equal to 0.25% of their maximum mana per second for 15 sec.

    Improved Scorch (Debuff)
    : Increases the raid chance to critically hit with spells by 1% and stacks up to 5 times, each time the mage cast a scorch on the target one stack of the debuff is applied. With the glyph it only need to be casted 1 time to apply the 5 stacks (The mage need to spend 16 points in the fire tree to improve the Scorch spell and give this effect)

    Winter's chill (Debuff): The frost version of Improved Scorch, it works a bit different. This talent have 3 ranks increasing the and each time a frost spell lands on the target there is a 33/66/100% chance to apply one stack (Stacks 5 times too) increasing 1% crit each stack.


    Threath reduction:

    Each tree has it's own talent to reduce threat caused.

    Arcane Subtlety: Reduce up to 40% of arcane threat
    Burning Soul: Reduce up to 10% of fire threat
    Frost Channeling: Reduce up to 10% of frost threat


    Aditionally, there are 2 abilities to dump aggro.

    Invisibility: Fades the caster to invisibility over 3 sec, reducing threat each second. If the mage recibes any damage or if it cast a spell this is cancelled. Each second of the fade reduces by a %. Once it reachs the invisibility the treath on all thargets is reseted.

    Mirror Image: Creates 3 copies of the caster nearby. This spell instantly reset aggro on all enemies.


    Survivality:

    Mages are one of the most fragiles casters on the game. They wear cloth and have low HP compared to Warlocks for example and they do not heal themselfs. That said. They have quite amaizing survavility abilities for PVE.

    Ice Block: This spell makes the mage inmmune to all harmfull efects. They cannot cast any spell or move during the effect and last 10 seconds.
    If a mages get the aggro this is the ability they tend to use. Note that this do not reset the agro so all mobs should be picked befor the effect goes away if you are planing to keep the mage alive.

    Blink: Teleports the caster 20 yards forward (5 more if glyphed, but it's not very common). This is an instant cast and it's very usefull for going away very quick from AOE's like razorscale fire. 15 seconds cooldown.

    Magic Absorption: (Arcane tier 2 talent) Increases all resistances by 1 per level on rank 2. This is mostly a PVP talent but it can be usefull to keep the mages alive on heavy spell AOE fights

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
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    12
    This Thread is very usefull... Sticky please!!!!!


    Aditionally, there are some mistakes on the DK info. Since 3.1 some abilities were modified. I'll list them so it can be changed


    Frost Aura: This was changed to Improved Frost Presence. and damage done to you is decreased by an additional 1% per point in Frost Presence. (2% if 2/2)

    Blade Barrier: This was changed in 3.1 - Now it give a flat 1% damage reduction per talent point (for a total of 5% damage reduction). The mechanic it''s untouched.
    Last edited by zevah; 04-30-2009 at 01:18 AM.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Australia
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    other thing about dk inc dmg reduction also add bone shield

    Bone Shield
    1 UnholyInstant1 min cooldownThe Death Knight is surrounded by 4 whirling bones. While at least 1 bone remains, <he/she> takes 20% less damage from all sources and deals 2% more damage with all attacks, spells and abilities. Each damaging attack that lands consumes 1 bone. Lasts 1 min.

  11. #31
    for it to be stickied a few things would prob. need to happen.
    1. It be finished
    2. People would need to help to keep them updated with new patches

  12. #32
    A note on Warbringer:

    Warbringer allows all Charges (charge, intercept and intervene) to be used in defensive stance at any time.

    Also, big arms abilities and uses:

    Trauma- Your melee critical strikes increase the effectiveness of Bleed effects on the target by 30% for 15 sec. A must have for arms warriors and a melee heavy group that uses Bleeds (rogues?, Druids (mangle), warriors (deep wounds and rend is specific to Arms, also helps with prot threat.))

    Bloodfrenzy- Increases your melee attack speed by 10%. In addition your Rend and Deep Wounds abilities also increase all physical damage caused to that target by 4%.

    Commanding Presence- Increases the melee attack power bonus of your Battle Shout and the health bonus of your Commanding Shout by 25%. (this will bring Battle shout in line with Imp. Might and can be glyphed to increase duration from 2 min to 6 min, with use of the talent Booming Voice.)

    Mortal Strike- A vicious strike that deals weapon damage plus 380 and wounds the target, reducing the effectiveness of any healing by 50% for 10 sec. Great for bosses with self healing or outside heals, like Anub'arak during Phase 3, and Faction Champions.

    Bladestorm- Instantly Whirlwind up to 4 nearby targets and for the next 6 sec you will perform a whirlwind attack every 1 sec. While under the effects of Bladestorm, you can move but cannot perform any other abilities but you do not feel pity or remorse or fear and you cannot be stopped unless killed. An Arms warrior's biggest AoE ability. This generates a lot of threat, and canot be used during a fear or CC, but can be used to avoid the initial cast if needed. ALso is a DPS loss in Single-Target use.

    Fury skills:

    Commanding Presence- Increases the melee attack power bonus of your Battle Shout and the health bonus of your Commanding Shout by 25%. (this will bring Battle shout in line with Imp. Might and can be glyphed to increase duration from 2 min to 6 min, with use of the talent Booming Voice.)

    Rampage- Your melee critical hits cause you to go on a rampage, increasing ranged and melee critical hit chance of all party and raid members within 45 yds by 5%. Lasts 10 sec. Great ability to have for a physical damage heavy group. Does not stack with Leader of the Pack and is the exact same effect, with the exception that LotP is passive and does not require critical strike to activate.


    Furious Attacks (rank 1 and 2)- Your normal melee attacks have a chance to reduce all healing done to the target by 25/50% for 10 sec. This can stack up to 2 times. This occurs more often than Furious Attacks. Each rank of this increases healing negated by 25%. Most fury warriors will not run with this talent, but occasionally they will, whether for the rare PvE pruposes, or to run a hybrid PvE/PvP build. Mortal Strike, located in the arms tree, is superior to Furious Attacks, in the fact that it is a 100% chance to apply the debuff, and an Arms warrior will always have it avalaible.

    Improved Beserker Stance (rank 5)- Increases Strength by 20% and reduces threat caused by 10% while in Berserker Stance. A must-havefor fury warriors. Reduces threat generated greatly (10%) and increases damage done through strength.
    Last edited by Deathsupply; 11-20-2009 at 03:47 PM. Reason: adding as I have time

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