I've been lurking around for a bit reading on the forums and finally decided to register and post as my DK hit 80 this weekend. I'm beginning to understand the benefits of both the Frost vs. Unholy tanking. If I can't figure out a solution to my DK Frost build this week I might respec Unholy to try it out instead.
I did a few heroics this weekend and depending on the group composition I found myself holding aggro fine in some instances and in others not so much.
A few notes and questions for the more seasoned veteran tank DKs on this board:
- I'm choosing to spec out of Hungering Cold. I feel I do not really benefit much from it. Not really optimal for tanking, very nice for pvp, but not really viable and of course situational at best where I used it maybe 2-3 times and didn't really help as AoE from dps would break it anyways. Is my conclusion correct on Hungering Cold?
- Leaving the points in Outbreak. My AoE threat damage was not great and effective as it once was in regular instances. I expected Heroic' difficulty increased, but I didn't expect for my guildies to be pulling from me like they did. Part of this was due to no focus-fire and them attempting to AoE everything down, lol. I had to stop at one point and tell the party leader to toss me lead so I could prevent deaths my marking targets.... I know, I know, slow... but I'm still undergeared and they were all picking different targets. So I had to start marking targets (Which I always have done, except for that night) We never mark in Naxx trash pulls anyways, but there usually pally or warrior tanks of course. We currently have no DK tanks in our line up.
-Picked up DnD glyph to assist in AoE threat after the shananigans this weekend. Is that 20% percent really noticeable? I'm hoping it is. Does anyone who currently have this glyph, can confirm it's usefulness?
-I really want to pickup more Blood talents to help with my tank build and push more threat. Bladed Armor is one I've been considering. Should I move points around to get it and if so, which ones?
-If you have to choose between a BB or HB for building AoE threat, which would you prefer and why? Can't you just have both on the same rotation?
My rotation currently used is:
AoE - (Where am I really concerned) DnD, IT, PS, Pest, BB or DC followed by HB, OB, FS. I think my rotation is a bit screwy tbh.
Single Target - DnD, IT, PS, DC + HB, FS, OB (Not so much a concern, but still found myself having to occassionally taunt to regain aggro from our dps once or twice) I found my dps to be lack luster honestly though. I was pushing 1000 barely. I'm going to stop doing DnD on boss pulls. It's consuming too many runes.
I think it may be a combination of my gear vs. theirs, my rotations as using them currently and my talents in my current build not really placed correctly.
Please help! I don't want to have to change my toon's name because I can't live up to it
Last edited by Aggromachine; 02-16-2009 at 12:35 PM.
You were right for comming here to ask for some advice on your spec. It needs work.
First of all, you need Bladed Armor and\or Two-Handed Weapon Spec. While Bladed Armor scales very well with tank gear, two handed weapon spec also adds to your threat by a good amount.
Secondly, you need Killing Machine. It is now a flat 5 proc per minute, so two-hand tanks gain a great deal of threat by constantly critting 7k HB's and 7k Frost Strikes.
Where can you find these points? Get rid of Chillblains and Endless Winter. Once you're threat is high enough, you won't need abilities like Chillblains. I find that this was only generally helpful when I was undergeared tanking heroics, and mobs I lost threat on would "try" to run away. I then realized that I wasn't undergeared, I was spec'd wrong.
Outbreak is a HUGE waste of talent points. DPS or Tank, this talent lacks any real improvement to damage that makes using any talent points worth using here.
Hungering Cold is shit, and honestly, I really hope blizzard swaps hungering cold with killing machine. The ONLY raid that I find it of any use, and the same goes for Chillblains, is Gluth add kiting.
Being spec'd in to morbidity is a good thing, but you have to ask yourself this. Do you find yourself needing DnD every 15 seconds? I almost never do. The only exception I ever find to it, is Noth, where the waves closer to him grounding come closer and closer together. But with HB, a good rotation, and DnD on a 20 second cooldown, I have no trouble. You can, if you choose, take 1 point out of this.
Not being spec'd in to Blood of the North can hurt your TPS a good amount. You want death runs. You want them because it allows you to be more flexible with your rotations. As an encounter changes, so can your rotations. It also allows you to be able to use HB (or oblit) every time it is up.
Finally, if you have problems with your single target threat, macro Rune Strike to Frost Strike, use Oblit more, and HB less.
What will your spec look like after all this advice? Probably something close to this.
Edit: I just looked at your rotations, and they also need work. For AoE, you will want DnD-IT-Deathchill (if it's up and KM didnt proc)-Blood Tap-HB-BS-BS-HB. You can't lost aggro after this combo, as long as you keep working with DnD and HB, and rotating your Rune Strikes\Frost Strikes on mobs. Don't use Plague Strike or Pest, until at least your first rotation is completed. Why? Plague Strike is so low in damage, it is really a waste of a GCD until you have your snap aggro. Pest is unnecessary unless you're trying to spread the Plague Strike. If HB crits on the mob you have Frost Fever on, all the mobs around within 10 yards will get crit, reguardless if they have Frost Fever on them or not, for snap aggro, dont waste time on pest until your second rotation.
For single target, I go with IT>PS>Deathchill>HB>BS>BS>HB\Oblit. You can easily get 2 HB's in per IT rotation, without epidemic. You don't use DnD here because DnD is high threat over time. You want good snap aggro, so you go to your more direct high damage abilities. I will use Oblit only when KM isn't proc'd, otherwise when KM is proc'd I use HB.
The obvious RP dump here is frost strike and rune strike.
Thank you for your input and your suggestions Addohm. Last night I ended up doing a respec following what you had outlined in the example and I have to say when I used it in the test dummies my dps went from 900-1000 previously up to 1350-1400.
I was happy with the initial test and I will be putting this spec to use when I run heroics tonight. Hopefully I can squeeze in a dungeon run or two before I have to jump on my main to play healer. I absolutely love and appreciate the differences in tanking and healing and look forward to learning more about tanking.
On a sidenote, what glyphs do you use currently for tanking?
Oh also forgot to mention, the crit percentage is insane with this build you presented. If I remember correctily, IT was critting well over 50% of the time, HB close to 60-70% of the time, FS also well over 50% of the time. I loved it!
Last edited by Aggromachine; 02-17-2009 at 08:51 AM.
Reason: Added additional note